39 replies to this topic

[AHF]

jerrywest, on 20 August 2009 - 09:52 PM, said:

The only significant difference is that Teague is much stronger than Harris was. Teague bench pressed 13 times, but Harris could do it only 5 times. Actually Teagues seems much stronger than many big and strong guards (sort by bench). Acie Law only had 8 and Rose had 10. Wade 9 and big Stuckey 14.

LOL - Amare,JJ,Marvin,Smoove bench pressed 12 times.

With that kind of strength Teague might be able to guard shooting guards and play effective defense next to Crawford who is a bad defender on shooting guards but an adequate defender on point guards. Since Crawford+Bibby combo would be one of the worst defensive combo ever, Teague's strength might be the key that will help him stay out of Woody's dog house next year.

I think that is really overstating the strength component. Guards usually do best on the bench press because the longer the arms of the player, the harder it is to do a bench press. I would not remotely expect Teague to be able to guard most SGs in the NBA.

[jerrywest]

AHF, on 21 August 2009 - 09:51 AM, said:

I think that is really overstating the strength component. Guards usually do best on the bench press because the longer the arms of the player, the harder it is to do a bench press. I would not remotely expect Teague to be able to guard most SGs in the NBA.

Teagues arms are long. Although he is 1.5" shorter than Harris, his arms are so long that he makes it up in all the measurements. I guess even with shorter arms Harris bench pressed much less than Teague. Your observation suggests that the strength difference is even bigger than the number here.

If you sort all top 30 picks by "bench", you'll see that big guys bench press much better than the small guys. No one under 6-3 are in the top 20.

I see a pattern with age though, naturally. I think that is the reason Amare/Josh had 12. Marvin has those unusually long arms.

Teague's wingspan is 1" bigger than Acie. He has better measurments than many point guards and shooting guards who routinely guard shooting guards.

Edited by jerrywest, 21 August 2009 - 10:14 AM.

[AHF]

jerrywest, on 21 August 2009 - 10:10 AM, said:

Teagues arms are long. Although he is 1.5" shorter than Harris, his arms are so long that he makes it up in all the measurements. I guess even with shorter arms Harris bench pressed much less than Teague. Your observation suggests that the strength difference is even bigger than the number here.

Teague is much stronger than Devin Harris who is a skinny PG who couldn't guard a SG if his life depended on it. I don't think you can envision Teague checking guys like Joe Johnson, Vince Carter, Jason Richardson, JR Smith, etc.

He just doesn't have the size to lead me to expect he can defend the SG spot.

[jy23]

I don't care about the strength, the thing that has me happy is the speed. Harris is quick, very quick, and if teague is around the same then that is going to be GREAT! I don't know if he's as fast with the ball (which is really what matters) but right now it looks good!

[BusBoyIsBack]

jy21, on 21 August 2009 - 10:44 AM, said:

I don't care about the strength, the thing that has me happy is the speed. Harris is quick, very quick, and if teague is around the same then that is going to be GREAT! I don't know if he's as fast with the ball (which is really what matters) but right now it looks good!

If Jeff Teague is even close to as quick off the dribble as Devin Harris is, then this team will be legit contenders in a couple years. He just has to work on shooting just like Harris did which is why he really took his game to another level

[gsuteke]

jerrywest, on 20 August 2009 - 09:52 PM, said:

The only significant difference is that Teague is much stronger than Harris was. Teague bench pressed 13 times, but Harris could do it only 5 times. Actually Teagues seems much stronger than many big and strong guards (sort by bench). Acie Law only had 8 and Rose had 10. Wade 9 and big Stuckey 14.

LOL - Amare,JJ,Marvin,Smoove bench pressed 12 times.

With that kind of strength Teague might be able to guard shooting guards and play effective defense next to Crawford who is a bad defender on shooting guards but an adequate defender on point guards. Since Crawford+Bibby combo would be one of the worst defensive combo ever, Teague's strength might be the key that will help him stay out of Woody's dog house next year.

They're pushing 225, right?

[jerrywest]

AHF, on 21 August 2009 - 10:31 AM, said:

Teague is much stronger than Devin Harris who is a skinny PG who couldn't guard a SG if his life depended on it. I don't think you can envision Teague checking guys like Joe Johnson, Vince Carter, Jason Richardson, JR Smith, etc.

He just doesn't have the size to lead me to expect he can defend the SG spot.

We all knew Teague is super quick, but I, at least, didn't realize how strong he is. We really needed a strong point guard to play with weak Crawford, a superior shooting guard who is much better at guarding point guards. I think Bibby+Crawford is a defensive disaster.

What gets me excited is that I can see Crawford+Teague combo might work on the defensive end. I don't think Teague or Crawford or just about any point guard can guard the bulldog shooting guards of the NBA, but they can play adequate on the back up shooting guards. On the offensive end Teague+Crawford will light up just about any combo backups in the NBA.

I can see all combinations of JJ/Bibby/Crawford/Mo/Teague work well on the defensive end except Bibby/Crawford. Until I realized Teague is bigger and stronger than his height, I thought our back court has too many combinations that do not work. Now I know why the Hawks aren't looking for a 3rd/4th string point guard.

Edited by jerrywest, 21 August 2009 - 11:22 AM.

[Johnnybravo4]

AHF, on 21 August 2009 - 09:51 AM, said:

I think that is really overstating the strength component. Guards usually do best on the bench press because the longer the arms of the player, the harder it is to do a bench press. I would not remotely expect Teague to be able to guard most SGs in the NBA.

You know that is a myth right? Many offensive lineman in the NFL are well over 6'4 and if you ever see the worlds strongest man competitions, they are usually in the 6'3 to 6'6 range. In a bench press, the arms are tertiary. The shoulders and pectorals do most of the work.

[DrReality]

Teague's quickness is a huge asset because we typically get lit up by quick pg's. Be nice to have someone who can stay with them.

[jy23]

DrReality, on 21 August 2009 - 12:48 PM, said:

Teague's quickness is a huge asset because we typically get lit up by quick pg's. Be nice to have someone who can stay with them.

You're so right, Parker kills us all the time. Having someone with quickness like that is going to help out SO much

[hawksfanatic]

gsuteke, on 21 August 2009 - 11:00 AM, said:

They're pushing 225, right?

You are thinking of the NFL. NBA benches 185.

[AHF]

Johnnybravo4, on 21 August 2009 - 11:38 AM, said:

You know that is a myth right? Many offensive lineman in the NFL are well over 6'4 and if you ever see the worlds strongest man competitions, they are usually in the 6'3 to 6'6 range. In a bench press, the arms are tertiary. The shoulders and pectorals do most of the work.

I am entirely willing to believe that is a myth but still won't change my opinion. Does anyone think these guys should be good at guarding SGs?

Toney Douglas 15 reps
Ty Lawson 14 reps
Jack McClinton 14 reps
Mike Conley 13 reps
Sean Singletary 17 reps
Deron Williams 15 reps
Will Bynum 15 reps
Anthony Roberson 14 reps
Jameer Nelson 15 reps

etc.

[AHF]

Here are some of the reasons I figured it was true that the press was an advantage for smaller, more compact players versus the ones with longer arms:

Al Jefferson 3 reps
Danny Granger 10 reps
Brandan Wright 2 reps
LeMarcus Aldridge 8 reps
Al Thornton 9 reps
Spencer Hawes 9 reps
DeAndre Jordan 8 reps
Anthony Randolph 7 reps
Earl Clark 5 reps

I have trouble seeing Will Bynum or Mike Conley as dramatically stronger than all these guys.

I guess this just goes to emphasize that bench press may not be a great predictor for who a guy can guard in the NBA.

[jy23]

AHF, on 21 August 2009 - 05:22 PM, said:

Here are some of the reasons I figured it was true that the press was an advantage for smaller, more compact players versus the ones with longer arms:

Al Jefferson 3 reps
Danny Granger 10 reps
Brandan Wright 2 reps
LeMarcus Aldridge 8 reps
Al Thornton 9 reps
Spencer Hawes 9 reps
DeAndre Jordan 8 reps
Anthony Randolph 7 reps
Earl Clark 5 reps

I have trouble seeing Will Bynum or Mike Conley as dramatically stronger than all these guys.

I guess this just goes to emphasize that bench press may not be a great predictor for who a guy can guard in the NBA.

I do think that the likes of Deron Wiliams is stronger than most of the guys you have on that list up there. I said MOST! Being big doesn't mean that you're strong, Aldridge, Randolph, Clark, Wright, you think Deron isn't stronger than these guys??????????

[jerrywest]

AHF, on 21 August 2009 - 05:12 PM, said:

I am entirely willing to believe that is a myth but still won't change my opinion. Does anyone think these guys should be good at guarding SGs?
Toney Douglas 15 reps
Ty Lawson 14 reps
Jack McClinton 14 reps
Mike Conley 13 reps
Sean Singletary 17 reps
Deron Williams 15 reps
Will Bynum 15 reps
Anthony Roberson 14 reps
Jameer Nelson 15 reps
etc.

If they have the wingspan and standing reach, their strength would give them a great tool to guard shooting guards. Teague has the wingspan and standing reach.