19 replies to this topic

[khaos7]

I think we'll be worse for a number of reasons:

1) We're implementing a new offensive and defensive system. I believe we'll have more turnovers (last year we were towards the top of the league on the positive end of the turnover to assist ratio) than we had in years past when we really protected the ball and we ran a ton of isolations. Also, we'll be playing more man to man, which won't allow Al and Josh (and Joe to a degree) to mask some of our glaring weaknesses on defense.

2) While we addressed coaching, we didn't address personel. If you go back to my older posts, you'll know that I'm not a Woody supporter. I thought is was one of the problems with this team. The key word is one. I have a hard time believing Woody was the only reason why this time got blown out and gave up leads in the 4th quarter. I believe that some of the players on this roster should have been held accountable for the last two playoff debacles. Perhaps Drew will get more out of them. Maybe the new systems will make them play harder. I don't know. The only thing I can go by is what I've seen up to this point.

3) The Eastern Conference has improved. Gimme games such as the Wizards (with John Wall) will become increasingly harder. Pesky teams such as Chicago (with Boozer), a healthy Bucks team and the Knicks (who gave us fits with a rag tag bunch last year and have added Ama're ) have gotten better. We all know what happened down in South Beach. And Orlando is still Orlando. And do we really expect to sweep Boston a third year in a row?

Given all three variables, I believe we will still be a playoff team, but I think this roster has tapped out on its potential. One man's opinion.

[Wretch]

khaos7, on 07 September 2010 - 02:36 PM, said:

I think we'll be worse for a number of reasons:

1) We're implementing a new offensive and defensive system. I believe we'll have more turnovers (last year we were towards the top of the league on the positive end of the turnover to assist ratio) than we had in years past when we really protected the ball and we ran a ton of isolations. Also, we'll be playing more man to man, which won't allow Al and Josh (and Joe to a degree) to mask some of our glaring weaknesses on defense.

2) While we addressed coaching, we didn't address personel. If you go back to my older posts, you'll know that I'm not a Woody supporter. I thought is was one of the problems with this team. The key word is one. I have a hard time believing Woody was the only reason why this time got blown out and gave up leads in the 4th quarter. I believe that some of the players on this roster should have been held accountable for the last two playoff debacles. Perhaps Drew will get more out of them. Maybe the new systems will make them play harder. I don't know. The only thing I can go by is what I've seen up to this point.

3) The Eastern Conference has improved. Gimme games such as the Wizards (with John Wall) will become increasingly harder. Pesky teams such as Chicago (with Boozer), a healthy Bucks team and the Knicks (who gave us fits with a rag tag bunch last year and have added Ama're ) have gotten better. We all know what happened down in South Beach. And Orlando is still Orlando. And do we really expect to sweep Boston a third year in a row?

Given all three variables, I believe we will still be a playoff team, but I think this roster has tapped out on its potential. One man's opinion.

...wow, was about to reply but these are all three of my points. lol If we had axed Woody when BK wanted to (and when I had enough of him as well), I think we'd be better off right now. I don't think record-wise, we'll be the same and definitely not better. However, I think we'll be MUCH more competitive in the big games. MUCH more by the end of the season. In the end, I think that the East has just gotten better and we'll lose a few more games because of it.

[AHF]

khaos7, on 07 September 2010 - 02:36 PM, said:

I think we'll be worse for a number of reasons:

1) We're implementing a new offensive and defensive system. I believe we'll have more turnovers (last year we were towards the top of the league on the positive end of the turnover to assist ratio) than we had in years past when we really protected the ball and we ran a ton of isolations. Also, we'll be playing more man to man, which won't allow Al and Josh (and Joe to a degree) to mask some of our glaring weaknesses on defense.

2) While we addressed coaching, we didn't address personel. If you go back to my older posts, you'll know that I'm not a Woody supporter. I thought is was one of the problems with this team. The key word is one. I have a hard time believing Woody was the only reason why this time got blown out and gave up leads in the 4th quarter. I believe that some of the players on this roster should have been held accountable for the last two playoff debacles. Perhaps Drew will get more out of them. Maybe the new systems will make them play harder. I don't know. The only thing I can go by is what I've seen up to this point.

3) The Eastern Conference has improved. Gimme games such as the Wizards (with John Wall) will become increasingly harder. Pesky teams such as Chicago (with Boozer), a healthy Bucks team and the Knicks (who gave us fits with a rag tag bunch last year and have added Ama're ) have gotten better. We all know what happened down in South Beach. And Orlando is still Orlando. And do we really expect to sweep Boston a third year in a row?

Given all three variables, I believe we will still be a playoff team, but I think this roster has tapped out on its potential. One man's opinion.

Good post.

My prediction: worse regular season record better playoff performance.

[benhillboy]

I hope I'm terribly wrong, but I expect us to be a considerably lesser team. Yeah, I'm one of the few who actually liked Woody. I think he was a steadying force for us despite numerous reports that he "lost" the guys. What was our longest losing streak last year (Orlando playoff debacle notwithstanding)? Three? I just was much more comfortable with Woody flashing that ring every now and then. That meant something to me. He was a part of that Juggernaunt Pistons staff that trashed The Mighty Lakers + a couple washed up H.O.F.ers, then went on to help improve his squad EVERY SINGLE YEAR!!! Of course, I know the record improvement thing would've likely stopped this season, but now our coach is so unproven, let alone our "best" player who I've well documented my disdain for and who is reasonably expected to have a considerable drop-off by everybody with common sense of age trends and his workload. I'll have to go on recent (like the past 20 years) trends and common sense again in saying that our rookie isn't going to contribute much to speak of.

I guess we have been conditioned. Our team has made strides over the years, but it's only a matter of time before this FRANCHISE has us back on par with the Clippers of the world, and it starts with unholy contracts like the one given to that guy while hanging Craw Dog and Big Al out to dry while the rest of the Conference is busting their butts to improve, or at least shake things up a bit. I hope I'm wrong. I'll be satisfied from the season's start if Josh can develop a remotely servicable jimmy and Marvin finds himself and realizes he has a pretty good contract that he should try to live up to before retirement.

On a side note, yall saw the news on Rumeal Robinson? He's a regular White-Collar career criminal that will be hidden for some time. Damn.

Edited by benhillboy, 09 September 2010 - 05:40 PM.

[thecampster]

benhillboy, on 09 September 2010 - 05:36 PM, said:

I hope I'm terribly wrong, but I expect us to be a considerably lesser team. Yeah, I'm one of the few who actually liked Woody. I think he was a steadying force for us despite numerous reports that he "lost" the guys. What was our longest losing streak last year (Orlando playoff debacle notwithstanding)? Three? I just was much more comfortable with Woody flashing that ring every now and then. That meant something to me. He was a part of that Juggernaunt Pistons staff that trashed The Mighty Lakers + a couple washed up H.O.F.ers, then went on to help improve his squad EVERY SINGLE YEAR!!! Of course, I know the record improvement thing would've likely stopped this season, but now our coach is so unproven, let alone our "best" player who I've well documented my disdain for and who is reasonably expected to have a considerable drop-off by everybody with common sense of age trends and his workload. I'll have to go on recent (like the past 20 years) trends and common sense again in saying that our rookie isn't going to contribute much to speak of.

I guess we have been conditioned. Our team has made strides over the years, but it's only a matter of time before this FRANCHISE has us back on par with the Clippers of the world, and it starts with unholy contracts like the one given to that guy while hanging Craw Dog and Big Al out to dry while the rest of the Conference is busting their butts to improve, or at least shake things up a bit. I hope I'm wrong. I'll be satisfied from the season's start if Josh can develop a remotely servicable jimmy and Marvin finds himself and realizes he has a pretty good contract that he should try to live up to before retirement.

On a side note, yall saw the news on Rumeal Robinson? He's a regular White-Collar career criminal that will be hidden for some time. Damn.

If you track the record of improvement, there are 2 things you can point to that have very little to do with the coach. The first, is that every year of the "improvement" we added players that were upgrades over the previous players. Second was the maturation of those players. The best example I can give is the year we added Bibby. We finished the year 15-17 after the Mike Bibby signing and that included losing our last 3 games. Before that we were 22-28 and on pace to miss the playoffs again with a 35-47 record. The Bibby signing left us 37-42 with 3 games left. The next season we came together with Bibby as a point guard.

Here is the statistical improvement and the team transactions to the right.

Year 1 2004-2005 - 13-69 Roster included - Antoine Walker, Al Harrington, Kenny Anderson, Boris diaw, Jason Collier, Josh Childress, Josh Smith, Jon Barry, Kevin Willis, Pedrag Drobnjak, Anthony Miller, Royal Ivey

Year 2 2005-2006 - 26-56 Players added - Marvin Williams, Salim Stoudemire, Joe Johnson, Zaza Pachulia. (that was a 10 game improvement..those 4 players)

Year 3 2006-2007 - 30-52 Players added - Sheldon Williams, Solomon Jones, Lorenzen Wright, Speedy Claxton (ouch). Remember that the Josh's and Marvin, johnson, salim and Diaw are a year older....only worth 4 games. This year is an indictment as player maturity of those 6 players alone should have accounted for something.

Year 4 2007-2008 - 37-45 Players added - Al Horford, Acie Law, Mario West, Mike Bibby. All previous talent matured, added this, 7 game improvement.

Year 5 2008-2009 - 47-35 Players added - Maurice Evans, Flip Murray, Randolph Morris. Josh, Marvin, Al all mature plus a full season with Bibby and this is worth 10 games.

Year 6 2009-2010 - 53-29 Players added - Jamal Crawford, Jeff Teague.

When you look at the steady building of the team, you realize that this team would have improved regardless of who coached it. Many times I perceived Woodson as a hinderance and not a help. Go through the list and only a few impact level players left...Diaw, Harrington and Walker.....Almost the entire team is drafted or traded for in getting rid of garbage.

Edited by thecampster, 10 September 2010 - 12:33 AM.