Can anyone remember a better GM performance than Sund this offseason and if so who/when?

[Guest Walter]

With the signing of Joe Smith I have to give Sund the crown. During an offseason when so many things could have gone bad given our many FAs and Sund had so little to work with in terms of tradable players and picks, I think most if not all would think Sund hit it out of the park. You could not expect any better IMO. However, perhaps some of you recall better. If so, I'm all ears because I would like to put what I think is a phenomenal offseason in perspective.

Only the trade of Andersen (who apparently wanted mor PT than we could promise) for a 2nd rder was a slight bummer, but Joe Smith might be a better fit for us as a true BU Pf. I'm stoked!

W

[gsuteke]

I had the passing thought yesterday as I left work and saw the Joe Smith news to post something of this nature.

When in doubt always ask yourself WWBKD?

What Would Billy Knight Do?

Sheeeesh. Nice job Rick Sund.

[T21]

I've said it before, and I'll say it again... this man is makin' us believers again! He's very, very competent, has great understanding of basketball, economics, finance... in one word Hawks are in safe hands!

[Sasquatch]

I had the passing thought yesterday as I left work and saw the Joe Smith news to post something of this nature.

When in doubt always ask yourself WWBKD?

What Would Billy Knight Do?

Sheeeesh. Nice job Rick Sund.

"WWBKD"

Wow.

You know... This is why I have the utmost respect for Sund as a GM and a person. It would have been very easy for him to try to propel this narrative. However, he has been above it from the start. This is a GM that is focused on winning not demonization.

1) It would have been all too easy for him to come in and say, "you know what? The talkin heads and fringe lunatics are right. BK stinks and was worthless. I'm gonna blow this team up. "

2) Nope! This GENERAL did the opposite. He refused to let people throw sand in his eye. He made his own analysis and concluded that the most important thing was to keep this thing going. DESPITE THE LUNATIC FRINGE ASSERTIONS.

3) Made no attempt to "put his own stamp on the team". Here is a guy that is so confident and has such vision he has resigned every starter that BK brought here (and left them as the starter). Furthermore, he has made his number one priority to be resigning or retaining the rights to as many of BK's players as possible.

4) In his own way has given the utmost props to BK without stirring controversy and hate (despite opportunistic hateration beyond his control). Here is a guy that undoubtedly gets one of the highest GM grades this summer and DESERVES it! Yet every new acquisition that he has brought in is a bench player. This guy treats BK picks like gold. He is selfless. I respect him for that.

As for the original question. That's an easy one. Nobody has done a better job than Sund.

I have another question though.

Name one GM in the NBA whose draft picks and aquisitions have been retained on the roster as much as BK's: AND the team continues to get better, AND have no character issues. Name one GM that has retained the rights to as many of his own players as BK's (not to mention having another GM come in and retain them).

Great job Sund!

Great job Billy Knight!

Truly. The thing speaks for itself!

[gsuteke]

Oh dear lord -

If BK could draft worth a damn the Hawks would be Championship contenders right now.

[xhawk]

Sund definitely has an overall picture of the future of this team and he is going out and getting it done. And at the same time, he adds veterans each year to win in the present. Going forward, he still has the Joe extension and at least 3 more players to add to the roster, so he is not done.

[gsuteke]

1) It would have been all too easy for him to come in and say, "you know what? The talkin heads and fringe lunatics are right. BK stinks and was worthless. I'm gonna blow this team up. "

2) Nope! This GENERAL did the opposite. He refused to let people throw sand in his eye. He made his own analysis and concluded that the most important thing was to keep this thing going. DESPITE THE LUNATIC FRINGE ASSERTIONS.

Since you brought it up. Let's talk about a lunatic fringe assertion.

Great job Billy Knight!

Truly. The thing speaks for itself!

If the Hawks had the lineup of

Igoudala

Al Jefferson

Deron Williams

Brandon Roy

Do you not think we could have gotten Pau Gasol ourselves 2 years back for a late 1st rounder like the Lakers did? Those are just the guys in order of draft whiff that Billy Knight didn't pick.

The ones he did pick have either been all jettisoned off or are being signed to "steals" on their 2nd contracts by Rick Sund. If that in and of itself isn't a damning indictment of Billy Knight I don't know what is.

BK did it "his way" though. Back to lunatic fringe assertions - yeah that guy was great.

[Admin]

Since you brought it up. Let's talk about a lunatic fringe assertion.

If the Hawks had the lineup of

Igoudala

Al Jefferson

Deron Williams

Brandon Roy

Do you not think we could have gotten Pau Gasol ourselves 2 years back for a late 1st rounder like the Lakers did? Those are just the guys in order of draft whiff that Billy Knight didn't pick.

The ones he did pick have either been all jettisoned off or are being signed to "steals" on their 2nd contracts by Rick Sund. If that in and of itself isn't a damning indictment of Billy Knight I don't know what is.

BK did it "his way" though. Back to lunatic fringe assertions - yeah that guy was great.

This argument cracks me up. You have to realize that it's unlikely we would have drafted in the same position and it's quite possible that we'd have LESS talent now if he had made better choices early on since we undoubtedly would have won more games and would have been drafting further down in the lottery. It's also highly likely that we wouldn't have traded for JJ since he was brought here to be our PG and God only knows who we might have traded for. Anyways, that fantasy lineup is just that, fantasy.

Like it or not we are where we are because of the moves made by BK and while it's possible we could be better now with better moves earlier on it's just as possible that we could be worse.

Back to the original topic great job by Sund!!!

[gsuteke]

This argument cracks me up. You have to realize that it's unlikely we would have drafted in the same position and it's quite possible that we'd have LESS talent now if he had made better choices early on since we undoubtedly would have won more games and would have been drafting further down in the lottery. It's also highly likely that we wouldn't have traded for JJ since he was brought here to be our PG and God only knows who we might have traded for. Anyways, that fantasy lineup is just that, fantasy.

Like it or not we are where we are because of the moves made by BK and while it's possible we could be better now with better moves earlier on it's just as possible that we could be worse.

Back to the original topic great job by Sund!!!

Iggy and Al Jefferson were on the board so we could have had them - no arguments can be made to the contrary. Now if you replace Chillz and Smoove with Iggy and Jefferson the team wouldn't have been that much better during their Rookie years and both players were picked 3 slots down. You would have seen another crappy season the following year and likely a top 4 pick. . There's your Deron Wiliams/Chris Paul.

We may not have drafted in the top 5 the following year - I'll give you that and only that. We likely would have had a lottery pick that season as well though because I didn't even have to trade for Joe to get that squad.

Back to the original point I made about getting these players to resign at "bargain basement prices." As I said that is and of itself an indictment of BK's ineptitude when it came to drafting basketball players. Sure teams were probably interested in Marvin Williams - but they weren't going to break the bank for the guy or shake up their team to put themselves in a position to get him like they would have to get an All-Star caliber young player. Hence we got a deal on him. Same thing happened last year with Smoove. Hell Chillz couldn't find a team to give him a decent enough deal that the Hawks wouldn't match. That's why he's in Europe - many won't talk about the elephant in the corner with Chillz but he didn't get a high level NBA offer because he's just not that attractive. Now he's in Greece. We won't talk about Shelden Williams who should be out of the league right now.

I like our players just as much as anyone else because they're our players, however I can take a step back and see we could have had a much better team if BK could pick players.

I hate that Sasquatch has turned this thread into a Pro-BK discussion because I've got nothing but praise for Sund as well - however I'm not going to let the BK praise go unanswered.

Edited August 15, 2009 by gsuteke

[NJHAWK]

With the signing of Joe Smith I have to give Sund the crown. During an offseason when so many things could have gone bad given our many FAs and Sund had so little to work with in terms of tradable players and picks, I think most if not all would think Sund hit it out of the park. You could not expect any better IMO. However, perhaps some of you recall better. If so, I'm all ears because I would like to put what I think is a phenomenal offseason in perspective.

Only the trade of Andersen (who apparently wanted mor PT than we could promise) for a 2nd rder was a slight bummer, but Joe Smith might be a better fit for us as a true BU Pf. I'm stoked!

W

The offseasons in Hawkville that come to mind are the ones where we got Joe Johnson for Diaw and two late 1st rounders, the offseason where we got Smitty and Grant Long for a declining Willis, the offseason where we got Nique for John Drew lol, the offseason we signed Deke and the offseason where we got Mookie for Rumeal. Will Crawford or Joe Smith turn out to be as good as any of them, ahhh no.

[DrReality]

BK played hardball with contracts, but his demeanor seemed to piss people off. Sund is much more mild manored.

[AtlHomer]

With the signing of Joe Smith I have to give Sund the crown. During an offseason when so many things could have gone bad given our many FAs and Sund had so little to work with in terms of tradable players and picks, I think most if not all would think Sund hit it out of the park. You could not expect any better IMO. However, perhaps some of you recall better. If so, I'm all ears because I would like to put what I think is a phenomenal offseason in perspective.

Only the trade of Andersen (who apparently wanted mor PT than we could promise) for a 2nd rder was a slight bummer, but Joe Smith might be a better fit for us as a true BU Pf. I'm stoked!

W

Well said!

I asked a question before that I'll ask again. Will the media give Sund that same credit and love that Dmitroff has gotten for the Falcons?

[MaceCase]

We can't forget that this offseason and the Hawks alltogether have served as redemption to Sund whom many questioned during his arrival after his Seattle days. How fitting that we are seeing both the rebirth of the franchise and our GM at the same time.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

I think people need to hold off on the Sund "love fest" until we see how Crawford and Joe Smith play in a Hawks uniform. When it's all said and done, the mistake MAY be that he let Flip get away from us. And we'll see just how good David Andersen is in Houston. Let's just see how this plays out.

His moves look good on paper though. But if the Crawford move blows up in our face, then his offseason was a disappointment.

Please don't misinterpret this as "I wish we had Billy Knight back", because it isn't that. LOL . . lord knows it isn't that at all.

[buckeye242424]

I think people need to hold off on the Sund "love fest" until we see how Crawford and Joe Smith play in a Hawks uniform. When it's all said and done, the mistake MAY be that he let Flip get away from us. And we'll see just how good David Andersen is in Houston. Let's just see how this plays out.

His moves look good on paper though. But if the Crawford move blows up in our face, then his offseason was a disappointment.

Please don't misinterpret this as "I wish we had Billy Knight back", because it isn't that. LOL . . lord knows it isn't that at all.

Why not celebrate what he has done? Take away Crawford and Joe Smith, and it's still been productive. We haven't lost any key members of the team that has brought us some much needed change, Bibs, Marv, Zaza. Sure, the Crawford move may not work out like we all hope, but right now, it looks like a great move. Getting him for essentially nothing. Keeping the "core" guys while still trying to get better has been nothing but positive.

[exodus]

Assuming Walter is talking only about Hawks GMs (which i believe he is) then this offseason has certainly been a strong one. it could have very easily been a disaster given the number of free agents we had, the lack of cap space, and the economic realities that the owners faced.

Interesting that Joe Smith and Marvin will be on the same team. Joe Smith has been a disappointment relative to his draft position but has had a solid career and is still a valued player in his mid-30s. I see Marvin and Joe Smith in a similar light.

[Final_quest]

The offseasons in Hawkville that come to mind are the ones where we got Joe Johnson for Diaw and two late 1st rounders, the offseason where we got Smitty and Grant Long for a declining Willis, the offseason where we got Nique for John Drew lol, the offseason we signed Deke and the offseason where we got Mookie for Rumeal. Will Crawford or Joe Smith turn out to be as good as any of them, ahhh no.

Great point. This is basketball, and it's about getting all stars on your roster more than any other sport. Sund did an excellent job, but it's hard to think a franchise best offseason being one where they resigned players already on their roster. My other point to this offseason is that due to the economy teams have not spending like in years past. In a sense we got lucky that we needed to resign a lot of players at this exact point in time. This has made Sund's negotiation skills seem better than they probably are. Also, time will tell if we will look back favorably on these signings. I'd be surprised if in a year or two we won't be bemoaning some of these contracts.

Not trying to sound negative, or even play devil's advocate, but just saying that I disagree that this offseason will be remembered as best ever for our franchise.

[txsting]

With the signing of Joe Smith I have to give Sund the crown. During an offseason when so many things could have gone bad given our many FAs and Sund had so little to work with in terms of tradable players and picks, I think most if not all would think Sund hit it out of the park. You could not expect any better IMO. However, perhaps some of you recall better. If so, I'm all ears because I would like to put what I think is a phenomenal offseason in perspective.

Only the trade of Andersen (who apparently wanted mor PT than we could promise) for a 2nd rder was a slight bummer, but Joe Smith might be a better fit for us as a true BU Pf. I'm stoked!

W

Would have much rather rolled with DA, but it may not have been possible to get him here in the backup role. I guess we won't know unless someone can get DA to answer that question himself.

To your point, real nice job by Sund. He may not be done yet.

[HawkItus]

Pete Babcock-

Smitty for Isiah Rider/Jimmy Jackson

10 Jason Terry (G) United States Atlanta

17 Cal Bowdler (PF) United States Atlanta Hawks (from Sacramento)

20 Dion Glover (SG) United States Atlanta Hawks (from Detroit)

21 Jeff Foster (PF/C) United States Atlanta Hawks (traded to Golden State)

27 Jumaine Jones (SF) United States Atlanta Hawks (from Portland via Detroit)

Now that my friend was a GM getting it done.

[coachx]

With the signing of Joe Smith I have to give Sund the crown. During an offseason when so many things could have gone bad given our many FAs and Sund had so little to work with in terms of tradable players and picks, I think most if not all would think Sund hit it out of the park. You could not expect any better IMO. However, perhaps some of you recall better. If so, I'm all ears because I would like to put what I think is a phenomenal offseason in perspective.

Only the trade of Andersen (who apparently wanted mor PT than we could promise) for a 2nd rder was a slight bummer, but Joe Smith might be a better fit for us as a true BU Pf. I'm stoked!

W

Excellent points Walter.

This is the best job I have seen a Hawks GM do in one off season who had limited to no cap room to sign other team's free agents and who did not have a lottery pick.

In my opinion, Sund did as well as anyone of could have hoped for given the hand he was dealt with the 19th pick and no room under the cap to target big name free agents from other teams.

Danny Ainge had one hell of an off season when he brought in Allen and Garnett which netted then a title. The Lakers had one of those years when they brought in Shaq and a couple of years before when the traded for Kobe Bryant.

All in all............the addition of 2 quality, proven veterans in Joe Smith and Jamall Crawford, without losing any of our own top 3 free agetnts (Marvin, Bibby, ZaZa) is nothing short of outstanding. The pick of Teague in the late teens of the first round looks like an excellent selection as well.

Props to Sund and the ASG !