Are we just bad negotiators?

[JSmooooove]

Can someone please explain to me how Teague lands us the 12th pick but...

Ibaka is apparently worth the 11th pick, Oladipo, and Ilysaova. 

Both are on expiring contracts. Ibaka has never even made an All Star game and has been steadily declining for years.

Does anyone have a way to justify this? I feel like we just got schooled. Maybe it's just the Magic are even bigger idiots than we are. 

[Lurker]

If what Vivlamore said is correct, they are. They wanted Sabonis but weren't able to trade up one measly pick for him.

[ViewsFromTheSquawk]

We're not bad negotiators. The Ilbaka was was simply for Orlando to fill a need they've been needing to fix for going on 3 seasons. Ilbaka gives them a shot blocker to go alongside the frontcourts of Gordon and Vucevic so they can finally have some defensive toughness. What they offered for Teague at the trade deadline only goes to prove that they believe they had a bigger need which turned out to be Serge. 

[Bankingitbig]

Teague plays a position that is filled with available talent, whereas Ibaka, as a somewhat stretch 4 that can defend, is a hot commodity. Everyone knew we were trying to trade Teague, whereas I am sure OKC would have been content to just keep Ibaka since they were so close to a championship. We had no leverage. There is probably a handful of places where Teague would realistically sign longterm (Indiana being one and Philly most likely not one), which played a factor. Whereas, Ibaka is just looking to have a bigger role than sitting in the corner 3 and would probably sign wherever provides that for him. Last and most important, Orlando got fleeced.

[Guest]

Ya we kinda suck at it.

[Guest]

We remind us of Joey from friends when Rachel told him she would give him 10 free Calvin Klein shirts for taking her assistant out for a night and he said no, one. Then he said TEN...u said 10 you can't take that back...

[AHF]

I think some people really overrate that All-Star appearance on Jeff's resume.  It doesn't mean GMs viewed as an "All-Star" level player.  Clearly nearly our GM nor other GMs thought that.  Utah preferred Hill over Teague.

Ibaka is more valued so the comparison isn't there for me.

[Guest]

Just now, AHF said:

I think some people really overrate that All-Star appearance on Jeff's resume.  It doesn't mean GMs viewed as an "All-Star" level player.  Clearly nearly our GM nor other GMs thought that.  Utah preferred Hill over Teague.

Ibaka is more valued so the comparison isn't there for me.

I'm sorry I'm trying not to be biased but I don't see how Ibaka would have more value than Teague in the eyes of gm's.

[Alex]

Yes.

[AHF]

Just now, Spud2Nique said:

I'm sorry I'm trying not to be biased but I don't see how Ibaka would have more value than Teague in the eyes of gm's.

A big man who can defend the rim and space the floor or an inconsistent point guard with a limited perimeter game who tweets about being injured.  

To try to remove any hometown bias, Utah wanted Hill over Teague.  Can you see how teams would value Ibaka over Hill?

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, AHF said:

A big man who can defend the rim and space the floor or an inconsistent point guard with a limited perimeter game who tweets about being injured.  

To try to remove any hometown bias, Utah wanted Hill over Teague.  Can you see how teams would value Ibaka over Hill?

Ibaka over Hill yes. Ibaka over Teague no. Teague was an all star on a 60 win team. Ibaka is a shell of his former self. I loved Ibaka of 3 years ago, but he has gone really soft and relied on his outside shot far too often, much like our Horford. 

[AHF]

2 minutes ago, Spud2Nique said:

Ibaka over Hill yes. Ibaka over Teague no. Teague was an all star on a 60 win team. Ibaka is a shell of his former self. I loved Ibaka of 3 years ago, but he has gone really soft and relied on his outside shot far too often, much like our Horford. 

You have to take off the rose colored glasses, Spud.  The market has spoken:

(a)  The GM other than Budcox that has the best insight into Teague's game preferred a 3-way deal to get Hill rather than a simpler 2-way deal where the Jazz would get Teague.  Speaking of Budcox, despite this being a relatively weak looking draft Bud preferred the #12 pick (after the clear impact guys available) to Teague even without knowing who would be available at that point.

(b)  We shopped Teague to every team in the league for the better part of a year and couldn't find a buyer at half the value that Ibaka brought.

It is obvious where the league views them, right?

[JSmooooove]

I agree it seems GMs around the league must value Ibaka WAY more than Teague or else this is just an awful trade.

BUT...

I also think that there is a difference between the talent of GMs as well. Look at the moves Presti has made over his career and compare that to Bud so far.

If we had Ibaka on our team I bet we wouldn't have gotten a haul like that. 

By the same token, I bet most GMs around the league wouldn't have traded Teague for only a #12 pick. We were desperate. 

Freaking MARCO BELINELLI was traded for the 22nd pick. Something just doesn't seem right. 

Edited June 24, 2016 by JSmooooove

[RWF]

Just think of what we could have gotten for Millsap last night compared to that Ibaka trade.  3rd pick? A bunch of young guys?

Now, we will try to re-sign Horford to max, then Millsap to max, and start the decline.

[JSmooooove]

7 minutes ago, RWF said:

Just think of what we could have gotten for Millsap last night compared to that Ibaka trade.  3rd pick? A bunch of young guys?

Now, we will try to re-sign Horford to max, then Millsap to max, and start the decline.

From what I've seen out of our new GM(s) so far, we probably would've gotten the same return the Thunder did at best. And I'm really not joking sadly. 

[Afro]

How many shot blockers do you know that can hit threes? 

How many PGs do you know that can score 15 points a game? 

Theres your answer 

[HawkItus]

Serge Ibaka = 3 time All-Defense 1st team.

Teague= 1 time reserve All-star, Skills Challenge runner up

 

Hmmmmm........I swear some of you couldn't pass Go playing monopoly.   

[Guest]

Ibaka is a big man that can defend and rebound playing next to Durant and Westbrook.  

Teague?  well he is a Hawk.  I think in general our players are valued less if they are Hawks, they go to another team, they somehow are better players even though they haven't played a game yet.

[Buzzard]

I don't see how we can be viewed as bad negotiators. We stuck to our guns and declined offers for Teague since the Bucks showed interest four years ago. We have done the same with Schröder since he was drafted. 

We got what we could while he still had one year left. Wait any longer, and Indy just pays him to walk  next season and come back to his home state.

Serge is a valuable commodity, he would probably have made an all-star team if OKC was in the Eastern Conference. I do think Orlando over paid though. To bad they did not need Teague or Schröder.

[JSmooooove]

This is what I'm looking at. For 3 years now he's been declining in every category that matters while playing the same amount of minutes.

Add in the fact that nobody actually knows his real age and some speculate he could be on the wrong side of 30... and you can see it in his game. He has lost a LOT of his explosiveness that he had early on in his career. He's not the same guy.

I just don't see how he is SO much more valuable than Teague, who has improved every year until this past season where he split time with Dennis and was injured.

Next year Teague will be back to how he was playing last season... where almost everyone regarded him as a top 10 PG.

I understand Ibaka type players are more rare in today's NBA, my point is that these trades are not even close. Ibaka may be more valuable than Teague, but not by that much!!

Edited June 24, 2016 by JSmooooove