Some defensive numbers.

[NBASupes]

Parker defense is super trash. We might need to start Vince

[High5]

42 minutes ago, Bonkers said:

The jinx continues...

 

Like I said, don't make these kinda threads

We were lucky with the amount of open 3s teams were missing. It was only a matter of time before a team got hot.

[bleachkit]

On 11/6/2019 at 2:30 PM, NBASupes said:

Our defense is legit. Once Bruno is NBA ready, top 5 defenses, here we go. Can't sleep on the improvement from Trae on that end

5 steals tonight. 

[JayBirdHawk]

Who knew that JC was our defensive linchpin .

[JTB]

2 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Who knew that JC was our defensive linchpin .

Yeah effort on close outs and around the rim goes a long way!

collins weak side blocks has really improved this season as well .

we are missing a lot with Collins out. He needs his respect .

[JayBirdHawk]

3 minutes ago, JTB said:

Yeah effort on close outs and around the rim goes a long way!

collins weak side blocks has really improved this season as well .

we are missing a lot with Collins out. He needs his respect .

Jabari can score but that's about it.  His defense.......what defense? Slow/non existant defensive rotations and closeouts.

9 hours ago, NBASupes said:

Parker defense is super trash. We might need to start Vince

And I would be OK with that.

[JTB]

10 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Jabari can score but that's about it.  His defense.......what defense? Slow/non existant defensive rotations and closeouts.

And I would be OK with that.

While I do agree with you and @NBASupes i don’t think it’s that easy to place Parker back on the bench with JC out as this team really struggles offensively already when trae isn’t scoring . Parker is needed offensively a lot more now since JC is out.

id take a different approach and start Bruno over Len and keep Parker starting. I say this so we can actually have a big man on the floor who’s willing to move his feet and give out ALL time effort defensively.

keep vince coming off the bench.

Edited November 9, 2019 by JTB

[JayBirdHawk]

I'd start Trae, Kevin, Hunter, Vince and Len. 

I don't like our offensive flow at the moment.

[NBASupes]

1 hour ago, JTB said:

While I do agree with you and @NBASupes i don’t think it’s that easy to place Parker back on the bench with JC out as this team really struggles offensively already when trae isn’t scoring . Parker is needed offensively a lot more now since JC is out.

id take a different approach and start Bruno over Len and keep Parker starting. I say this so we can actually have a big man on the floor who’s willing to move his feet and give out ALL time effort defensively.

keep vince coming off the bench.

Maybe Jay is right, you can't start Parker with the rookies. He has no movement skills, he tends to iso into everything and he screws up the defensive assignments often. 

Yesterday the offense didn't look bad with him, Len, Kevin and Bembry. 

I am more inclined to start Bembry and Kevin with Parker and move Cam and Hunter to the bench to play with Vince, Bruno/Jones, Wallace and Crabbe when he comes back.

[JayBirdHawk]

15 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Maybe Jay is right, you can't start Parker with the rookies. He has no movement skills, he tends to iso into everything and he screws up the defensive assignments often. 

Yesterday the offense didn't look bad with him, Len, Kevin and Bembry. 

I am more inclined to start Bembry and Kevin with Parker and move Cam and Hunter to the bench to play with Vince, Bruno/Jones, Wallace and Crabbe when he comes back.

This is my concern, the fit and ability for Parker to get them involved, put them in the right spots etc. is not there for Parker.

[NBASupes]

25 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

This is my concern, the fit and ability for Parker to get them involved, put them in the right spots etc. is not there for Parker.

Parker just lacks Basketball IQ, something Collins has an abundance of. Parker is a tremendous scorer. A better scorer than Collins but he lacks offensive and defensive BBIQ, consistently out of position on both ends, and while the effort is now there on defense, his lateral quickness is garbage for a 4. Worst than Collins who isn't there as well. I love the Parker signing but he is tough to insert as a starting 4

Edited November 9, 2019 by NBASupes

[JayBirdHawk]

29 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Parker just lacks Basketball IQ, something Collins has an abundance of. Parker is a tremendous scorer. A better scorer than Collins but he lacks offensive and defensive BBIQ, consistently out of position on both ends, and while the effort is now there on defense, his lateral quickness is garbage for a 4. Worst than Collins who isn't there as well. I love the Parker signing but he is tough to insert as a starting 4

This is why I preferred him remaining on the bench. It's too tall of an ask for him to play with and help 2 rookies on offense and defense.

[gurpilo]

We have some players that can play at NBA level: Young, Huerter, Crabbe, Bembry, Collins, Parker and Len

and 3 rookies that we need to give minutes in Reddish, Hunter and Fernando.

Considering that Collins is out we are extremely thin at PF and C position and we clearly lack a backup PG, Turner does not seem like an option really.

with Crabbe back I think Pierce should reconsider his lineup, we need some scoring on the starting unit and also a better defense

while Collins is out I would go with

Young(35)/Wallace(13)

Huerter(28)/Crabbe(20)

Bembry(25)/Reddish(23)

Hunter(25)/Parker(23)

Len(22)/Fernando(18)/Parker(8)

 

I think this is the best balance we can make on offense/defense by a mile

[Thomas]

44 minutes ago, gurpilo said:

We have some players that can play at NBA level: Young, Huerter, Crabbe, Bembry, Collins, Parker and Len

and 3 rookies that we need to give minutes in Reddish, Hunter and Fernando.

Considering that Collins is out we are extremely thin at PF and C position and we clearly lack a backup PG, Turner does not seem like an option really.

with Crabbe back I think Pierce should reconsider his lineup, we need some scoring on the starting unit and also a better defense

while Collins is out I would go with

Young(35)/Wallace(13)

Huerter(28)/Crabbe(20)

Bembry(25)/Reddish(23)

Hunter(25)/Parker(23)

Len(22)/Fernando(18)/Parker(8)

 

I think this is the best balance we can make on offense/defense by a mile

Like the Wallace backing up Trae and if Crabbe is truly durably functional I really do agree on your backcourt rotation a lot. Our kids get their minutes and we survive a difficult stretch and with a downtown bomber on board. Feel down the stretch the kids get a bunch more minutes and are use to them or we may miss the postseason because we did not develop them like I figured we would earlier. 

[JayBirdHawk]

1 hour ago, gurpilo said:

We have some players that can play at NBA level: Young, Huerter, Crabbe, Bembry, Collins, Parker and Len

and 3 rookies that we need to give minutes in Reddish, Hunter and Fernando.

Considering that Collins is out we are extremely thin at PF and C position and we clearly lack a backup PG, Turner does not seem like an option really.

with Crabbe back I think Pierce should reconsider his lineup, we need some scoring on the starting unit and also a better defense

while Collins is out I would go with

Young(35)/Wallace(13)

Huerter(28)/Crabbe(20)

Bembry(25)/Reddish(23)

Hunter(25)/Parker(23)

Len(22)/Fernando(18)/Parker(8)

 

I think this is the best balance we can make on offense/defense by a mile

Crabbe is expected back sometime on the road trip but I wouldn't pencil him in at 20 minutes off the bat. Will probably be on a minutes restriction, I would say 12-14 minutes. Vince will also get playing time.

I don't feel comfortable moving Reddish and Hunter from their SG/SF roles, they are rookies still finding their way, no reason to muddy the waters.

Huerter will see time at PG, so will Bembry.

[JayBirdHawk]

Interesting read!

Quote

Coach Pierce seems to like Bembry, and even when the Hawks are back to full strength, it’s hard to envision a scenario in which he would drop out of Atlanta’s rotation. And nor should he, as he remains the Atlanta’s best perimeter defender.0

Advanced metrics favor Bembry’s defense. Among metrics which measure defensive impact, Bembry consistently grades out as Atlanta’s best wing defender. He leads all qualifying Hawks perimeter players in FiveThirtyEight’s defensive RAPTOR rating. He does the same in BBall-Index’s D-PIPM metric, and in Basketball Reference’s defensive box plus/minus.

Over his career, Bembry has maintained a 2.3 percent steal rate. This season, he’s posting a career high 2.7 percent, which ranks 98th percentile for his position. A playmaking defender with a sturdy 6’6 frame and a 6’9 wingspan, Bembry has great instincts for accumulating stocks — blocks and steals — and he has the athleticism and versatility to defend both guard spots. Notably, Pierce has chosen to take Trae Young out of the game in crucial defensive situations in order to take advantage of Bembry’s ability to deter opposing point guards.

Effectively, Bembry operates as the familiar “energy guy” off the bench, bringing defensive intensity and a bit of creation, as well. He can certainly hurt you on his bad offensive nights, but there simply aren’t many options for impact defense on Atlanta’s roster.

As a pending restricted free agent (should the Hawks levy a qualifying offer), Schlenk should take the full view of what Bembry brings to the table. Despite being 25, Bembry is still young in development years, having only played 64 games in his first two seasons before playing all 82 last year.

....Looking down the line, in the playoffs, wings who can defend are especially important, and given the defensive questions in Atlanta’s current core, Bembry could play a role as a defensive specialist in a potential playoff rotation. 

 

 

Quote

But what might a reasonable second contract for Bembry look like?

According to BBall-Index’s PIPM Career Projection Tool, Bembry’s five year value in terms of wins added is estimated at $35.6 million, or $7.1 million annually. An annual amount in that range is a fairly reasonable discussion figure, though close to $7 million per season would be on the higher end value. Anything more than that, barring an unforeseen leap on offense, would certainly constitute a walk-away point. 

 

[NBASupes]

Bembry and that contract will be bad for us and what we need from a 4th wing on our roster

[Atlantaholic]

45 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Bembry and that contract will be bad for us and what we need from a 4th wing on our roster

Umm, yes, no thank you.

Those steal rates are high because he is gambling and out of position virtually all game. Bembry's defense has been trash this year. 

[AHF]

I’d be curious to see a deeper dive on the Raptor stat to understand why it rates him higher than our rookies on defense.

[NBASupes]

9 minutes ago, AHF said:

I’d be curious to see a deeper dive on the Raptor stat to understand why it rates him higher than our rookies on defense.

If it's anything like the Carmelo, it overvalues stocks and Defensive ratings. Since our defense is trash due to Parker, Jones and Young, our rookies metrics will be bad but they don't have the best stocks especially Hunter. 

 

Hunter and Reddish will do much better in the Draymond and defensively versatility metrics but general defensive metrics likely won't recognize the rookies and it's understandable. 

I been saying this but we get Noel, pair him with John, Trae, Cam and Hunter, their metrics will jump. Because of Hunter very low stocks and rebounding, he will never be a metrics baby. He is like a young Shane Battier.

 

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/introducing-raptor-our-new-metric-for-the-modern-nba/

Edited December 6, 2019 by NBASupes