Let's Talk Draft Picks

[kg01]

17 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

I'll do a Collins and a future 1st deal for Jon Issac. 

We need Jon Issac but how do we get him

I like Isaac for all the reasons you mention but that's an overpay, friend.  Remember, Isaac's health is a question.

[AHF]

How highly regarded is Isaac around the league?   He has missed more than 50% of Orlando's games over the last 3 years and his career averages are 9.3 points on .529% TS%, 5.5 rebounds, 1.1 assists, 1.1 steal and 1.5 blocks per game.

He needs to be DPOY if he is putting up 12 and 7 on a 55% TS% (numbers he has never reached in a season).

[NBASupes]

9 minutes ago, kg01 said:

I like Isaac for all the reasons you mention but that's an overpay, friend.  Remember, Isaac's health is a question.

But who else fits at the 4. We need two defensive stoppers. Capela and Issac helps since their is an abundance of offensive 2s available on the market for an affordable price 

[NBASupes]

8 minutes ago, AHF said:

How highly regarded is Isaac around the league?   He has missed more than 50% of Orlando's games over the last 3 years and his career averages are 9.3 points on .529% TS%, 5.5 rebounds, 1.1 assists, 1.1 steal and 1.5 blocks per game.

He needs to be DPOY if he is putting up 12 and 7 on a 55% TS% (numbers he has never reached in a season).

Issac spent most of year 1 in the G-League. 

You don't think Issac is one of the best defensive players in the NBA? 

[Peoriabird]

33 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

At the end of the day, Collins might need to be the one that moved. 

I'll do a Collins and a future 1st deal for Jon Issac. 

 

John is so under appreciated here!

[AHF]

2 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Issac spent most of year 1 in the G-League. 

You don't think Issac is one of the best defensive players in the NBA? 

Very good defender but doesn't otherwise impact the game at all.

[Peoriabird]

16 minutes ago, AHF said:

How highly regarded is Isaac around the league?   He has missed more than 50% of Orlando's games over the last 3 years and his career averages are 9.3 points on .529% TS%, 5.5 rebounds, 1.1 assists, 1.1 steal and 1.5 blocks per game.

He needs to be DPOY if he is putting up 12 and 7 on a 55% TS% (numbers he has never reached in a season).

John Collins and a 1st for Issac?  You still think @NBASupes likes John Collins?

[kg01]

14 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

But who else fits at the 4. We need two defensive stoppers. Capela and Issac helps since their is an abundance of offensive 2s available on the market for an affordable price 

I like him but you can't be paying a premium for a guy as limited as him.  Collins alone is an overpay for Isaac and I'm not a homer super-high on Collins.

As you say, building around Trae/Collins is tough.  It's made even tougher by giving up on Collins in favor of a guy not good enough on defense to make up for the step back on offense we'd take.

[AHF]

12 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

John Collins and a 1st for Issac?  You still think @NBASupes likes John Collins?

I think that deal is a significant overpay from our end unless Supes sees huge star making development coming from Isaac ala Giannis.  I do think that Supes sees Collins' defense as a problem from a team building perspective.  He has been very positive about Collins in the past but is clearly questioning whether there is a problem with long-term fit with Trae & Collins.  He may be among the top 2-3 posters most negative on Collins but still sees a lot of positive with him.

I like Isaac but would not want to give up Collins for someone at his what I think of as being his role player level.

Supes likes the RAPTOR/WAR stat which says Isaac was better than Collins this year due to impact of defense.  (Collins is 3rd on the Hawks lottery team while Isaac is 2nd on Orlando's 8th seed team).

Collins: RAPTOR -0.3 / WAR +1.7

Isaac:  RAPTOR +3.6 / WAR +3.1

[Peoriabird]

9 minutes ago, AHF said:

Supes likes the RAPTOR/WAR stat which says Isaac was better than Collins this year due to impact of defense.  (Collins is 3rd on the Hawks lottery team while Isaac is 2nd on Orlando's 8th seed team).
 

Collins: RAPTOR -0.3 / WAR +1.7

Isaac:  RAPTOR +3.6 / WAR +3.1

So playing Collins out of position doesn't affect his war?

[Spud2nique]

Collins>>>> Isaac 

No way that’s disrespecting JC. 

Isaac avg. 12/7/1 in 30mpg 

Collins avg. 22/10 in 33mpg

Block averages for last year differ by .8 not too huge. 
 

I do like @hazer OG Isaac but I’m not giving up a double double guy in JC for him. 

 

[Buzzard]

2 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

So playing Collins out of position doesn't affect his war?

I think playing Collins 47% of the time at Center crushed him. Its a testament to his attitude and fortitude that he did not complain or sulk all season; while still being able to put up All Star like numbers.

[Peoriabird]

5 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

Collins>>>> Isaac 

No way that’s disrespecting JC. 

Isaac avg. 12/7/1 in 30mpg 

Collins avg. 22/10 in 33mpg

Block averages for last year differ by .8 not too huge. 
 

I do like @hazer OG Isaac but I’m not giving up a double double guy in JC for him. 

 

Isaac might be worse than J-Smoove on offense

[DS5]

Collins has improved each year, and even showed a bit of defensive improvement this season. I really like Isaac but I'm not giving up JC and a first for him.

[Spud2nique]

1 hour ago, NBASupes said:

Hield for Kevin is something that would work for SAC but would we do it, probably not.

I think I would do this. I like Kevin a lot but I would at least entertain this. 
 

Trae/Booker Trae/Hield...

 

People always talking about backcourts that won’t work due to defense but 80% of the league doesn’t play good defense.

 

 

[JayBirdHawk]

24 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Issac spent most of year 1 in the G-League. 

You don't think Issac is one of the best defensive players in the NBA? 

Per NBA.com he played in 2 GLeague games his rookie year. He spent most of his rookie season rehabbing a bum ankle. 

Year 2 injured, year 3 injured.

In a year when JC got suspended for 25 games, he still played more games (41) than Isaac (32).

[JayBirdHawk]

7 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

Isaac might be worse than J-Smoove on offense

Damn!

[DS5]

On another note, is Oladipo really available? I'd be willing to give up this year's first, OKC first and Huerter. Probably Dedmon too to make salaries work. I'd take a gamble that he returns to his 18-19 form. 

[Buzzard]

10 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

I think I would do this. I like Kevin a lot but I would at least entertain this. 
 

Trae/Booker Trae/Hield...

 

People always talking about backcourts that won’t work due to defense but 80% of the league doesn’t play good defense.

 

 

80% of the league plays better defense than us. If you look at the top 15 teams in defensive rating, its like 12 or 13 are playoff teams. Now to add insult to injury, the Bucks, Raptors, Lakers, Celtics, Clippers, and 76ers round up the top 6.

https://stats.nba.com/teams/advanced/?sort=DEF_RATING&dir=-1

Defense is boring @Spud2nique but it is blatantly obvious it matters.

 

Edited May 5, 2020 by Buzzard

[kg01]

17 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

I think I would do this. I like Kevin a lot but I would at least entertain this. 
 

Trae/Booker Trae/Hield...

 

People always talking about backcourts that won’t work due to defense but 80% of the league doesn’t play good defense.

 

 

I agree with @Buzzard on this one (just don't ever tell him I said that ).

 Butchu just mentioned him so he's definitely gonna re...

 Shhh, stfu Nique, I wanna see where this is goin'.

 Did this muhfkr jus' tell me ta shut up?

Defense matters when it comes to winning at the level I'd like us to achieve.  Plus Hield would pitch a hissy about coming off the bench, which is what he'd do if he were here imho.