Hawks Free Agent Targets

[JayBirdHawk]

6 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

I view him like JC. He's a good Basketball player. Very talented. Elite movement player. Excellent shooting touch. Exceptional rim runner. Tremendous value at #19. Great pick by TS and to clarify, a high end JAG. But if we are honest, I see him a lot more like Kyle Kuzma than Anthony Davis. Even it's a reach to compare him to Amar'e because Amar'e can create his own points in the post with his post game. If JC was a playmaker, my view of him would be massively different but so would our results. We would be a playoff team and he would have been a top 3-7 pick. 

I don't have a high view of Jeff Green. He's been elite in the overpaid arena over his career because of what he could be instead of what he is like Harrison Barnes. I have a high value of JC. I wouldn't trade him unless it mad tremendous sense. 

There's a range between AD and Kuzma.

[terrell]

18 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

If I had a preference, I would choose the player I wouldn't have to overpay over the one who's overpaid. If that's JC, that's JC, if that's Harrell, its Harrell.

It would be a massive mistake to pay him anywhere close to Buddy Hield money. Buddy Hield is vastly overpaid right now and Sacramento is paying the price for it.

Stop comparing oranges to apples...lol. 

[NBASupes]

Just now, AHF said:

I think she is talking about the opinion you previously gave on Harrell that led to you having the discussion as to who Jay would rather overpay and you were advocating to pay Harrell more than 15 at that time.  

Maybe more useful to talk in the present.  What are your current max dollars you'd pay Harrell and JC before you'd let them walk at the next dollar?

Harrell 15. Collins 18 with incentives like Sabonis. I wouldn't let him walk, I would try to at least do a SnT. That's why getting a backup PF is critical, you don't want to be at the mercy of a damn free agent. Indy drafted Goga for that reason. You want to have you ass covered. If you think that's OO or Obi, take one of them. 

[AHF]

5 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

I don't. I see AD>>>>>JC>Kuz. Kuzma is clearly a 6th man at best to me no matter the team or situation. JC is a winning team 6th man. AD is a generational big man. If we had him, we would be a contender

I think we see AD and Kuz in the same light.  Kuz is a nice big off the bench.  AD is on the MVP short-list in his best seasons.  However, we value JC very differently.  6th man vs All-Star potential.

[NBASupes]

2 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

There's a range between AD and Kuzma.

Not quite. 

[NBASupes]

1 minute ago, AHF said:

I think we see AD and Kuz in the same light.  Kuz is a nice big off the bench.  AD is on the MVP short-list in his best seasons.  However, we value JC very differently.  6th man vs All-Star potential.

He could be an all star but he's a Sabonis, LaVine, Josh Smith, Al Jefferson, or Aaron Gordon all star. He's not even a potential Sap, Al, DeRozan, Lowry, Draymond, or LMA All Star. He's a situational all star and most of these guys never make it with a teammate who's a lock like Trae unless we are a tremendous team which is rare. 

[JayBirdHawk]

7 minutes ago, AHF said:

I think she is talking about the opinion you previously gave on Harrell that led to you having the discussion as to who Jay would rather overpay and you were advocating to pay Harrell more than 15 at that time.  

Maybe more useful to talk in the present.  What are your current max dollars you'd pay Harrell and JC before you'd let them walk at the next dollar?

True, but just today he said he didn't think Harrell lost any money based on his playoff pay, which was the $20 mark from earlier in the season. Then he said 4/$60

[NBASupes]

I honestly do not believe the coaches will ever vote JC into the all star game. Too limited. His faith depends on fans, his peers, and media.

[terrell]

8 minutes ago, AHF said:

And this is why people say you hate JC.  Because they see JC as a plus starter and potential All-Star and you see him as below starter level.  I don't view it as hate.  I think you are significantly underrating him. 

I do agree with your assessment of Kuzma but the gap on how we view JC is significant enough that even I have a hard time not being insulted on his behalf when you compare JC to Kuz.

Lakers would trade Kuz for Collins in a heartbeat..Same as the Clippers with Harrell..

[NBASupes]

2 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

True, but just today he said he didn't think Harrell lost any money based on his playoff pay, which was the $20 mark from earlier in the season. Then he said 4/$60

That was based on the cap going to 125 million in 2022. You do realize COVID happened.

[AHF]

5 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

He could be an all star but he's a Sabonis, LaVine, Josh Smith, Al Jefferson, or Aaron Gordon all star. He's not even a potential Sap, Al, DeRozan, Lowry, Draymond, or LMA All Star. He's a situational all star and most of these guys never make it with a teammate who's a lock like Trae unless we are a tremendous team which is rare. 

I'm pretty sure LaVine, Smith, Jefferson and Gordon have never been All-Stars.  Coincidently, Sabonis is the only guy on that list that I put in the conversation with JC and he is the only with an actual All-Star appearance.

[NBASupes]

1 minute ago, terrell said:

Lakers would trade Kuz for Collins in a heartbeat..Same as the Clippers with Harrell..

I don't think the Lakers would do that in a heartbeat. Kuz does add value specific to the Lakers and he can defend big wings. Now, most teams would do that deal in a heartbeat. Harrell, 100%.   one guy is cheaper next year and 22 year old. One is nearly 30. That's a no brainer value deal. Don't get it twist. JC has a lot of trade value and I am not comparing the two in that area at all. 

Just now, AHF said:

I'm pretty sure LaVine, Smith, Jefferson and Gordon have never been All-Stars.  Coincidently, Sabonis is the only guy on that list that I put in the conversation with JC and he is the only with an actual All-Star appearance.

There all in that category, including Sabonis. 

[NBASupes]

There is a difference between trade value at this moment and how I value them long term. 

[terrell]

Just now, NBASupes said:

I don't think the Lakers would do that in a heartbeat. Kuz does add value specific to the Lakers and he can defend big wings. Now, most teams would do that deal in a heartbeat. Harrell, 100%.   one guy is cheaper next year and 22 year old. One is nearly 30. That's a no brainer value deal. Don't get it twist. JC has a lot of trade value and I am not comparing the two in that area at all. 

lol. Come on now... Would you trade Collins for Kuz?

[NBASupes]

1 minute ago, terrell said:

lol. Come on now... Would you trade Collins for Kuz?

No. 

[terrell]

Just now, NBASupes said:

No. 

No GM in their right mind would..

[AHF]

7 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

There all in that category, including Sabonis. 

And this is why I think you are underrating him when you compare his ceiling to a bunch of guys who disappointed in varying degrees and never made an All-Star game.

[NBASupes]

Just now, terrell said:

No GM in their right mind would..

I don't agree with this statement. Kuz has value that's specific to the Lakers and how they play and personnel. That's like a MIN fan saying everyone would do a Okogie for Hunter trade but guess who wouldn't, the Hawks and our fanbase. 

[AHF]

5 minutes ago, terrell said:

lol. Come on now... Would you trade Collins for Kuz?

The Lakers would accept that deal before TS finished the sentence.

[NBASupes]

Just now, AHF said:

And this is why I think you are underrating him when you compare his ceiling to a bunch of guys who disappointed in varying degrees and never made an All-Star game.

How? 

Can't create his own offense

Not a playmaker

Limited size

Terrible defender in space

Has limitations as a post defender. 

He has the profile of your typical non-NBA all star. 

NBA all stars don't look like this in 2020. Maybe 1998 but not in the modern NBA. We expect a lot more of our players in today's league. I am not saying it's unlikely but I am not going to sell bag of goods on it. I called that Smoove and Big Al Jefferson would never be All Stars. Same for Gerald Wallace. These types just never make it. They offer little to nothing for winning Basketball. They are just productive guys but still JAGs.

4 minutes ago, AHF said:

The Lakers would accept that deal before TS finished the sentence.

I disagree and I would do the deal before TS would finish the sentence.