What are your biggest takeaways from the Preseason???

[Sothron]

If anyone thought this team could not have played a game since March with several new additions and come out like a polished product in pre season...I got no words for that.

It is obvious that the bubble format has severely handicapped the teams that were not invited to it. The chemistry will take time. I am not sold on LP and have never really been. If the team isn't around .500 by the mid season then I fully expect him to be gone and McMillan given a chance to show what he can do.

So it is possible this team could lose its coach and by the time the chemistry is there sneak into the playoffs and McMillan gets a multi year deal to be the HC. 

[Cwell]

9 hours ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

As for Trae's play, he's the LAST GUY I'm worried about on this team.  He knows how to score the basketball, even when his shot is off. 

Once he starts to gel with his new teammates, it'll be up to them to make shots, because Trae will get them the ball.

I'm more impressed with Trae's effort on defense.

I'll be impressed with his effort on defense when he does it in regular season. He did this last pre-season on defense, and went back to not even trying when the season started

Edited December 21, 2020 by Cwell

[NBASupes]

1 minute ago, Cwell said:

I'll be impressed with his effort on defense when he does it it regular season. He did this last pre-season on defense, and went back to not even trying when the season started

This is true. 

[JeffS17]

6 hours ago, Sothron said:

If anyone thought this team could not have played a game since March with several new additions and come out like a polished product in pre season...I got no words for that.

It is obvious that the bubble format has severely handicapped the teams that were not invited to it. The chemistry will take time. I am not sold on LP and have never really been. If the team isn't around .500 by the mid season then I fully expect him to be gone and McMillan given a chance to show what he can do.

So it is possible this team could lose its coach and by the time the chemistry is there sneak into the playoffs and McMillan gets a multi year deal to be the HC. 

Nate has won a single playoff series in 16 years of coaching... his last 7 appearances are first round exits.  The guy is an NBA level coach, but I don't think he will ever get us to the finals.  Having a solid defensive/offensive system is necessary for regular season wins where teams are not preparing for every matchup but the guy has not shown (despite ample opportunity) he can make post season adjustments needed to win.  I would rather gamble on a smart/talented/unproven coach like Pierce.

[NBASupes]

4 minutes ago, JeffS17 said:

Nate has won a single playoff series in 16 years of coaching... his last 7 appearances are first round exits.  The guy is an NBA level coach, but I don't think he will ever get us to the finals.  Having a solid defensive/offensive system is necessary for regular season wins where teams are not preparing for every matchup but the guy has not shown (despite ample opportunity) he can make post season adjustments needed to win.  I would rather gamble on a smart/talented/unproven coach like Pierce.

Did you think he could win with the teams he had? All of those teams massively overachieved in the regular season. 

[marco102]

47 minutes ago, Cwell said:

I'll be impressed with his effort on defense when he does it in regular season. He did this last pre-season on defense, and went back to not even trying when the season started

 

46 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

This is true. 

This isn't fully true. The first few games of last season Trae played a ton better defensively.

When JC got suspended, Heurter injured, and he had to carry the offense, thats when he stopped giving a damn. Yes, that's most of the season, but act like you understand the circumstances that lead to the end result. 

This isn't me saying he was good, but his effort was there in the beginning.

Edited December 21, 2020 by marco102

[TheNorthCydeRises]

33 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Did you think he could win with the teams he had? All of those teams massively overachieved in the regular season. 

That's not true Supes.  I know that McMillan coached a few 50+ win teams in Portland and Seattle.  Even his Indiana teams were good enough to at least win one of those playoff series as a 4 / 5 seed.  Last year, he had his 2 top guys hurt, so he gets a pass by me on that.

[NBASupes]

5 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

That's not true Supes.  I know that McMillan coached a few 50+ win teams in Portland and Seattle.  Even his Indiana teams were good enough to at least win one of those playoff series as a 4 / 5 seed.  Last year, he had his 2 top guys hurt, so he gets a pass by me on that.

Look at the competition

[TheNorthCydeRises]

2 minutes ago, marco102 said:

 

This isn't fully true. The first few games of last season Trae played a ton better defensively.

When JC got suspended, Heurter injured, and he had to carry the offense, thats when he stopped giving a damn. Yes, that's most of the season, but act like you understand the circumstances that lead to the end result. 

This isn't me saying he was good, but his effort was there in the beginning.

You're right about the start of last season.  His defense was definitely good in those first 2 weeks of the season.

And I wouldn't say that he stopped "giving a damn".  Once again, the narrative that people just lit up Trae, doesn't correlate to what was actually happening out on the court.  The entire team sucked defensively.  And it wasn't like teams were targeting Trae and trying to attack him every possession.

If anything, Trae had to pick and choose when he played defense, because he had to carry the load so much offensively.  Yes, his effort has to be better.  But I'll say that for the entire team.

[kg01]

42 minutes ago, JeffS17 said:

Nate has won a single playoff series in 16 years of coaching... his last 7 appearances are first round exits.  The guy is an NBA level coach, but I don't think he will ever get us to the finals.  Having a solid defensive/offensive system is necessary for regular season wins where teams are not preparing for every matchup but the guy has not shown (despite ample opportunity) he can make post season adjustments needed to win.  I would rather gamble on a smart/talented/unproven coach like Pierce.

I'm between you and supey on Nate.  He's a certain bench upgrade.  But the idea that he's an "answer" so we can fire CLP is faulty thinking.

He's been at it longer so naturally his resume is ... well, he has a resume but it's not like he's gonna slide in and lead some deep playoff run.

Same can be said about guys like Atkinson who certain folks are still pining over.  I ain't callin no names (saffron!).

All that said, I won't call Nate trash.  His teams pretty much achieved at the level they should've.  Didn't lose to teams that weren't better than them.

Well dang, kg.  Aren't you contradicting yourself?

No, not really.  I'm just saying we shouldn't be using nate's presence as more fire-CLP fodder.

[REHawksFan]

On 12/20/2020 at 1:06 AM, NBASupes said:

Trae and JC are the only two who clearly played below their talent level. 

Might get railed on for this, but I wasn't really surprised these two were the biggest struggles.  By FAR they have the biggest adjustments to make. They've gone from being the ENTIRE offense exclusively to having to make room for other players.  JC is trying to find his fit with Capela, Gallo, and even Bogi while Trae is trying to navigate how to feed Bogi, Capela, Gallo, while still eyeing JC. 

I don't care what anyone says, 4 preseason games and 3 weeks isn't enough time for either player to figure out their new roles and what their new teammates are going to be doing.   

[marco102]

10 minutes ago, REHawksFan said:

Might get railed on for this, but I wasn't really surprised these two were the biggest struggles.  By FAR they have the biggest adjustments to make. They've gone from being the ENTIRE offense exclusively to having to make room for other players.  JC is trying to find his fit with Capela, Gallo, and even Bogi while Trae is trying to navigate how to feed Bogi, Capela, Gallo, while still eyeing JC. 

I don't care what anyone says, 4 preseason games and 3 weeks isn't enough time for either player to figure out their new roles and what their new teammates are going to be doing.   

Nothing to get railed about. Anyone without agendas knows there will be an adjustment period for the team. We can debate how long that will take and the record during that process, but everyone should set their expectations for that. 

I personally hope we can maintain a .500 record through the first quarter of the season and then we will see the team start to gel right when the schedule is the toughest.

Edited December 21, 2020 by marco102

[macdaddy]

I think there is no choice but to go with Trae/Bogi/Hunter/Collins/Capela to start.     I love Cam but Cam and Hunter together were really flat to start that last game.  Bogi wasn't impressive in the pre-season but he's been around long enough we know he will be better.

Either Trae controls the action like he did last year or we implement a more motion oriented system but we can't do a halfway in between.   So many guys had no clue where to be on offense.  

I'm not overly concerned yet.   The problem is the schedule is pretty tight so our practice time to improve this is limited.   

The bright spots for me are that Capela is damn good.   Hunter and Cam are showing what they can do but they have to get way more consistent.   Heurter looked pretty good but they need to restrict him to what he's good at.  Solomon Hill is steady.   

We need Rondo/Dunn.  We need a backup C.

[marco102]

3 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

I think there is no choice but to go with Trae/Bogi/Hunter/Collins/Capela to start.     I love Cam but Cam and Hunter together were really flat to start that last game.  Bogi wasn't impressive in the pre-season but he's been around long enough we know he will be better.

Either Trae controls the action like he did last year or we implement a more motion oriented system but we can't do a halfway in between.   So many guys had no clue where to be on offense.  

I'm not overly concerned yet.   The problem is the schedule is pretty tight so our practice time to improve this is limited.   

The bright spots for me are that Capela is damn good.   Hunter and Cam are showing what they can do but they have to get way more consistent.   Heurter looked pretty good but they need to restrict him to what he's good at.  Solomon Hill is steady.   

We need Rondo/Dunn.  We need a backup C.

I don't think it matters that much. You can start Cam or Huerter if you want the guys to start with the most continuity and work the new vets (is Bogi a vet?) into their roles as the season progresses.

Starting Cam and Hunter may also give you a bit more flexibility defensively, but it all depends on how the coaches feel they match up with the bulls.

Edited December 21, 2020 by marco102

[macdaddy]

4 minutes ago, marco102 said:

I don't think it matters that much. You can start Cam or Huerter if you want the guys to start with the most continuity and work the new vets (is Bogi a vet?) into their roles as the season progresses.

Starting Cam and Hunter may also give you a bit more flexibility defensively, but it all depends on how the coaches feel they match up with the bulls.

I was convinced that starting Cam and Hunter was the best choice but they completely laid an egg starting this past game and we spent the whole game playing catchup.   I love those guys but we all focus on the flashes of promise and too easily ignore that they are still very raw, screw up a lot, and don't have consistent offensive games.   Hunter is getting there though.  

[NBASupes]

8 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

I was convinced that starting Cam and Hunter was the best choice but they completely laid an egg starting this past game and we spent the whole game playing catchup.   I love those guys but we all focus on the flashes of promise and too easily ignore that they are still very raw, screw up a lot, and don't have consistent offensive games.   Hunter is getting there though.  

Facts

[marco102]

16 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

I was convinced that starting Cam and Hunter was the best choice but they completely laid an egg starting this past game and we spent the whole game playing catchup.   I love those guys but we all focus on the flashes of promise and too easily ignore that they are still very raw, screw up a lot, and don't have consistent offensive games.   Hunter is getting there though.  

You are taking way too much from a preseason game. Especially one where Cam played well as the starter and Hunter was a bit off. 

Again, it is all about the match-ups. And if you want more defensive flexibility.

I should add  I don't care who starts, but I'm arguing we shouldn't be making that judgment from one preseason game.

Edited December 21, 2020 by marco102

[macdaddy]

16 minutes ago, marco102 said:

You are taking way too much from a preseason game. Especially one where Cam played well as the starter and Hunter was a bit off. 

Again, it is all about the match-ups. And if you want more defensive flexibility.

I should add  I don't care who starts, but I'm arguing we shouldn't be making that judgment from one preseason game.

Agree but i'm talking about their careers so far.   Neither has shown any consistency, which is normal for their age and experience, but that's why i don't think we can start them together.  You just don't know what you'll get and you end up playing uphill all game.   That one game was just an example of what can happen until they show that consistent effort and ability.

[kg01]

7 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

Agree but i'm talking about their careers so far.   Neither has shown any consistency, which is normal for their age and experience, but that's why i don't think we can start them together.  You just don't know what you'll get and you end up playing uphill all game.   That one game was just an example of what can happen until they show that consistent effort and ability.

I think this is a very well-stated response to @marco102's comment.  While it was just one game, it was kind of an illustration of the issues that continue to plague them as a tandem ... but that's understandable considering their age/experience level.

After his first few preseason games, I was thinking Hunter needed to start to play with Trae and enhance his effectiveness.  I wish we would've had more games to explore him in a larger role on the second unit.  Has he grown enough to 'eat' on his own?  We don't really know yet.

Ugh, I hate this abbreviated preseason (although I understand it).  We'll have to be exploring things during real games.  But, of course, the anti-CLP mob will choose to ignore that in assessing our wins/losses, but that's a whole different rant. 

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Just now, NBASupes said:

Look at the competition

OK . . I'll check it out.