[Wojnarowski] NBA plans to address the unnatural shooting motions of star players like James Harden and Trae Young that get foul calls under the rules in the NBA this offseason

[RedDawg#8]

15 hours ago, macdaddy said:

You know you're the golden child of the NBA when you don't even get mentioned in the coversation and you routinely do this crap

 

Even worse, this guy is getting serious MVP buzz, while ours gets blackballed.

[AHF]

5 hours ago, RedDawg#8 said:

Even worse, this guy is getting serious MVP buzz, while ours gets blackballed.

It isn't that Steph needs to be dumped on.  It is the narrative that Trae is doing something different that is the problem.  

[macdaddy]

1 hour ago, AHF said:

It isn't that Steph needs to be dumped on.  It is the narrative that Trae is doing something different that is the problem.  

Eh i'm not sure.  Steph, and a play like that above, expose the real shady and infuriating part of the NBA.   While it's not Steph's fault that he gets that call, dumping on him and forcing the league to address it 5+ years ago would have gotten it resolved by now.   Trae is a guy that the league and a lot of pundits and fans don't deem 'worthy' of the call so now it's an issue.   But it's all BS.  So dumping on the stars in my opinion is the only way to bring change not just to this issue but the idea of stars getting terrible calls to begin with. 

 

[kg01]

47 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

Eh i'm not sure.  Steph, and a play like that above, expose the real shady and infuriating part of the NBA.   While it's not Steph's fault that he gets that call, dumping on him and forcing the league to address it 5+ years ago would have gotten it resolved by now.   Trae is a guy that the league and a lot of pundits and fans don't deem 'worthy' of the call so now it's an issue.   But it's all BS.  So dumping on the stars in my opinion is the only way to bring change not just to this issue but the idea of stars getting terrible calls to begin with. 

 

It really is amazing how selectively folks' outrage is applied.  Chalk it up to the next phase of goalpost moving on a guy none of the eggsperts expected (wanted?) to succeed on any material level.

[marco102]

30 minutes ago, kg01 said:

It really is amazing how selectively folks' outrage is applied.  Chalk it up to the next phase of goalpost moving on a guy none of the eggsperts expected (wanted?) to succeed on any material level.

Yup, listening to the starting lineup this morning, Frank couldn't even explain why he left Trae off third team All NBA, but put Russell Westbrook on the second team.  We were told last year you needed to have a winning record to get on an All NBA team. 

I'll say that Frank is normally pretty fair regarding the Hawks, but he def has Knicks fever right now.

Edited May 18, 2021 by marco102

[kg01]

9 minutes ago, marco102 said:

Yup, listening to the starting lineup this morning, Frank couldn't even explain why he left Trae off third team All NBA, but put Russell Westbrook on the second team.  We were told last year you needed to have a winning record to get on an All NBA team. 

I'll say that Frank is normally pretty fair regarding the Hawks, but he def has Knicks fever right now.

And that illustrates an issue I have.  So the guy has great numbers but doesn't win and all we get is, "Oh you gotta win, you gotta win, you gotta win".  Then we elevate Westbrook due to his great numbers and pretty much ignore the team's record.

Or we say, well if you look at this specific section of the schedule, his team looked great.  Nevermind the fact, after a near historic run where they ran off a series of wins ... they were still double-digit games under .500.

So we prove winning doesn't matter ... until we decide it does ... for certain players ... but not all players ... unless we decide to exempt them ... or .... notice a pattern?  It's all subjective bullcrap, so I wish they'd stop pretending otherwise.

If you want to award Westbrook, fine.  Just recognize you can't fall back on the 'winning' argument to leave someone else off.  You're gonna have to sac up and just say you don't like that other player for some arbitrary, indefensible reason and leave it at that.

[JayBirdHawk]

5 minutes ago, kg01 said:

And that illustrates an issue I have.  So the guy has great numbers but doesn't win and all we get is, "Oh you gotta win, you gotta win, you gotta win".  Then we elevate Westbrook due to his great numbers and pretty much ignore the team's record.

Or we say, well if you look at this specific section of the schedule, his team looked great.  Nevermind the fact, after a near historic run where they ran off a series of wins ... they were still double-digit games under .500.

So we prove winning doesn't matter ... until we decide it does ... for certain players ... but not all players ... unless we decide to exempt them ... or .... notice a pattern?  It's all subjective bullcrap, so I wish they'd stop pretending otherwise.

If you want to award Westbrook, fine.  Just recognize you can't fall back on the 'winning' argument to leave someone else off.  You're gonna have to sac up and just say you don't like that other player for some arbitrary, indefensible reason and leave it at that.

Most of these fools still can't get over the fact they called Trae a Bust and............

[Jdawgflow]

18 minutes ago, kg01 said:

And that illustrates an issue I have.  So the guy has great numbers but doesn't win and all we get is, "Oh you gotta win, you gotta win, you gotta win".  Then we elevate Westbrook due to his great numbers and pretty much ignore the team's record.

Or we say, well if you look at this specific section of the schedule, his team looked great.  Nevermind the fact, after a near historic run where they ran off a series of wins ... they were still double-digit games under .500.

So we prove winning doesn't matter ... until we decide it does ... for certain players ... but not all players ... unless we decide to exempt them ... or .... notice a pattern?  It's all subjective bullcrap, so I wish they'd stop pretending otherwise.

If you want to award Westbrook, fine.  Just recognize you can't fall back on the 'winning' argument to leave someone else off.  You're gonna have to sac up and just say you don't like that other player for some arbitrary, indefensible reason and leave it at that.

I just wish you would quit  around the subject and tell it to us straight KG.

[macdaddy]

37 minutes ago, kg01 said:

And that illustrates an issue I have.  So the guy has great numbers but doesn't win and all we get is, "Oh you gotta win, you gotta win, you gotta win".  Then we elevate Westbrook due to his great numbers and pretty much ignore the team's record.

Or we say, well if you look at this specific section of the schedule, his team looked great.  Nevermind the fact, after a near historic run where they ran off a series of wins ... they were still double-digit games under .500.

So we prove winning doesn't matter ... until we decide it does ... for certain players ... but not all players ... unless we decide to exempt them ... or .... notice a pattern?  It's all subjective bullcrap, so I wish they'd stop pretending otherwise.

If you want to award Westbrook, fine.  Just recognize you can't fall back on the 'winning' argument to leave someone else off.  You're gonna have to sac up and just say you don't like that other player for some arbitrary, indefensible reason and leave it at that.

And how damning is it for Beal that even with a triple double HOF'er next to him they still can't get to .500.  Of course it's more damning to the front office that hasn't put a decent frontcourt on the floor in 2 decades.  

[AHF]

1 hour ago, macdaddy said:

Eh i'm not sure.  Steph, and a play like that above, expose the real shady and infuriating part of the NBA.   While it's not Steph's fault that he gets that call, dumping on him and forcing the league to address it 5+ years ago would have gotten it resolved by now.   Trae is a guy that the league and a lot of pundits and fans don't deem 'worthy' of the call so now it's an issue.   But it's all BS.  So dumping on the stars in my opinion is the only way to bring change not just to this issue but the idea of stars getting terrible calls to begin with. 

 

My only comment here is that this has been an issue for as long as I've followed the league whether you are talking about Reggie kicking his leg out to draw contact or other players from 20, 30, 40, etc. years ago.  I doubt there is any cure to it.

[bleachkit]

16 minutes ago, AHF said:

My only comment here is that this has been an issue for as long as I've followed the league whether you are talking about Reggie kicking his leg out to draw contact or other players from 20, 30, 40, etc. years ago.  I doubt there is any cure to it.

Perhaps some respect should be given to the skill involved in drawing fouls. Drawing fouls is an art into itself. Getting to the line as many times as Trae does suggests he's doing something right, clearly teams and refs are not thrilled about sending him to the line. 

[marco102]

26 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

Perhaps some respect should be given to the skill involved in drawing fouls. Drawing fouls is an art into itself. Getting to the line as many times as Trae does suggests he's doing something right, clearly teams and refs are not thrilled about sending him to the line. 

But get this, they praise Embiid for literally flopping and discuss how great it is how many times he gets to the line.  

Make it make sense!

[AHF]

26 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

Perhaps some respect should be given to the skill involved in drawing fouls. Drawing fouls is an art into itself. Getting to the line as many times as Trae does suggests he's doing something right, clearly teams and refs are not thrilled about sending him to the line. 

That is clearly the case but what is skillful is not necessarily what is good for the league where the acting passes a certain point.  But the art of getting to the line is very important and the greats can virtually all do it to great effect.  Some guys like Kevin Martin make their living doing it and other guys prop themselves up with it.  The FTs are important to Trae's game and one of the reasons his TS% is as good as it is.

[lethalweapon3]

~lw3

[bleachkit]

I think the rules are fine like they are. No need to change them, refs are given wide latitude in how they call games anyways. You want to not give a foul call when a shooter jumps into a defender? Then don't call it. But the notion that the league has reached some critical mass in foul baiting is bull, FTA are down overall.