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Which vets do you want on the Hawks (pick 3)


Spud2nique

Which vet(s) are your favs for the Hawks  

40 members have voted

  1. 1. BU PG

    • TJ McConnell
    • Patty Mills
    • Derrick Rose
    • Alex Caruso
      0
    • Austin Rivers
  2. 2. Backup shooter

    • Tim Hardaway Jr.
    • Gary Trent
    • Alec Burks
    • Victor Oladipo
    • Danny Green
  3. 3. Backup Big (PF/C)


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  • Poll closed on 10/14/2021 at 02:29 PM

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I don't know why people keep putting D-Rose as a potential backup PG. He can't play the 2 (certainly not well enough to take those minutes from Bogi/Huerter/Reddish), so his role would be strictly that of a backup behind a guy who's gonna play 35 minutes a night and be on the court for all the most important minutes. Why would we think he'd be interested in coming here and playing 12 minutes a game when there are plenty of playoff teams (Boston, Dallas, LAC, etc) that could offer him a much more featured role?

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3 hours ago, niremetal said:

I don't know why people keep putting D-Rose as a potential backup PG. He can't play the 2 (certainly not well enough to take those minutes from Bogi/Huerter/Reddish), so his role would be strictly that of a backup behind a guy who's gonna play 35 minutes a night and be on the court for all the most important minutes. Why would we think he'd be interested in coming here and playing 12 minutes a game when there are plenty of playoff teams (Boston, Dallas, LAC, etc) that could offer him a much more featured role?

I think I would count out both him and McConnell if you are asking me what is realistic in terms of people embracing a role behind Trae.  Both will want something resembling a starting role, imo.  But the fact that one of these guards can't play the 2 doesn't matter to me.  Between Bogi, Huerter and Cam we have more than enough coverage for those minutes.  The reason I picked is that the question was who would you want and I'd want the guy who could win me a game in the playoffs with impact minutes and from that list that person is Rose.  If he embraced a "rest heavy, mentor" type of role at this point in his career then playing with Trae could be a really good mix and would put us in a much stronger position when Trae sits or is hurt.  Am I betting on that?   No, but I'd be excited if it happened.

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Spud's PGs

McConnell - Many believe he'll be overpriced... and specific to our roster, he isn't the offensive producer needed to fill the role when Trae's not on the floor

Mills - Good enough option, but prefer someone who, while he has a history of 20+ point nights, isn't necessarily a shoot-first kind of PG; and, too, prefer younger, and thus, who you can sign with some confidence he'll still be productive in 22-23 and 23-24

Rose - Practically the same assessment as Mills

Caruso - Probably the best option of the 5 listed all things considered... not quite the offensive asset that Mills or Rose is, but offers some likely continuity (probably a 3 year contract candidate) that neither of them would seem to... problem is, many including myself are persuaded LAL wants him back really bad, so you're likely going to have to pay dearly, and I don't like paying dearly

Rivers - Capable of running an offense, but just barely adequate at it... capable of scoring, but just barely adequate at it... in 8 yrs, he has one season of positive VORP (0.4), and every other one has been negative or 0.0... so, not someone I'm anxious to hand such an important role on the team, and in fact, would rather draft someone than to do that... and I absolutely don't want to draft someone and depend on a rookie to fill that role... in other words, easily the worst option of the 5 listed.

 

My choice

People who've ever read any of my posts of-late know that I like taking 28 yr-old Canadian, 2021 All-Euro 1st teamer, and former Hawks summer league phenomenon Kevin Pangos, who puts up 20+ point games, but like Trae, gets other teammates involved... and seems likely to be affordable by comparison, as well. His downside is that this would be his first NBA job, and too, prior to this year, he's had the occasional injury keeping him on the sidelines--so that's why he's affordable.

Total guess on my part, of course, but I'd think we could have him for something in the $5m/yr range. Skills-wise, he's everything we could want, truly. (Don't believe me, take the time to do some research.)

 

 

 

2021-07-13_11-39-09.png

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As has been a regular refrain, free agents look for the best money, and/but also the best minutes teams can offer them.

#2 PG is the only position where we can offer any promises of minutes.

Therefore, whoever you attract for the 5th wing is going to be someone who either isn't anticipating a lot of minutes anyhow, or someone who you'll have to pay more in order to persuade him to take the leftover minutes... same the 5th big.

And. We don't have the money for most of the players listed.

Burks, maybe. Green, maybe. Gibson, probably. But I'm not over the moon about any of them, me.

 

This is the major reason why you really want to use that $8-$13m of cap space on a trade, where you can lock-in an asset that has no choice but to play for you (ie, given that they're already under contract), in spite of the fact that they're going to be the 5th wing or 5th big.

 

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Can I add Lou Will,  Solomon Hill and Goodwin/Snell to the mix?

There's nothing like chemistry and honestly if we're being honest with ourselves none of those guys push us over the top. 

I agree most vet backups will not want to back up Trae for 12mins but a Lou/Goodwin/Mays/rookie can without having 2 many complaints because they've already been in the system or will be happy to be in the league on a winning team. Chemistry is everything when skill only gets you so far. Ask the USA team.

I picked Austin Rivers, Alex Burks and Ibaka because they are the closest things to two way players but unless we get the back in the days (defensive) Ibaka none of these players really push us over the edge and truly make us that much better.

Our improvements will mainly come from within and good health.

Edited by sillent
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6 hours ago, Diesel said:

I don't think we are in need of a BU SG because we have Bogi, Cam, and Huerter at that position.  Plus, the guys that you listed are starter quality (some of them), high money guys. 

Agreed ... we are good on the wing ... we have 4 quality wings already

We need a vet backup pg and big.

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2 hours ago, sturt said:

We don't have the money for most of the players listed.

We don’t have the money as it stands but what if there is a Gallo or a trade coming that you aren’t considering. Wouldn’t that conceivably free up more money for us to spend? :smile:
 

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Edited by Spud2nique
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I would like people to consider one issue. Although I agree backup Pg is the one more likely to get minutes I think we are underestimating the value, role and contribution that a backup big can play. We need a big Center and a good one for several reasons:

- Okongwu and Capela are really similar players, we need a big C to defend some matchups like big centers like Embiid, Ayton, López…

- Capela is injury prone, we were really lucky last season but he has missed average of 10-20 games per season, Okongwu is too young to support the team on his own, I really think this 3rd center will play a significant role on postseason and regular season.

- We are a team that lack strength and sometimes we are abused on the paint, we need to cover our deficiencies.

For me Dieng fits all this and he fits our offensive scheme but there are others that can provide help as well. 

Backup PG is important but I really think Backup Center might be as important next season, we are going for the ring, we need to be the best team as possible.

Edited by gurpilo
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10 hours ago, AHF said:

I think I would count out both him and McConnell if you are asking me what is realistic in terms of people embracing a role behind Trae.  Both will want something resembling a starting role, imo.  But the fact that one of these guards can't play the 2 doesn't matter to me.  Between Bogi, Huerter and Cam we have more than enough coverage for those minutes.  The reason I picked is that the question was who would you want and I'd want the guy who could win me a game in the playoffs with impact minutes and from that list that person is Rose.  If he embraced a "rest heavy, mentor" type of role at this point in his career then playing with Trae could be a really good mix and would put us in a much stronger position when Trae sits or is hurt.  Am I betting on that?   No, but I'd be excited if it happened.

But how is Rose (or McConnell for that matter) going to get minutes in the playoffs unless Trae gets hurt--in which case the odds of a deep playoff run are essentially nil anyway? I just don't see Rose being interested yet in a role where he has no realistic prospect of being on the floor in important moments.

Disagree on McConnell. He simply doesn't have the production (read: scoring ability) necessary to be a starting PG in the modern game, at least not a team that's going to win more than 25 games. He strikes me as being in the same mold as guys like Brevin Knight--solid backup who will give you good minutes off the bench and spot starts, but you're in trouble if you're leaning on him to play major minutes. I think he'd be perfect for a role here as a backup and spot starter, and I don't think he'd get a much better deal elsewhere. 

The other thing to bear in mind is that if Dunn exercises his option, we'll already have one backup PG who can't score. Strikes me that is Coach Nate plans to keep Dunn around, bringing back Lou or finding someone in his mold would be a better fit than a guy like McConnell, just so we have a couple change-of-pace options behind Trae. The closest fit among those options would then be Mills, but his scoring ability has diminished with his foot speed. 

 

Edited by niremetal
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