Jump to content
  • Current Donation Goals

    • Raised $390 of $700 target

What's left to be done?


capstone21

Recommended Posts

4 minutes ago, KB21 said:

I think the next move the Hawks need to make is to go ahead and convert Sharife's contract to a guaranteed deal.  This kid is too good and needs to compete to be Trae's full time back up.  

They should do a four year deal. Lock him up as long as possible. 

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Premium Member

To no one in particular...

 

Bruno was put on a standard contract. Conventional wisdom held that you had clearly open roster slots, so why restrict Bruno to the 40(?... and I think it's 50 now?)) games that he would have had under a two-way contract? Go ahead and sign him up, and do a 3-year so you had bird rights if it went well. 

Bruno's situation was different than Cooper's.

There are no clearly open roster slots where he fits--we're bringing back last year's #2 PG, and have acquired someone who is a proven quantity and an upgrade.

Granted, you could consider Lou as your #3 SG, which is open, and sign Cooper to a standard.

But here's why you don't even do that...

WE CONTROL COOPER REGARDLESS.

So, selfishly, what's in it for us (ie, "us" as-if we're the Hawks braintrust)... ?!?

We gain no actual compelling benefit. We only take off the table the two-way option... and mind you, worst-case scenario, we pin ourselves down to him occupying a roster slot for which we very conceivably could be yearning to be open later into the season... remember, now that we're in this phase that we're thought to be an actual potential contender, like Schlenk said, it's that much more likely that at the trade deadline, there will be a player who wants to come here... or just as if not more likely, after the trade deadline, there will be a player who gets bought-out that we want to sign, and that player will take interest.

This idea that you hamper your own roster flexibility by removing the two-way agreement with your 2nd rounder on the basis of summer league games?... against what, soberly, all understand is mostly sub-par competition?

Why? What purpose is served?

Wait. You lose nothing by waiting. He's going to be yours anyhow. He can't leave (... and not that I think he would be all that inclined to want to, since he's a hometown kid). And if he starts the year in G-league as anticipated and he is lights-out, then you have more evidence that maybe he's an actual difference maker worth not limiting to 50 games. Maybe that happens. Maybe, it turns out, not.

Sign him to a standard contract when it actually has been undeniably earned and there is evidence against legitimate competition that he can help you better than can other options. To me, the plan would be to let him get 15-20 consecutive games in College Park, and then let him play some combination of the two, and after the trade deadline, re-visit the conversation.

Maybe then. But certainly, don't make roster moves that decrease your roster flexibility before you have to.

That seems like a rational plan.

 

  • Like 3
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Premium Member
1 minute ago, Gray Mule said:

dad gummed

Mom objects to that phrase, you just need to know. For that matter, so does wifey, particularly on the "sense" part.

 

But I only said in too many words what @mrhonline has tried to say previously more concisely.

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Premium Member
1 hour ago, sturt said:

CAUTION. Can't vouch for who this guy is, nor that Yahoo is reporting this.

 

Yeah, that looks fishy, especially since that dude (or bot) has only had a Twitter account for 4 months.

But the one@mrhonlineposted looked legit. If it is legit, it's another instance where I'll have to trust Travis. But here's my "I'm bored because my 2-year-old won't sleep but also won't let me leave his room until he does sleep" scouting report on ιωάννης παπαπέτρου (which is what YouTube wants me to call him).

The lazy explanation would be that TS is looking for a bargain-bin version of Gallo. From his highlight reels (see below), it's clear that Papapetrou (like Gallo) is a pretty versatile scorer. He handles the ball quite well for a relatively big (6'9) forward. He can dribble penetrate and uses his body well to create space and offset his "meh" explosiveness. He also has a smooth jumper. He seems like a guy who can fairly be characterized as a three-level scorer.

Per Basketball Reference , Papapetrou shot .429 from deep in the Greek League last year, with an absurd .674 TS%. But I wouldn't put much stock in that, because Jimmer Fredette absolutely tore up the same league from deep a season earlier, shooting .603 from deep with an impossible .824 TS%. Notably, both Papapetrou and Fredette shot way better in the Greek League than they did in EuroLeague appearances in the same season, which indicates that better competition/defense negates the impressiveness of their Greek efficiency numbers. In EuroLeague play, I calculate his TS% over the past two seasons to have been .635 (great) and .505 (poor) in 2019-20 and 2020-21, respectively. The dropoff in EuroLeague this past season weirdly seems to be almost entirely due to his 2P%, which was way worse than any other season in his career (.429). Would obviously want to know what happened there, because that's awful efficiency inside the arc.

My first-glance impression is that he is basically a poor man's Gallo--falling fall short of Gallo as a deep threat, but otherwise similar in his overall profile. Gallo has proven himself to be a more efficient scorer in the NBA than Papapetrou has been in the EuroLeague (as opposed to Greek League), so clearly Papapetrou is several cuts below Gallo in that respect. Which is presumably why Gallo is making $20M in the NBA while Papapetrou is still looking for his first NBA contract. But the Greek League is better than most (I don't know @NBASupes' take, but my impression is that the Greek League is probably slightly below the G League in terms of competition level, while the EuroLeague is clearly a step above it) and he was the Greek League MVP this past season. So it's not shocking to think he's worth a "show me" contract in the NBA.

If we're bringing him in at the vet min for 2 years (which is the only type of deal that would make sense, since Schlenk made clear he doesn't want to go into the tax), it seems like a justifiable investment if viewed in isolation. Don't know if it's worth it, though, if it means we won't have the flexibility to convert Sharife's deal if he shows out in College Park.

Highlight reels

 

 

Edited by niremetal
  • Like 1
  • Thanks 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Premium Member
7 hours ago, niremetal said:

Don't know if it's worth it, though, if it means we won't have the flexibility to convert Sharife's deal if he shows out in College Park.

Yes that roster flexibility seems to be an important goal until buyout season hits later, and for that matter, until we see what injuries we encounter through the season.

But no, we're not under any gun to convert Sharife's deal. Can wait until next off-season, no problem.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, niremetal said:

Yeah, that looks fishy, especially since that dude (or bot) has only had a Twitter account for 4 months.

But the one@mrhonlineposted looked legit. If it is legit, it's another instance where I'll have to trust Travis. But here's my "I'm bored because my 2-year-old won't sleep but also won't let me leave his room until he does sleep" scouting report on ιωάννης παπαπέτρου (which is what YouTube wants me to call him).

The lazy explanation would be that TS is looking for a bargain-bin version of Gallo. From his highlight reels (see below), it's clear that Papapetrou (like Gallo) is a pretty versatile scorer. He handles the ball quite well for a relatively big (6'9) forward. He can dribble penetrate and uses his body well to create space and offset his "meh" explosiveness. He also has a smooth jumper. He seems like a guy who can fairly be characterized as a three-level scorer.

Per Basketball Reference , Papapetrou shot .429 from deep in the Greek League last year, with an absurd .674 TS%. But I wouldn't put much stock in that, because Jimmer Fredette absolutely tore up the same league from deep a season earlier, shooting .603 from deep with an impossible .824 TS%. Notably, both Papapetrou and Fredette shot way better in the Greek League than they did in EuroLeague appearances in the same season, which indicates that better competition/defense negates the impressiveness of their Greek efficiency numbers. In EuroLeague play, I calculate his TS% over the past two seasons to have been .635 (great) and .505 (poor) in 2019-20 and 2020-21, respectively. The dropoff in EuroLeague this past season weirdly seems to be almost entirely due to his 2P%, which was way worse than any other season in his career (.429). Would obviously want to know what happened there, because that's awful efficiency inside the arc.

My first-glance impression is that he is basically a poor man's Gallo--falling fall short of Gallo as a deep threat, but otherwise similar in his overall profile. Gallo has proven himself to be a more efficient scorer in the NBA than Papapetrou has been in the EuroLeague (as opposed to Greek League), so clearly Papapetrou is several cuts below Gallo in that respect. Which is presumably why Gallo is making $20M in the NBA while Papapetrou is still looking for his first NBA contract. But the Greek League is better than most (I don't know @NBASupes' take, but my impression is that the Greek League is probably slightly below the G League in terms of competition level, while the EuroLeague is clearly a step above it) and he was the Greek League MVP this past season. So it's not shocking to think he's worth a "show me" contract in the NBA.

If we're bringing him in at the vet min for 2 years (which is the only type of deal that would make sense, since Schlenk made clear he doesn't want to go into the tax), it seems like a justifiable investment if viewed in isolation. Don't know if it's worth it, though, if it means we won't have the flexibility to convert Sharife's deal if he shows out in College Park.

Highlight reels

 

 

Greek league is better than the Gleague at certain positions. 

Euroleague is the highest level of competition outside of the NBA. 

Eurocup is 2nd highest level. 

Jimmer is an excellent Basketball player. He wasn't a lottery pick for no reason. His metrics are similar to Lillard. The difference is, he had what he needed for the NBA self creation wise and Jimmer didn't 

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I know.  Everyone looks good on their hi light film.  Pappa looks good and if Travis thinks he's worth a slot on the Hawks roster, I couldn't be mad.  Keep us informed about this latest rumor....

:smug:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

23 hours ago, sturt said:

To no one in particular...

 

Bruno was put on a standard contract. Conventional wisdom held that you had clearly open roster slots, so why restrict Bruno to the 40(?... and I think it's 50 now?)) games that he would have had under a two-way contract? Go ahead and sign him up, and do a 3-year so you had bird rights if it went well. 

Bruno's situation was different than Cooper's.

There are no clearly open roster slots where he fits--we're bringing back last year's #2 PG, and have acquired someone who is a proven quantity and an upgrade.

Granted, you could consider Lou as your #3 SG, which is open, and sign Cooper to a standard.

But here's why you don't even do that...

WE CONTROL COOPER REGARDLESS.

So, selfishly, what's in it for us (ie, "us" as-if we're the Hawks braintrust)... ?!?

We gain no actual compelling benefit. We only take off the table the two-way option... and mind you, worst-case scenario, we pin ourselves down to him occupying a roster slot for which we very conceivably could be yearning to be open later into the season... remember, now that we're in this phase that we're thought to be an actual potential contender, like Schlenk said, it's that much more likely that at the trade deadline, there will be a player who wants to come here... or just as if not more likely, after the trade deadline, there will be a player who gets bought-out that we want to sign, and that player will take interest.

This idea that you hamper your own roster flexibility by removing the two-way agreement with your 2nd rounder on the basis of summer league games?... against what, soberly, all understand is mostly sub-par competition?

Why? What purpose is served?

Wait. You lose nothing by waiting. He's going to be yours anyhow. He can't leave (... and not that I think he would be all that inclined to want to, since he's a hometown kid). And if he starts the year in G-league as anticipated and he is lights-out, then you have more evidence that maybe he's an actual difference maker worth not limiting to 50 games. Maybe that happens. Maybe, it turns out, not.

Sign him to a standard contract when it actually has been undeniably earned and there is evidence against legitimate competition that he can help you better than can other options. To me, the plan would be to let him get 15-20 consecutive games in College Park, and then let him play some combination of the two, and after the trade deadline, re-visit the conversation.

Maybe then. But certainly, don't make roster moves that decrease your roster flexibility before you have to.

That seems like a rational plan.

 

My comment regarding a four year contract was  for after the season. Not really sure you can do that though and are probably limited to a three year contract. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Premium Member
13 hours ago, niremetal said:

The dropoff in EuroLeague this past season weirdly seems to be almost entirely due to his 2P%, which was way worse than any other season in his career (.429). Would obviously want to know what happened there, because that's awful efficiency inside the arc...............

If we're bringing him in at the vet min for 2 years (which is the only type of deal that would make sense, since Schlenk made clear he doesn't want to go into the tax), it seems like a justifiable investment if viewed in isolation.

I see that he's most typically referenced as being a small forward in Euro reports, but his size suggests... as you suggested... he may be considered more of a PF for ATL... following again in Gallo's footprints there. So/but, I wonder if they've played him at both SF and PF in Greece, and perhaps the difference you've cited is related to that.

On the second part, I can't help but wonder whether Solo's contract is non-guaranteed until later in the season... in which case, it makes it less confounding to sign a 15th man after all. Spotrac reports, no, it's all guaranteed. Probably, but we've all seen contract intel updated from time to time, and what was previously understood turned out not to be substantiated after all.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Please sign in to comment

You will be able to leave a comment after signing in



Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...