The cobbled together, stuff we held on to during the playoffs mega super rumor and team direction thread.


thecampster
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18 minutes ago, thecampster said:

This will probably be my last post as "an insider". Do not shoot the elected messenger. So a huge disclaimer before this gets posted.  A few weeks before the play in, I lost 2 of my 3 sources. The 3rd guy has been spot on the last year or so with info but its hard for me to say “stuff I’ve heard” when its only coming from 1 guy.

I had a talk with the both of the other 2 before their tenures where they were came to a final close (nothing bad, moving out and up in the world), and they downloaded the chatter they’d heard as a final goodbye. A short time after that, Sothron, Supes and I revived our rumor chat and many of the things I was told they had been hearing. Some of it was shared on the board.  What follows is greater than speculation, not yet rumor, some hotter than other. Lastly, a decision was made not to discuss some of it openly as the playoffs has changed more players’ futures than Gatorade. What follows is the summation of conversations held early in April. I'll talk less about incoming players. Expect the other 2 guys to chime in later with their targeted players getting buzz.

 

The trade deadline – ownership and other stakeholders were very unhappy about the dealing around the trade deadline. They wanted consolidation trades and couldn’t swing anything. There was a feeling around the league the Hawks were dangerous and no one wanted to help. But, there was also a feeling that everything the Hawks wanted to do was a swindle. Our players were valued greater as a whole than as individuals. Ownership is eager to shake things up. Specifically, to get bigger around Trae.

 

Clint – Management likes Clint but they do not see him as defensively dominant enough to put around Trae.  They see him as good and serviceable but a better fit on a team bigger at the 2/3/4. They feel he is not getting the help he needs. We either move Clint for a dominant center or will upgrade all 3 positions between him and Trae for size.

 

Collins – Management loves John the person. Management also thinks John is a better fit next to a dominant center or elsewhere. John is not strong enough, big enough and is hurt too much to put next to Trae and Clint. They know his athleticism will fade.

 

Bogi – Management is very frustrated with his injury situation. Mad at their medical staff for clearing him. Bogi’s knee issues are suspected to be degenerative and will need to be managed. Bogi’s defense is opportunistic but a net negative in its own right. He is a terrible fit next to Trae. Huerter is not the long term answer and will eventually be on the bench but his defensive fit next to Trae was a necessity. If Bogi plays hard defense 1 night, his knee makes him useless the next….This is why Huerter is starting and why Bogi is the number 1 person on the trading block.

 

Gallo – The team loves everything Gallo brings. They do not love it $21 million worth. Gallo is a financial decision they tried to make at the trade deadline and got mediocre interest at best. A decision was made to waive or trade him in the coming offseason and the team isn’t happy about it. They love him but he just isn’t worth $20 million + a year at this stage of his career.

 

Cooper – Cooper openly complained about his role and opportunities. He may not be back and could be packaged.

 

Wright – The Hawks love everything about him. For a player the team thought they made a mistake on 10 games in, he is now solidly a Hawk. They can’t overpay him and he may take the money elsewhere (he’s played himself onto a number of rosters now), but the Hawks want to bring him back.

 

TLC – If the price is right.

 

Hunter – Hunter complained openly about touches and the end of the season was all about him proving he could hold on to the ball and be effective. The jury is out. He improved but is not efficient. The offseason will be big for Hunter and he could be included in a trade deal to get a true star 2 to put next to Trae.

 

The team wants 3 things in the offseason.  1) To get bigger, more physical. This starts at both Center and PF. The Hawks will be shopping.  2) The team wants a solid #2 scorer/ball handler. 3) To utilize their draft capital and multiple assets to consolidate bringing in 2 stars. Either 2 elite bigs or 1 elite big and 1 elite 2.

 

The team is very interested in trading out of this year’s draft and using their pick to upgrade. This entire offseason is about getting players who will help them punish teams that double/trap Trae.

 

Nate isn’t going anywhere this season. He doesn’t like his team’s personal identity and has worked with management to address it this offseason.  Expect moves. Everyone is on board.

 

If you see the Hawks make a move for either Ayton, Gobert (or even A.Davis), then that is just the first domino to fall. Clint, John, Dre, Bogi, Gallo, Cooper could all have a new address next season and we could easily not have a draft pick.  5 out, 3 in is very likely.

I can understand why Dre would complain about touches. He is extension eligible this summer.

I would like to see what gets done in the off season.

This playoff run showed we need upgrades or everyone will need to be healthy and make improvements.

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10 minutes ago, marco102 said:

Can Miami afford him and Herron? 

What is he changing his mind from?

He's willing to play their for the min then 5 mil is what I was told. No one at the time I asked saw him as a full MLE player but he got the talent. He just wants to be in Miami really really bad. He loves their system and culture. He also loves the city. I was told he's gonna be a hard grab unless you massively overpay for him.

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49 minutes ago, thecampster said:

The team is very interested in trading out of this year’s draft and using their pick to upgrade. This entire offseason is about getting players who will help them punish teams that double/trap Trae.

200w.webp?cid=ecf05e47dc32rqfvkw9uhyng1x

Don't yell at me @marco102, yell at campst. 😏

28 minutes ago, bleachkit said:

Hunter ended his season on a very high note, that might change things, though he did have a tough season overall.

Insert 'Reddish' into your and campst's posts instead of 'Hunter' and it feels like we went back in time.  Let's use history to inform us on how to act.

13 minutes ago, marco102 said:

What is he changing his mind from?

Wanting to walk over molten glass to get to Miami, I suspect.

Edited by kg01
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1 hour ago, thecampster said:

This will probably be my last post as "an insider". Do not shoot the elected messenger. So a huge disclaimer before this gets posted.  A few weeks before the play in, I lost 2 of my 3 sources. The 3rd guy has been spot on the last year or so with info but its hard for me to say “stuff I’ve heard” when its only coming from 1 guy.

I had a talk with the both of the other 2 before their tenures where they were came to a final close (nothing bad, moving out and up in the world), and they downloaded the chatter they’d heard as a final goodbye. A short time after that, Sothron, Supes and I revived our rumor chat and many of the things I was told they had been hearing. Some of it was shared on the board.  What follows is greater than speculation, not yet rumor, some hotter than other. Lastly, a decision was made not to discuss some of it openly as the playoffs has changed more players’ futures than Gatorade. What follows is the summation of conversations held early in April. I'll talk less about incoming players. Expect the other 2 guys to chime in later with their targeted players getting buzz.

Thanks for your insights Campster.

 

The trade deadline – ownership and other stakeholders were very unhappy about the dealing around the trade deadline. They wanted consolidation trades and couldn’t swing anything. There was a feeling around the league the Hawks were dangerous and no one wanted to help. But, there was also a feeling that everything the Hawks wanted to do was a swindle. Our players were valued greater as a whole than as individuals. Ownership is eager to shake things up. Specifically, to get bigger around Trae.

 

Clint – Management likes Clint but they do not see him as defensively dominant enough to put around Trae.  They see him as good and serviceable but a better fit on a team bigger at the 2/3/4. They feel he is not getting the help he needs. We either move Clint for a dominant center or will upgrade all 3 positions between him and Trae for size.   Clint never gives any help either.  He lets other guys men drive straight down the lane, and never even challenges them.

 

Collins – Management loves John the person. Management also thinks John is a better fit next to a dominant center or elsewhere. John is not strong enough, big enough and is hurt too much to put next to Trae and Clint. They know his athleticism will fade.   I will miss Collins, but all of you haters will be thrilled. Oh well, we've got Gallo.

Everyone's athleticism fades, assuming they ever had any.  It's called aging.  Nique's remained until he blew out his Achilles tendon.  Roundfield maintained his athleticism.  P.S., he was smaller than Collins but he was actually a part of the offense, and they ran plays for him.

 

Bogi – Management is very frustrated with his injury situation. Mad at their medical staff for clearing him. Bogi’s knee issues are suspected to be degenerative and will need to be managed. Bogi’s defense is opportunistic but a net negative in its own right. He is a terrible fit next to Trae. Huerter is not the long term answer and will eventually be on the bench but his defensive fit next to Trae was a necessity. If Bogi plays hard defense 1 night, his knee makes him useless the next….This is why Huerter is starting and why Bogi is the number 1 person on the trading block.  Get rid of Bogi and Huerter, if you can, but be prepared to accept garbage in return, given how much we overpaid for them.

 

Gallo – The team loves everything Gallo brings. They do not love it $21 million worth. Gallo is a financial decision they tried to make at the trade deadline and got mediocre interest at best. A decision was made to waive or trade him in the coming offseason and the team isn’t happy about it. They love him but he just isn’t worth $20 million + a year at this stage of his career.  He was never worth that much money.

 

Cooper – Cooper openly complained about his role and opportunities. He may not be back and could be packaged.    He should complain.  JJ should complain too.  You will never find out how good a player is by burying him in the G-League.

 

Wright – The Hawks love everything about him. For a player the team thought they made a mistake on 10 games in, he is now solidly a Hawk. They can’t overpay him and he may take the money elsewhere (he’s played himself onto a number of rosters now), but the Hawks want to bring him back.   I hope they do, and that he can have more playing time.

 

TLC – If the price is right.    Meh.

 

Hunter – Hunter complained openly about touches and the end of the season was all about him proving he could hold on to the ball and be effective. The jury is out. He improved but is not efficient. The offseason will be big for Hunter and he could be included in a trade deal to get a true star 2 to put next to Trae.  Hopefully the last game was not a fluke.  Hard to succeed with a forward who rebounds so poorly.

 

The team wants 3 things in the offseason.  1) To get bigger, more physical. This starts at both Center and PF. The Hawks will be shopping.  2) The team wants a solid #2 scorer/ball handler. 3) To utilize their draft capital and multiple assets to consolidate bringing in 2 stars. Either 2 elite bigs or 1 elite big and 1 elite 2.

 

The team is very interested in trading out of this year’s draft and using their pick to upgrade. This entire offseason is about getting players who will help them punish teams that double/trap Trae. It would help if Trae didn't dribble himself into traps on the sidelines.  It would also help if he didn't pound the ball until the last couple of seconds on the shot clock, which frequently resulted in turnovers or bad shots.

 

Nate isn’t going anywhere this season.  How unfortunate. He doesn’t like his team’s personal identity and has worked with management to address it this offseason. As though he did anything  to work on the team's identity.  No one knows their role, except Trae.  Expect moves. Everyone is on board.   Why is Schlenk not being replaced, BTW?

 

If you see the Hawks make a move for either Ayton, Gobert (or even A.Davis), then that is just the first domino to fall. Clint, John, Dre, Bogi, Gallo, Cooper could all have a new address next season and we could easily not have a draft pick.  5 out, 3 in is very likely.  Setting ourselves up to be taken advantage of by smarter, gutsier general managers. Danny Ainge is licking his chops.

A. Davis is a frequent resident on the injured list.  I don't understand the fascination with him, as he doesn't play all that much.  Let's make a move for Zion, so we can have two former Pelicans who are always injured.

Venting session above in bold, underlined, italic print.

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Thanks camp!  All this makes sense.  One thing that i think is weird is that Capela got a contract making him the second highest paid non-stretch 5 in the league.   I thought at the time that seemed like an unnecessary overpay.  why do they do that if they don't think he's that good?

I put out the idea that this team wasn't very connected together and seemed like some keys were unhappy.   Some of what you said and a lot of what i saw seems to support that but most folks seemed to disagree with me.   I still feel like that was a huge factor in our wonky season and our playoff demise.   I don't think most of these guys were that happy either with their role or their teammates or whatever.   

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24 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

Thanks camp!  All this makes sense.  One thing that i think is weird is that Capela got a contract making him the second highest paid non-stretch 5 in the league.   I thought at the time that seemed like an unnecessary overpay.  why do they do that if they don't think he's that good?

I put out the idea that this team wasn't very connected together and seemed like some keys were unhappy.   Some of what you said and a lot of what i saw seems to support that but most folks seemed to disagree with me.   I still feel like that was a huge factor in our wonky season and our playoff demise.   I don't think most of these guys were that happy either with their role or their teammates or whatever.   

result of being too deep, but not good enough.

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Looking forward to hearing some of the rumored names we might be targeting! Thanks Camp for all the info over the years!

I'm guessing targets could be some combo of -

Center - Ayton / Gobert / Turner

PF - Zion / Simmons / Siakam / AD

SG - Lavine

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