Spotrac: Krejci deal leaves ATL $1,786,723 under the tax line

[sturt]

11 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Why don't you tell me? 

Was a statement wrapped in a question, of course.

(Answer... it's not... you just added the presumption we'd be able to persuade two players to take a demotion and stick with us instead of looking at their other options. The larger point remains, you're releasing Krejci in order to sign a more veteran player... "b".)

The question then becomes... which?

 

 

Oh. I suppose I should include the remaining free agent 5s... I recall someone ( @Diesel ?) is a Whiteside fan...

 

 

Ya know... the other moving part to all this is... we don't know with certainty which of the above would be open to a vet minimum, versus which ones haven't signed yet because they're not open to that.

Safe to think that most would, but not necessarily... and probably not... all.

[Gray Mule]

STURT

You see it from the bird's view:  "The early bird gets the worm."

I see it from the worm's view:  "The early worm gets eaten."

[sturt]

I don't get the analogy... Melo gets eaten?... but I appreciate the good humor regardless, my friend.

 

[JayBirdHawk]

On 9/29/2022 at 9:46 PM, sturt said:

And the big change noted here is... they have enough room to add a 15th player now w/o being scared of the tax line.

I think one thing you have not considered at all regarding the Luxury Tax line is the contract incentives for both Murray and Capela (more unlikely than not, but still needs to be considered).

Murray:

• 2022-23: LTBE: $0, ULTBE: $1,500,000 ($1 million permformance based, $500k All-Defense)

Capela:

• 2022-23: LTBE $0, ULTBE: $1,000,000 (Conference Finals + 2k min) + $500,000 (30% defensive rebound rate + 2k min) + $500,000 (65% FT%)

[sturt]

18 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

you have not considered at all

Correct.

I'm hard-pressed to imagine that it's a major consideration, but let's say it is for the sake of discussion.

It is true, in that case, that you'd keep the guy getting the partial guarantee (have to pay him anyway, so, sunk cost), anticipating that you'll cut him at mid-season in order to have the space to totally eliminate any possibility to crossing the tax line.

Except... you can't actually do that, ie, totally eliminate any possibility of crossing the tax line... because... you have to have a 14th player, at minimum, for the long-haul (>2 weeks, iirc)... and that, necessarily, will still require you to sign a player for a pro-rated minimum contract that still could potentially push you beyond the tax line.

So, if it's actually the case they're that paranoid/allergic, we should be seeing a deal that actually gets them far enough from the tax line that those incentives officially considered "unlikely incentives" have no bearing. Can't completely dismiss the thought, but dang.... that's scary if true... would reveal ownership as being more financially miserly than had ever been imagined, speaking for myself.

[Spud2nique]

3 hours ago, sturt said:

Mine gravitate toward 25 yr old Eric Paschall.

He’s good, better than Sap at this stage in the floor for sure, I want Sap for leadership and to keep the young fellas on their toes.

[sturt]

1 hour ago, Spud2nique said:

He’s good, better than Sap at this stage in the floor for sure, I want Sap for leadership and to keep the young fellas on their toes.

I want Sap... or someone... for coaching the bigs.

I'm not sure Sap has ever been the demanding type, though, so I'm skeptical that he would keep young fellas on their toes as a peer.

I like that we have Van Exel, though of course, I'm assuming a lot... I have no clue whether he's a good coach or not, and neither would 99% of us sports fans on the internet who complain about or exalt a given assistant coach in any sport. It's just a good feeling to have assistants (like head coaches, for that matter) who've "been there." How important it actually is? Dunno.

Does the eldest member of the roster give you "leadership"... is that person ordinarily considered to be "keeping young fellas on their toes?"

I think it's age and experience, but it's more than that.

Think it's the quality and kind of experiences the player's had, and then, naturally, a matter of their personality.

Think most of us revere Vinsanity as that kind of player you'd want, but we don't have a Vince Carter on the roster right now, and I'm really not sure who on those lists of free agents would qualify (?).

I don't think of Melo as that. I could be convinced.

I don't think of LaMarcus Aldridge as that. I could be convinced.

 

[Spud2nique]

40 minutes ago, sturt said:

I want Sap... or someone... for coaching the bigs.

I'm not sure Sap has ever been the demanding type, though, so I'm skeptical that he would keep young fellas on their toes as a peer.

 

This is true he leads by example but that it leadership in itself. When you see your peers, specially ones that have had success in the league as all stars like SAP, you might wanna follow his leader, agree though vocally he isn’t the mouth that’s for sure, and some actually respond to that better, I dunno.

 

41 minutes ago, sturt said:

Does the eldest member of the roster give you "leadership"..

Not necessarily. I think a vet of 5 years could give you the leadership/advice of a 10 year vet, I think it depends on the individual player’s style in terms of leadership and the maturity of the player as well. Like I’d take Malcolm Brogdon as a vet over Lance Stephenson even though the former has less years of service in the league, well you get it. Nothing against Lance and his blowing in opponent's ears or anything either I’m just saying.

 

44 minutes ago, sturt said:

Think it's the quality and kind of experiences the player's had, and then, naturally, a matter of their personality.

Yup this.

 

45 minutes ago, sturt said:

I don't think of Melo as that. I could be convinced.

I’m not the one to convince you of that. I think Melo is the most overrated star player the league has ever seen to date.

 

45 minutes ago, sturt said:

I don't think of LaMarcus Aldridge

Stilts himself? He’s too choppy in the post at this point, not loving his midrange shot as he ages a ton either. We could do worse, I heard he was a lock to the scrubs? No?

[sturt]

27 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

 

1 hour ago, sturt said:

I don't think of Melo as that. I could be convinced.

I’m not the one to convince you of that. I think Melo is the most overrated star player the league has ever seen to date.

 

1 hour ago, sturt said:

I don't think of LaMarcus Aldridge

Stilts himself? He’s too choppy in the post at this point, not loving his midrange shot as he ages a ton either. We could do worse, I heard he was a lock to the scrubs? No?

 

(Spud, in my comments here, I was specifically speaking about the leadership thing, not about their on-court talent at this stage.)

[Spud2nique]

9 minutes ago, sturt said:

 

(Spud, in my comments here, I was specifically speaking about the leadership thing, not about their on-court talent at this stage.)

[sturt]

Topic: Leadership

Replies: "overrated star" (talent) and "not loving his midrange" (talent)

Confused by the confusion... why did you veer off into comments about their individual talents?

[JayBirdHawk]

On 10/1/2022 at 11:33 AM, Gray Mule said:

We all see the last trade as getting under the tax deadline.  Fine.  But, what if it wasn't?  What if the deal was to obtain Krejci?  Gasp!  Hadn't thought of that!  Couldn't possibly be, could it?  Well, we all see what happened.  We think we know all the reasons, but, do we?  Something else to consider.

@Gray Mule

I don't know if that's the case or not but this 'writer' is thinking along your lines.

 

 

[Spud2nique]

16 hours ago, sturt said:

Topic: Leadership

Replies: "overrated star" (talent) and "not loving his midrange" (talent)

Confused by the confusion... why did you veer off into comments about their individual talents?

I’ll see your confusion… and raise you one. 

[Diesel]

57 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

@Gray Mule

I don't know if that's the case or not but this 'writer' is thinking along your lines.

 

 

OH NO...

Expect 72 graphs with Colors and Excel spreads... all in 9 font...  explaining how we took Krejci in order to waive him quickly and go after ____ big.    Expect the 9 font spread to show clearly how our taking Vitt overseas was simply to use him for his understanding of culture and that he will summarily be cut as soon as we touch down in the A...  It's coming!!

 

 

[sturt]

1 hour ago, JayBirdHawk said:

'writer'

Took note of the quotes.,, hehe

I don't get the impression that young (?) Matthew is as engaged as you are, Jay. Otherwise, in a previous article about the trade, he might have realized that Mo had been pegged as a PF for the Hawks' purposes, not a wing. Indeed, as I scan the posts filed by young (?) Matthew, he's seemed to have been meeting a quota... rapid fire uploads aplenty.

That's not to suggest I don't enjoy young (?) Matthew's blogger posts more often than not. I noticed early in the off-season that he was one of the Hawks bloggers who most typically was tracking with yours truly regarding trade opportunities. I think he may have indicated similar interest in Micic to my own, iirc.

(EDIT: And now that I think a little more about it, I know he was quick to endorse the idea of pursuing KJ Martin.)

It is to suggest, though, that the lack of any insight into the near 100% purpose of the trade to achieve the greatest possible benefit to our tax line situation... and thus, the fact that we were going to take whichever OKC option would result in the greatest payroll deduction, and it happened to be Vit... is a glaring void in his comments.

Of course, I've evolved to prefer to keep Vit after all, which in turn, allows us to fill out the roster to 15 and not tempt fate. But I'm okay, also, with your apparent preference (?) to cut him, and go get a vet who would agree to the vet min.

[sturt]

17 minutes ago, Diesel said:

OH NO...

Expect 72 graphs with Colors and Excel spreads... all in 9 font...  explaining how we took Krejci in order to waive him quickly and go after ____ big.    Expect the 9 font spread to show clearly how our taking Vitt overseas was simply to use him for his understanding of culture and that he will summarily be cut as soon as we touch down in the A...  It's coming!!

 

 

Some people just want to see answers to the algebra questions.

Some people want to see, not just the answers, but the work that led to the answers.

"Do we have to show our work, Mrs. Pelfrey?" "Of course you do--I have to know the why, not just the what."

*bad students heard muttering to themselves, good students were going to do it anyway, so unfettered*

 

Yeah. Won't apologize for any of that, but you're welcome to keep mocking... free country.

OH. And it already came. Past tense. You wouldn't know that, of course, because you only head-faked as-if you were reading my posts, as it turned out. But it's all good, Dies.

[JayBirdHawk]

6 minutes ago, sturt said:

Took note of the quotes.,, hehe

I don't get the impression that young (?) Matthew is as engaged as you are, Jay. Otherwise, in a previous article about the trade, he might have realized that Mo had been pegged as a PF for the Hawks' purposes, not a wing. Indeed, as I scan the posts filed by young (?) Matthew, he's seemed to have been meeting a quota... rapid fire uploads aplenty.

That's not to suggest I don't enjoy young (?) Matthew's blogger posts more often than not. I noticed early in the off-season that he was one of the Hawks bloggers who most typically was tracking with yours truly regarding trade opportunities. I think he may have indicated similar interest in Micic to my own, iirc.

It is to suggest, though, that the lack of any insight into the near 100% purpose of the trade to achieve the greatest possible benefit to our tax line situation... and thus, the fact that we were going to take whichever OKC option would result in the greatest payroll deduction, and it happened to be Vit... is a glaring void in his comments.

Of course, I've evolved to prefer to keep Vit after all, which in turn, allows us to fill out the roster to 15 and not tempt fate. But I'm okay, also, with your apparent preference (?) to cut him, and go get a vet who would agree to the vet min.

I'm just pointing out to Gray someone is thinking along his lines...I'm not reading that much into it at all.
 

[sturt]

1 minute ago, JayBirdHawk said:

not reading that much into it at all.
 

I don't know what that means.

I only said I took note that you used quotes... that's all... no theories on why you did that necessarily... but you did... and I chuckled.

[JayBirdHawk]

17 minutes ago, sturt said:

I don't know what that means.

I only said I took note that you used quotes... that's all... no theories on why you did that necessarily... but you did... and I chuckled.

You wrote 7 paragraphs about the writer's thinking and changing his previous thinking or something to that effect - that's what I meant - I'm not overthinking acquiring Vit.

[JayBirdHawk]

37 minutes ago, sturt said:

But I'm okay, also, with your apparent preference (?) to cut him, and go get a vet who would agree to the vet min.

Not sure how you surmised this? I only added a 4th option to your 3.