Highpozt

I agree with you about traditional PG, SG etc.--- I agree with CBS Sportsline the Hawks Draft grade A --- but this Message board would not be a message board if you did not have the naysayers. The problem I have with the naysayers views are that by saying we did not fill a need is essentially giving no props to Mike Woodson as a player developer. I think Marvin is super versatile and I definitely think he can adjust to being very good at the 3 or 4 position. Al Harrington and JSmooth can play the 3 or 4 and Josh Childress can play the 2 or 3. In fact Mike Woodson was assistant on a CHAMPIONSHIP Detroit Pistons team that featured no true Center at all. Salim is also versatile and I am certain Woodson can get Salim to play as a solid PG and you get the bonus of him being able to shoot the lights out. Critics of Jason Terry watched Dallas fit JT in just fine as the PG and they were a very solid team. Yes we still need a Center through free agency but the rest of the team is getting solid. Popovich got Manu late and Tony Parker and they just won a championship not because those players were great but because Popovich is a player developer supreme --- lets hope Mike Woodson is because the talent level increased considerably with this draft.

I agree with CBS Sportsline Draft A grade --- but this Message board would not be a message board if you did not have the naysayers. The problem I have with the naysayers views are that by saying we did not fill a need is essentially giving no props to Mike woodson as a player developer. I think Marvin is super versatile and I definitely think he can adjust to being very good at the 3 or 4 position. Al Harrington and JSmooth can play the 3 or 4 and Josh Childress can play the 2 or 3. In fact Mike Woodson was assistant on a CHAMPIONSHIP Detroit Pistons team that featured no true Center at all. Salim is also versatile and I am certain Woodson can get Salim to play as a solid PG and you get the bonus of him being able to shoot the lights out. Critics of Jason Terry watched Dallas fit JT in just fine as the PG and they were a very solid team. Yes we still need a Center through free agency but the rest of the team is geeting solid. Popovich got Manu late and Tony Parker and they just won a championship not because those players were great but because Popovich is a player developer supreme --- lets hope Mike Woodson is because the talent level increased considerably with this draft.

Your point was ------- Hell, if you all you need is a coach to make players to do anything then why not just hire a proven coach with more experience? You seem to believe a coach can get any player to do anything. NBA coaches don't give PG's the vision of PG's. My point is ----- No a coach can't make players do anything but a bad coach can make a decent players do nothing ---- ask Lon Kruger and the rest of the Hawks coaches over the last 3 years. I have not decided whether Woodson is good or not but he does have experiece --- he has experience under one of the best coaches in the NBA (Larry Brown) who prides himself on player development --- what I am saying is that his responsibility with such a young team is to develop talent --- yes you say Lue, Ivey and Diaw have no talent ---- While I am saying that is just flat negative ---- in fact Lue was a good point guard last year --- not very good --- not excellent, but good -- Royal Ivey was a rookie so to just throw him in the "no talent" pool is just negativity not yet warranted. Diaw is the only one who has potential that we have not seen. Your Point Is ------- the coach is supposed to take the players skills and mold them to make the player the best as possible. Parker and Ginobilli have skills that Lue and Ivey simply don't have. Heck, I was hearing about how Ginobilli was the European Kobe Bryant... Must have been doing something right before he got to SA. My Point is ----- A coach is also responsible for improving skills -- he makes players adhere to a system/strategy that best fits his talent. He develops players. Parker was drafted late and not considered that special --- Popovich flat out developed Parker as a top notch PG --- The Hawks should get Marvin Williams and a PG through the 2nd rnd or free agency --- they also have several options at Center through free agency.

Tyrone Lue, Royal Ivey, and all the rest of the player development has everything to do with Coach Woodson. I think more important than whether Ty Lue and Royal Ivey are the best PG is if Woodson can get everyone to maximize their skills he can make Lue and Ivey vert serviceable. Chauncey was not Chauncey until Larry Brown --- Amare was not Amare until D'Antoni ---- Tony Parker was not TP until Pop --- Manu was not Manu and so forth. Not that Lue or Ivey are as good as any of the above mentioned but if you think that JT would not be a better player under Larry Brown vs Lon Kruger, and all the rest of the coaches the Hawks have had, then why have a coach. Get Marvin Williams the best baller in the Draft and get the next best PG in the 2nd rd (this draft is PG rich) and use Free agency to get a Center. Marvin can back JSmooth and Harrinton at the 3 and 4 and we will have the deepet 3 and 4 rotation with skill in the league.

Get Marvin first and wait for desperate traders for his skills. Even if you don't get a blockbuster trade you still have the best baller in the draft. By the way only lopsided trades in favor of the Hawks or Marvin stays here

The problem I have with this view is not that you havve no faith in Diaw, Lue or Ivey but that you have no faith in Mike Williams player development skills --- If coach Williams cannot make players out of this very young team we might as well end Hawks discussion for the duration of coach Williams contract. Popovich and Larry Brown don't have nearly the most talent but game strategy and player development is excellent. Remember what was said about Jason Terrys PG skills --- he doesn't look that bad in Dallas

With the Hawks draft history I can see us passing on Williams and he becomes the best player of this draft --- besides what is wrong with depth at the 3 and 4 you can't pass on a superstar

Bucks almost certainly will take Bogut ---- So here is this player named Marvin Williams who has the best chance to be a superstar in this draft --- Hawks have to do it. Yes the Hawks have Harrington, Smith, Childress however Diaw and Childress can play the two and Harrington and JSmooth the 3 or 4 while Marvin makes the bench real decent by backing up the 3 and the 4. With the free agency cap room we should go after a center like Dalembert and with the second pick in the 2nd round you get the best pg left --- this draft is rich with pg. The hope is that coach is great at player development and Royal Ivey and Tyrone Lue are ready to run the point.

I agree I would rather have Jaric are Watson but Lue, Delk and Ivey will be fine with Bogut,(if we get him) Harrington and a more experienced Childress and JSmooth --- they bring their offense when needed and they all play very solid man defense --- the 3 pg nor any other players look good on defense with no one manning the paint. I am not suggesting Lue, Delk or Ivey are some savior at PG, but they are not liabilities. Collier and Drob. at starting C are liability. Bogut and a possibility at Tyson Chandler would make the pg look a lot better.

Assuming we get #1 and select Bogut --- can this line-up make the playoffs next year ---- this line-up could look better if we could land a Tyson Chandler or one of the other mid-level free agents of course ray Allen is floating but could or would we even persue him and would he even consider Atlanta probably not. But lets add in Chandler since we have a good amount of cap room and Chandler is reasonable. I think this line-up can: IF Woodson is very good player developer after 1 year of head coaching --- IF Childress and JSmoot continue to tear it up like the last 7 or 8 games --- IF bogut is a baller as projected --- and lastly is IF Lue, Delk and Ivey become pure at PG Bogut/Pedrag/Collier Harrington/Chandler/Ekezie J. Smooth/Dontae Smith J. Childress/Diaw Lue/Delk/Ivey

In the NBA particularly in the East a big man is a rarity and a big man that can play even moreso. While Deron and Chris Paul would improve the Hawks what will the Hawks have at Center Drob. and Collier again which is atrocious at best. But if you stay with Lue, Delk and Ivey at PG and add Bogut IMO you look a lot better. Lue and Delk are not great but with good players around them they would look significantly better and both can score if you need that element --- if we could get 2 first rounders for our #1 and maybe our #2 I would consider it but I think the Bigs are critical.

The Hawks Rookies will be solid next year --- Josh Smith and Childress will have 1 year of a lot NBA playing time under their belts --- Harrington will be the veteran --- he has been solid. Royal Ivey, Delk and Lue are not great but all can be solid pg with the right players around them. But I wonder if Andrew Bogut is just a slightly hyped up Predrag Drobnjak or will he be one of the best centers in the East?? IMO We do not have much of a choice but to take Bogut if we get the first pick --- the next bext big man based on severall mock drafts is Martynas Andriuskevicius and make no mistake he is gigantic but so was Priest Lauderdale. Bogut is proven, the next big man is Chris Taft from Pitt. and he is only 6'10" and really a PF. Bogut is the only choice for the Hawks at #1. This draft looks good only if Childress and J Smooth continue to play like they have the last 7 or 8 games --- also if Bogut can play immediately. Hopefully we can get a mid level free agent Bogut/Pedrag/Collier Harrington/Ekezie J. Smooth/Dontae Smith J. Childress/Diaw T. Lue/Delk/Ivey We should be able to compete in the East the intangible is Mike Woodson --- after one year as head coach and a bunch of kids can he become a super player developer if so we will compete for a playoff spot even if it is the 7th or 8th slot.

If we get Bogut I hope Bogut is the truth particularly on defense ---- I am not as down on Lue as you are -- he will be fine with Bogut, Harrington and a more experienced Childress and JSmooth --- he brings his offense when needed and he can play very solid man defense --- he nor any other players look good on defense with no one manning the paint. I am not suggesting Lue is some savior at PG, but he is not a liability. Collier and Drob. at starting C are liability.

Lue will be fine with Bogut, Harrington and a more experienced Childress and JSmooth --- he brings his offense when needed and he can play very solid man defense --- he nor any other players look good on defense with no one manning the paint. I am not suggesting Lue is some savior at PG, but he is not a liability. Collier and Drob. at starting C are liability.

I agree but I hope the long term speculation you mentioned is wrong --- After what we have experienced the last 8 seasons there is no reason to think otherwise however I think Bogut and Tyron Lue are key, first we hve to get Bogut --- I think he would have immediate impact particularly in the east ---- Lue is proven to be a very functional point guard ---- Childress, JSmooth and Harrington will only be better Chemistry who knows????

Man that sounds awful --- but finally we are pitiful enough to get the most ping-pong balls in the lottery ---of course that does not guarantee the #1 pick but at least our odds are good. I do believe with Childress, AH & J Smooth that a solid Center will move this team to the middle of the top 8 Eastern teams. The question is can Bogut make that much difference?????

The lineup is just to show the players and not particularly who starts --- in fact I think J Smooth can start and be effective at 2,3 or 4 depending on the circumstances. As far as the trade it was actually Diop and Gooden but I would be more fascinated if Eddie Curry hits the open FA market or is in trade talks. As far as your opinion on draft picks I would only say we have not been in the playoffs for 6 seasons --- I think we have enough up and comers we need some ready to go ballers right now. With J Smith, Childress, Ivey and Diaw I think we have some real upside/potential if Coach Woodson can get a system that maximizes his players skills and talent.

Walker 14 million and Collier 1 million and a draft pick for Curry 3.8 million and Chandler 4.8 million would work for this season --- Chicago would have to add some loose change players like Piatkowski or take a cap hit for the remainder of the season Of course they would probably require our lottery pick (do we need another lottery pick) --- the problem would be next season either you would have to try to resign both which would maximize our cap or trade Chandler. Chicago Likes Curry but recognize he will require a high salary next year --- Chandler salary should be negotiable because his play has been sub-par. With the team below I would feel comfortable going to battle in the East. Childress and Josh look like they are potentially very good and Harrington and Curry are already very solid. You stated we would have a weakness at point guard --- I think you would have enough offensive weapons that you would be able to allow the PG to be a PG --- he would just dish the ball --- besides I don't think Ivey or Diaw are bad PG and they bring just enough offense to be effectives. PG Ivey/Diaw/Delk/Anderson SG Childress/Delk/Diaw/J Smooth SF Harrington/J Smooth/ T Chandler/Dontae Smith PF T Chandler/Harrington/O Ekiz C Eddie Curry/Collier or Drob/Tyson Chandler/Willis

We need a center awfully bad particularly to play defense and rebound --- why not send Walker to a playoff contender and let DeSagana Diop come here --- of course we will need other Pieces or at least a 1st round draft pick --- Walker with L. James would be very attractive to them --- Walker is better than Drew Gooden --- Then Gooden comes here also with this trade and we give up a Collier or Drobnjak. and then maybe our 2nd round pick. We need the big body in the middle and Diop although a risk has great size and has shown he can block shots. Even more attractive is Walker for Eddie Curry and maybe add in Lue, Collier and/or Diaw and a 2nd (might have to give up a 1st or future 1st since this one will be a 2005 will be a lottery pick) rounder try to get Tyson Chandler. Eddie already is a good center and Tyson has a upside. We then have: PG Ivey/Diaw/Delk/Anderson SG Childress/Delk/Diaw/J Smooth SF Harrington/J Smooth/ T Chandler/Dontae Smith PF T Chandler/Harrington/O Ekiz C Eddie Curry/Collier or Drob/Tyson Chandler/Willis

As much as I liked Kenny in his early days I would much rather see Royal Ivey get broken in this year --- Ivey is a better defender and will pay dividends buy mid year --- a guy like JR has so much raw talent the only way he gets better is not by watching but by playing ---- Childress went to school to learn all the fundamentals so he would be ready to play NBA ball so he should definitely be in the game --- lastly Diaw who out of the above I am frightened that he will be the only bust --- from what I have seen thus far he still can't shoot a 18 foot jumper --- You would think that if you get to year 2 in the NBA that you would spend an enourmous amount of time improving what may ultimately get you thrown out the league. But i think this team gets out of the cellar faster buy developing the rookies than not developing them and letting veterans who will be sharpely declining or be gone from the NBA in a year or 2.

Why waste time on Willis, Barry and Anderson --- this team would be better served to let Royal, JR, Diaw and Childress get Broken in and by mid season we might have some ballers to go with Walker and Harrington --- the veterans should come off the bench.

I recognize he is 35 however he is not a worn and torn 35 because of his lack of minutes over the last 2 years. The slight of build also typically gets more mileage out of their bodies. KA has always been more crafty than a super athlete which is why Stockton and Marc Jackson lasted so long. If KA can be a true pg he will pay dividends for the Hawks.

After years in the NBA I still think KA has never reached his potential. He was labeled as one of the best pgs in NY and could do everything on the court expected of a pg --- lets hope at year 11 it happens with the Hawks

See Hoopsworld article stating that Dampier said the Hawks were just not a winning situation. You know your team has a bad reputation when a when a very average player like Dampier who plays for the lowly Warriors will not even consider the Hawks with MAXIMUM SALARY (not NBA max but for him the most money he will ever see) and Antoine and Harrington as his front court mates. While he may be the best player left he is not worth the headache --- his effort was questioned with Golden State so what is he going to do if the Hawks are struggling. Not that Dampier playing to his potential would not be a vast improvement --- but he is avoiding the Hawks like the worst place in the NBA (???? I think we have the Clippers and Warriors beat --- I said think. It is a bitter/sweet proposition if Dampier comes I think Dampier, Harrington and Walker would be a very solid frontcourt with playoff potential ---- however a player that is avoiding you the way he is --- do you really want to beg for a disaster

Antoine is a victim of some bad publicity. AW is not a super superstar, but he is baller. Because he does the shimmy after a shot and because he played for the Celtics (a team you basically love or absolutely hate) AW is not a player you would embrace. But he is a scorer that can get his own shot -- he is a strong rebounder -- he is a excellent passer particularly from the PF position --- an he gives a strong effort. The biggest negative is that he shoots to much which I think a strong coach will find your high percentage spots on the floor and let a baller go to work. Maybe I have to much confidence in Woodson but he has a reputation of being in control of his players. Walker, Harrington and Dampier? would be pretty solid particularly in the East --- of course not including the Shaq led Heat