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Remember, it's a rumor that we're not high on Wiseman as a club (now if this is true, you can question if whether its because "muh we don't like big men enough").

That makes things tricky, nonetheless (I think it's also been said we're not high on Edwards either, which may erase him).

All in all, it smells like a trade out if #1 or #2 is drawn and it lines up well for a trade.

That bleacher report "offer" must be a joke, must be.

I'd be willing to trade a pick for Beal, maybe a player too but 3 wings plus the pick is laughable.

I think it was said recently that we're not very high on Wiseman.

Could easily see a trade out if we draw #1 this year. Problem is, for who...

I was meaning a 2/3 and not necessarily a free agent, but those guys with the qualifications I named...if they exist, are going to obviously be hard to acquire.

I actually like Donovan Mitchell and his game but I don't think trying to fit him and Trae would work because of Trae's limitations and Donovan's size, even if he's a good defender. 

Your ideal case would probably be to acquire a young veteran that can play good defense, is 6'5"-6'6", shoots the 3 well, and can cut off ball/dribble drive at least a little... Now who fits this...I don't know.

I'd like to see Reddish grow some more, but it doesn't hurt to add another wing.

2 minutes ago, High5 said:

The small ball lineup, featuring our core players, was mostly a success based on the numbers. They were +5.3 per 100 possessions together (according to basketball-reference). Considering it included 2 rookies and no one over the age of 22, it's safe to say it's a lineup that will continue to improve and will likely be critical to our success down the road. The key is using it at the appropriate times, which will be easier once Capela is available. 

Yeah, I don't think that the idea of playing small should be discarded entirely but it's something that should be a matchup by matchup basis. Against centers that are excellent boarders and aren't a liability if you pull them out, play big, against centers that are a liability if you pull them out, play small in stretches to exploit that.

Just now, Buzzard said:

Do you agree with the coach then. Direct quote from Pierce three days ago.

He still does not know where Hunter should play.

https://hoopshype.com/team/atlanta-hawks/

There's no question he's wrong there. I think he's a combo forward in which the work should focus on transitioning him to mainly being a 3. I think he's a 4 in small lineups for matchup purposes, not full time, but a lot of this forum will fully disagree with ANY 4 time, so it's not really worth a serious discussion, period.

I don't think he's a 2, and the argument I've seen about playing him at the 2 earlier this year is silly. He's a 3/4 and I've even seen others describe him as the same.

23 minutes ago, Buzzard said:

I cannot find the stat that says 20% of the time. But I did find most used lineups.

The lineup Hunter was used most in was:

Collins, Huerter, Reddish, Hunter, Young.

And its not close. That lineup was used in 22 games for 205 Minutes. The next closest was 15 games for 69.2 Minutes with Bembry, Hunter. Jones, Parker, Young. Looking at this, LP was all over the map with his lineups.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/lineup_finder.cgi?request=1&match=single&lineup_type=5-man&output=total&is_playoffs=N&game_num_min=0&game_num_max=99&player_id=huntede01&order_by=diff_pts

Now take into account that Collins has only played 41 games and maybe you see my point of view.

Just scroll down on the page for Hunter and you'll find it. It even has him playing shooting guard.

I won't see your point because I just don't agree. I think Pierce failed him in 19/20 but it wasn't in the mode of MUH WE NEEDED TO PLAY BIG!!! Maybe it was a factor, but it was far from the only one.

37 minutes ago, Buzzard said:

When Hunter blows up next season at SF, some will claim its because LP made him play PF and that helped his development. What ever it takes to justify LP as our coach. Even if its playing rookies out of position for over half the season.

Another topic of irritation with him that you pointed out: LP thinks everyone that hits the floor ( all nine or ten players ) should take at least one three. As long as he is our coach, I thinks it a fair statement to say we will always need more shooters.

Considering that basketball-reference only had him at 20% of the time at PF, I still really don't think making him an exclusive SF is going to have much to do with it. That doesn't mean that other mistakes weren't made with him, along with the adjustment from a slower system to going faster, and playing more per week (he was thoroughly HORRENDOUS on back to backs early in the season)...

Pierce actually did try to give Hunter some playmaking responsibility, or at least PNR responsibility, unless my memory is so bad I'm mixing things up.

He eventually took it away though and admitted that he was going too far with him too soon with things to do.

Edit: I mean, if you want to be real and not look at how YOU want to how rookies look, especially with a guy that's not supposed to be big offensively anyway, even if I disagree that the small ball 4 thing wasn't that big a deal, Pierce did actually screw up his rookie season. Here, you have a young wing, that's supposed to be defending one of the better offensive players (at least at times), he's sometimes playing the 4, transitioning to a faster scheme (as Virginia plays slower than NBA ball), and he also has some PNR duties. It was all too much ultimately.

51 minutes ago, Buzzard said:

I blame Pierce for DeAndre's worse than expected rookie season and think Hunter has done about as well as can be expected for a rookie who is only 6'7" and 235 pounds. When you have a coach that would rather play guys under 6'8" at PF you will be a weak rebounding team. There is no getting around this unless they are Barkley or Rodman.

I don't think that had much, if anything to do with it. I'm going to take Supes side again here somewhat. The ideal spot for Hunter is SF but as of his rookie season he was really a combo forward/small ball 4 that was learning how to play 3 since he was a small ball 4 and not 3 at Virginia.

I've explained my side but I will again. I think playing more, especially on back to backs early, fatigued him, and Pierce admitted giving him too much responsibility with PNR (the former is something I've said before, the latter isn't). I think both has a lot more to do with it. He started looking better, period, when his responsibilities were lessened. Not when your true center was in, just when the responsibilities were lessened.

Finally got a look at Killian Hayes recently. Kind of convinced that if he eventually shoots, he'll be a top 5 player in this weak draft. 

He wouldn't be the best fit here, but if he were the pick, the idea would be that he'd be a Harden in OKC/Manu/D'Angelo Russell type off the bench (that was who the guy that did the video compared him to) type to develop and potentially maybe use as a trade asset (or maybe make others on the team a trade asset).

Still like, given that we might end up going without a veteran PG, looking at Tyrese Haliburton more. If that kid's shot translates, I really could see him being that glue guy type that doesn't need the ball to impact winning and he's a little older. Probable bench player in this case, but would make more sense as a 25-30 MPG player. 

5 hours ago, macdaddy said:

No doubt that there is a lot of effort going toward improving the situation but we are still way behind in GA (and really the world).   The idea that anyone can get a test is a long, long way from reality.   This is AJC today:

https://www.ajc.com/news/local/rapid-virus-tests-come-atlanta-testing-slowly-ramps/9cywuAPIcL3PEYouFOvwbI/

 

 

They're at over 5000 a day now. Antibody tests will provide more clarity. I think my area specifically is over 3000 now but there's multiple major hospitals. There really hasn't been a lot of visits to the virtual screener (with at least one major hospital), so at least for one major area the tests that are positive are probably closer to accurate than you'd think.

CDC botched their first testing kit and spent too long messing with that. 

44 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

Rapid testing is a great solution to a lot of this.  i just don't know the feasibility of it.   We'd be talking about huge numbers of tests to do it widespread and GA can't really test anyone right now.

This is old news relatively. It might still not be at ideal levels, but last week I was reading about how the big hospitals in the state have all partnered up and are working on ramping up testing a bunch and the ramp up started as of last week (and now I see an article about how AU Health has taken a few Albany patients). In fact, this is how I know that Augusta's test numbers are probably closer to accurate than some cases (maybe not dead on, but closer than some cases). The big hospital in the city has been rolling for a while with testing. There's just over 200 positive combined between all of the major hospitals, but for the combined area in GA (as some probably came from other counties), that's actually not a whole lot for the second biggest city in the state and bordering counties IMHO.

Anyway, here's my opinion as of right now. As I look deeper and depending on how the lottery balls fall, my opinion might change, as I've only looked some...

Tiers:

"Just take BPA, dang it, we're not even close to complete as a team and we badly need a 2nd star":

Anthony Edwards - Redshirt him. This is an very raw product that received awful coaching and no structure IMO from Crean. The only way this case has a shot of having a happy ending (JMO) in Atlanta and not an Oladipo like ending (where he breaks out elsewhere), would be if he were brought along extremely slowly, even slower than Reddish was. Do what the Spurs did with Lonnie Walker.

NOTE: I'm NOT putting Wiseman here because I don't trust him! I get a bad rub here.

(And I know that NONE of that would happen, that's not realistic with a high lotto guy)

The best play for the 2020 draft most likely (this is where I think most would land here and I'm here myself), in order:

Tyrese Haliburton - Other than the shot possibly being a hinderance, there's a lot to like for me here even though he's a PG (although he can play the wing with his height if he can add some bulk). If his shot translates I see a glue guy type that can help affect winning.
Obi Toppin - I don't love him at the NBA level, but his floor is super high and he likely becomes instant impact offense off the bench as soon as he's there. Not a great fit for the Hawks, but this draft is awful.
Killian Hayes - I haven't seen video of him yet, but based off description that I've read, he fits. The backups of Trae Young definitely need to be guys that have much, much better defensive potential than him. If we choose to go PG in the draft, I'd rather Haliburton as he's a little older though.
Onyeka Okongwu - Honestly need to see him too but others have said he fits our system, and if you want to go big man, I'd actually rather him than Wiseman.
RJ Hampton - I'll be honest, need to watch him as well (I really haven't looked much at NBA draft stuff at all), but if you were to go with a PG/CG in this draft, I would go Haliburton, Hayes, Hampton, and probably more before looking at Cole Anthony. Could always turn out to be wrong there though!

Big man plays:

Obi Toppin
Onyeka Okongwu

SG/SF plays if you want to play the I don't trust Hunter at all game, non-Edwards camp and this one's not in order (and likely doesn't include everyone):

Saddiq Bey - Was a dead eye 3 point shooter this year, played for a winning program that plays unselfish basketball in Villanova, 3 and D prospect.
Devin Vassell - Good 3 and D prospect.
Jaden McDaniels - Purely an upside play.

Honestly, I'm even more convinced that this draft is the one where playing the game of trading down if you get a pick in the top 5 would be a good idea after looking at this. Don't think this year's the time to be playing the upside lottery, maybe this is your year that you pick up a player that will help affect you in winning ways. I would try to grab another asset in the trade for sure though, even if it's not a player.

I also need to see more Deni Avdija. Other than Haliburton and Edwards (for obvious reasons if you've followed along), he was the guy that I had seen a couple minutes of today. He interests me some, but I'm uncertain.

If we're truly going to make 20/21 a win or die year for multiple people, we don't have the time to facilitate another major learning year from a "risk" prospect, even off the bench. The play with Edwards is honestly a redshirt rookie year where he sees minimal to 0 time on the floor and more time in the G-league, which has a high unlikelihood of happening in any case, but that's what should be the play.

The way I see it, is if he doesn't bust, the likelihood is very high he's like Victor Oladipo, except not as far along and Victor Oladipo truly wasn't Victor Oladipo for YEARS. I think it's very likely he gets traded before he reaches his potential, maybe even traded more than once.

I'm also a no on Wiseman however, and I'm an "uncertain" on Toppin. 

8 hours ago, sturt said:

 

Did you find something the rest of us didn't?

 

 

Mainly a started by Supes rumor, but he actually struck paydirt last time and I'm vaguely remembering him not being alone.

Regardless, I don't think the Hawks leave the offseason without adding 1 multi year deal that's longer than 2 years unless it turns out to not be win or die for 20/21.

Since I obviously played in with diverting this some, I'll divert it back...

How would we all feel about an offseason of potentially...

Yogi Ferrell on a short, small deal.

Montrezl Harrell for 4 years at 17-20 million. (I know others aren't a fan, but it's a rumor that we're in)

Jae Crowder on a short, loaded deal.

27 minutes ago, Spud2nique said:

One thing I’m somewhat questioning with man is shot selection. Can someone shed some light on this. He seems like he can press to put them up if they aren’t going. True in many cases even with stars, but ideally, I’d like my young guys to grow in a system before becoming volume guys. Having said that, if you aren’t part of a Kentucky type program you probably only have one star in the squad and he is forced into the volume role.

 

Crean provided no structure and no discipline. Although that team wasn't necessarily great, they were much better than blowing multiple big 2nd half leads. I couldn't care less that there were several newcomers. Keep those big leads.

I keep saying it, I think he'll be fine (it just might take a while, and we really do not have a while if it is win or die in 20/21) but a lot of why depends on how much you weight if Crean truly isn't any good anymore or what. I think we're going to find out quickly here as well with Crean/Georgia. There's still interesting pieces there for that team but there's really absolutely nothing there right now to give me hope that a realistic leap is coming, and you usually figure out fast if a coach is going to actually help you (outside of recruiting). He basically has one more year at best and if there's nothing with the 3rd year, it's likely that Georgia found an even worse purgatory than the bore of Mark Fox teams (in which was only not really boring because of players like Frazier and Maten, or earlier in his tenure, Trey Thompkins). 

By WS with Dragic, I meant defensive win shares.

Edwards isn't going to be like Bennett or Hezonja but it wouldn't surprise me if he was somewhat like Oladipo in which it takes several years for him to get to his best caliber play (and maybe a kick in the pants by being traded once or twice). Then if he were to emerge that way, you can most certainly question the value of a 6'5" (maybe less) CG that finally is scoring efficiently, but maybe isn't consistently D'ing up like I believe Oladipo can or even Mitchell.

Needless to say, he'd still go about 10-15 in a regular draft because although his measurables aren't totally like a Reddish, he still is very athletic (despite looking like to me he has 0 clue how to use it well outside of transition, you had Georgia fans whining and crying about him taking too many jumpers, but there was several times where he looked like a total fool in half court offense inside as well before I blew up at Crean and had to bar myself from even looking) and has a 6'9" wingspan, and this is also why you have KB consistently telling us for years now that relying on drafts and younger players is very foolish.

For the Hawks purposes, he doesn't make a lot of sense if they are in win or die as we think for 20/21, period (and this is your TL/DR statement here). As of now, I don't think he's Morant/Trae like (except at SG), I think he's somebody that suffered from poor coaching and didn't get the structure that he may have needed. 

But I think his NBA career will end up fine in the very long term, unless it turns out I'm way off on Crean. If I'm way off, then he might be a 5* bust relatively.

14 hours ago, sturt said:

I'm open to Dunn, but I think the price tag will be too much.

Dunn is an elite defensive player. I like that, but I'll settle for good.

Augustin is good. But I prefer Yogi because he's younger and because I also think he'll be one of the better values on the market.

And/but I'm also among the seemingly many who are on the Tyrese Haliburton bandwagon, who can genuinely be both a legitimate back-up to Trae and a legitimate 4th or 5th wing.

Ah I forgot Ferrell. He probably jumps to the top of the list of interest. I don't think he's all that great defensively either. Likely better than Trae, but his size probably causes problems. If his shot were to return I think he'd be a steal.

I'd probably go in order, Ferrell, Dragic, and Augustin. At least on basketball-reference, Dragic surprisingly has more WS than I would've thought. But money and years might be too much and he might still want to start.

Although this isn't the FA year to do it for sure, I think Schlenk is desperate enough to try to improve that he'd be willing to fork out one big FA contract that has multiple years on it. Then maybe one that is very short term.

I think Edwards is going to be fine, but a lot of why is I think Tom Crean is a completely horrible coach that's going to get fired sooner rather than later (I'm not neutral here given that Crean has made me feel some hot rages in 2020, but kg isn't either, being a Georgia Tech fan). If Crean isn't so bad, then my theory gets a lot less likely.

It would not surprise me if he "is" like Oladipo with not as good defense, and it's a case of he doesn't start actually getting notably good until he's several years into his NBA career, maybe after a kick in the pants to boot as well with a trade or two.

Honestly, that's not the type that we need to draft (as we'd likely trade that type), that's the type we need to try to single out like Indiana did. Unfortunately, I don't know who that "guy" might be in this case. I'm not totally against him, but you'd need to see if he's okay with being a bench player imo...

30 minutes ago, sturt said:

Dealbreaker.

Pretty much everyone we sign this summer has to be either a proven defensive asset, or someone that is young and is suspected to become one based on scouting reports out of college.... and/but especially so, Trae's back-up.

 

Then if you want a PG that potentially plays good defense, you pretty much have to look to PG in the draft and bet on Trae being grown enough mentally to not need a veteran backup. I'm a "no" to Kris Dunn so I don't see any D up PGs that are worth the time in free agency.

If Dragic doesn't still want to start, he's probably your best backup PG option in free agency this year (there's unideal things here though, like the years and if he'd rather just go back to Miami), and although he and Huerter would be a good start to a good bench unit, Dragic isn't exactly a defender himself. From what I know and the way it looks, the options are Teague, Augustin, maybe Dragic, or draft a backup (at least for now) PG in the draft and gamble that Trae has grown enough mentally that he doesn't need an older guy backing him up (potentially after trading down as well).

If the backup in the draft route happens, my first options honestly are Haliburton and Hayes. Cole Anthony did get hurt but when he was in he did not look good at all this college basketball season.