sillent
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Posts posted by sillent
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I too feel like we need a backup sf but I want to see Sims(If he is the type of player I think he is) and West(Can't Knock Da Hustle). We are a pretty solid 10 deep as we speak so why not get a good potential all around big(who can show something barring injury & etc.(Joe Smith & Collins are probably rentals so developing another talented young big may be helpful ) and some one that does not beg for alot of minutes but still brings it every night(He picked up some of the chase down blocks reminiscent of what Smoove did with the exception of last year). He has definitely earned his right and is a hometown favorite underdog(Which as a Hawks fan it just wouldn't feel right without having an underdog somewhere/somehow). Sometimes too much fire power is a bad thing and can cause chemistry problems but if Juan is willing to take a reserve role and maybe fill that 15 spot. If Juan comes he may be coming alone due to possible salary.
ROSTER
Bibby/Teague/Crawford
Johnson/Crawford/West/Evans
Williams/Evans/Johnson/West/Smoove
Smoove/Smith/Sims/Horford/Williams/Pachulia/Morris
Horford/Pachulia/Collins/Morris/Sims
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The point of us not having a SuperStar type player is valid, however the Hawks don't have a weakness either truth be told. This roster is solid from top to bottom. And the starters that the Hawks do have outside of Bibby are Very Good players - perhaps not spectacular but well above average at each position with Bibby being an average player in his own right.
I don't see 47 wins as a plateau. In fact during our preseason predictions thread I'll probably go 50+ on the nose.
Agreed and Teague, Crawford, Mo, Smith, and Zaza don't look too bad either. Everybody has their subjective opinions but all in all great read/article.
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Jeff Teague/Mike Bibby
Jamal Crawford
Marvin Williams/Maurice Evans
Josh Smith
Al Horford/Zaza Pachulia
No offense to JJ but our starting line up still looks good with Crawford and Teague being a year acclimated to our system. Marvin and Josh should be ready to take the team into their hands with yet another year of improvement and finally reach or be close to reaching their prime age. We have more money to resign Horford(who should also continue to improve) and a sleeper(like JJ once was but for a lower contract).
If JJ resigns great!! If he doesn't great timing. JJ can no longer hold our young vets back or allow them to hide their faults without correcting them. Horford and Smoove know they have the talent to compete with the greats in this league(that's what made the Boston series so interesting). Marvin will have a chance to once again prove his professionalism and step up to what ever role is needed to keep us at a high level. Teague and Crawford as long as the chemistry is good are going to definitely be X factors for this team(YEAH I SAID IT).
Their games compliment our bigs well and like Kenny said during our draft review about Crawford and Teague we got more players that do what this team already does(I know he wasn't meaning it as a compliment but I bet both players will enlighten him). From our bigs Horford, Smoove ,Marvin(may be exception with passing abilities) to Teague and Crawford we have a very fast pace athletic team that has good court vision(dangerous!!). They all are unselfish Crawford may be exception but believe me this team gives him and his game a different dynamic (He can now seriously play puppet master on the offensive end).
So why the panic button!! This is what BK/Sund built this team for(versatility).
As for JJ he is just like every employee that has put his company on his back for a good tenure and feels that the company should do like wise for all his hard work and dedication. Have you ever opened or revived a new or struggling company? For all the stress mentally and physically that's involved you eventually want to be able to look in the mirror and say it was all worth it. A Championship(If everything fell in our favor this coming season) may or may not do it for you depending on how much it took out of you(Although you are recognized as a piece it is still the company that reaps more of the benefits). Everyone has their own goals. Look at how many one and done's players their are like Trevor Ariza, James Posey, Lamar Odom was close to being that. Although they do/did not have the same roles as JJ they are still human and want to feel appreciated. Obviously y'all can tell I'm going through a similar situation at my job(Star of department Yada yada yada yada) so yeah, I feel JJ and you got to do what you feel is best.
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Thanks! I've written it before, and I'll write it again. Since the trade for Mike Bibby, the Atlanta Hawks' fortunes have done nothing but get better and better...compared to prior Mike Bibby. I know he can't defend....(and he skips with the ball - I love that one) but until people realize that locker room presence, experience, and being a leader is just, if not, more important than defending the pick n roll....he'll get a bad rap around here. I'm glad he's back.
:laughing5: It's a legal hesitation crossover but it is very unique and he probably is the only one in the league that does it like that. It is also very affective which is why a slower guy(mainly age at this point) like Bibby can drive(again age limits this option) or get a good open look afterwards.
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Just a quick question. Can you name the top 10 players in the league? Where is JJ? Where is Wade?
We are currently as of now considered to be contenders for the ECF (some may agree/disagree but it is in discussion). If we keep following the path we have for the last 5 years it is probable. Are you seriously saying that adding/swapping JJ for Wade would not make us contenders. The question,topic, discussion is that simple. Contenders do not always win it all hence the name CONTENDERS but they do Contend!!
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Yes I read the Bibby article and this one as well and its nice to see some rational articles about our players. Marvin is a good solid player and its unfortunate that some fans want to bash him for BK making the mistake of not drafting Paul or Deron. Its unfortunate and somewhat insane; but we must remember the word fan is a derivative of the word fanantic. So it should go without saying that some player haters are insane or at best irrational....
Marvins a solid player well worth the 40 mill we signed him for. And until we get a better starting SF there is no reason to not support one of our own; who also happens to be selfless enough to play his game while allowing others to dominate the popularity polls without whining one second about it.
He is a solid overall player who works hard on improving his game, a team player, and a glue guy as stated in the article. Great post!
I agree with your post but again I have to say if Teague pans out I will take Marvin, Horford, and Teague over Paul/Deron. BK planned for a future team not a future player. Would you take a Championship with a great team or a Hall of Famer but no means to provide any extra support.
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No. Our best defender is still Smoove followed by Joe Johnson. We have called Marvin our best defender, but the numbers don't bare that out. Nor does watching him bare that out. People had to find something to try to validate Marvin so they claimed that he was our best defender. Tell me... does his defense have the impact that Smoove's defense have? Does he lock down guys and stop them from scoring?... Who?
If he's our best defender, why is it that we're better defensively with him off court?
Stop the insanity.
True!! But do not discredit Marvin's all around talent. He will be an allstar in the near future because of his work ethic and all around talent. One day we may see an all star team with damn near the starting 5 of the Hawks(Horford, Smoove, Marvin, Johnson/Crawford, Teague).
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Sekou is obviously in the denial stage in the coping process. Flip did win us games last season, especially in the second half of the season. There were a lot of games that Joe Johnson didn't show up and Flip Murray helped a lot with the scoring load. Flip Murray had a much better impact than Mo did last season and anyone who says different, is either in denial or didn't watch the hawks games. That argument about the Hawks winning a high percentage of their games when Mo Evans started is dumb, because there were games when he started and he didn't make an impact offensively or defensively.
The only reason why Mo Evans started when Marvin went down is because he plays the 3 position and Mike Woodson wanted to keep Joe Johnson at his natural position while also having his best bench player still coming off the bench. Mike Woodson did the same thing to Josh Childress. When a starter would go down with an injury, he would choose a different player than Josh Childress because Childress plays well off the bench. Woodson chose Mo simply because Flip Murray plays well off the bench and he doesn't want to ruin his rhythm. Just because Mario West was called in as a starter more than Josh Childress was two seasons ago doesn't mean that Mario West had as good of an impact as Chills did.
I think Sekou was stating the effect Mo had in the locker room and as a positive influence to the team more than the influence or skills showed on the court. Flip was great on the court but the only reason I see him not rejoining the team was that the chemistry he created off the court was not as effective as what he did on the court and therefore there were other/better options. A good vet is great but if that vet is not being a vet as far as helping the young players mentally/chemistry it would be hard to keep them when it comes to the big picture. That is probably the reason Stackhouse is not getting a chance on this team that some of us think he should have.
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Great Article all in all and we will have to wait till the season starts to really know the answers but so far it looks good, real good!!
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OH AND JUST SOMETHING TO THINK ABOUT FOR ALL THE LBJ LOVERS AND WADE LOVERS. DONT YOU THINK ITS FUNNY HOW EVERYTIME A NBA PLAYER GETS HYPED UP TO THE ELITE STATUS LIKE WADE AND LBJ DID, THEY ALWAYS WANT TO COMPARE THEM TO KOBE AND THEN JORDAN!
WHEATHER YOU LIKE IT OR NOT YOU A FOOL IF YOU THINK KOBE ISNT THE BEST IN THE LEAGUE. I DONT CARE WHAT YOU SAY! U HAVE NO GOOD ENOUGH REASON TO PUT ANY OTHER PLAYER OVER HIM! AN I'LL ARGUE THAT ALL-DAY.
(SORRY FOR THE CAPS BUT I FELT IT WAS NEEDED)
No offense but Kobe is just a duplicate of Jordan(which is definitely not a downplay). You can't find anything that Kobe does(as far as moves) that Jordan has not already done. Lebron and Wade who may have pattened their game from some where or another are their own player and no one has a game exactly like theirs.
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Now Sillent you've gone ahead and made the nonsensical argument of saying trading the teams allstar team captain would be less detrimental to team chemistry than trading away Smoove why? Because he's from Atlanta? Does that matter more to teammates that don't care because they are from all over the country, the world even, themselves or to the fans from Atlanta? I'd say the latter.
U can call me a homer(Even though I was born in Florida which is the same place Amare is from) but I think Smoove will eventually be better. People laughed at me(People I personally know) when I said our new rookie draftee(Boris Diaw) would be a poor man's Lebron. I even went further as to explain what I meant by stating he has a nice all around game for his size. I trold them he could be a big guard as far as his passing and scoring abilities(Heart and Determination is always a big factor but the talent is there). He did not prove that on our team but with patience and the right system he showed just that.
Dominique got me into the game of basketball and I haven't looked back since. I always loved the Hawks but could not find another favorite player on the Hawks until Josh Smith arrived(He reminds me of Nique). Not only does he remind me of Nique but he does things Nique didn't even do on the court from a defensive standpoint. To me trading Amare for Smoove would be like trading Amare for Nique and maybe not now but in the near future we will have our regrets which is less so for the Boris Diaw JJ trade. Why not hold on to a potential superstar that we can say was home grown in every aspect. Everyone's knows Amare's capabilities(which is good if that's exactly the piece you need) but Smoove's capabilities and potential(currently) are endless. What if we have the next best thing to Lebron and we let him go because we did not let our piece completely unfold and have only seen half the product.
If you want a team that you know what you are going to get every night may you are not ready for a young talented but frustrating Hawks team and maybe you should be a Spurs fan or something if you do not have the patience right now. Me personally, will wait for the new Nique(Smoove) Jordan(Lebron, Kobe if you want the typical Jordan but I am talkin about the Nique and Jordan of the future) battles and maybe this time the outcome will be a little different.
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You got a problem with the General??????
No he loves the general and is responding to the haters silence.
On another note though Woody is an evil genius and he knows if he can get them to the ECF anything can happen!!
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I don't get this "excuses" as if Woody gives excuses. Where does this come from. We won 47 games and by most if not All experts, we overachieved. Our best player is a robin, borderline All-Star. The next 7 were average to good. So what do you expect, the championship This season??
I'm going to have to agree with one person I usually find myself not agreeing with. Yes I do think Woodson is an evil genius. He has tolled with games over the years and has let winnable games go to prove a point which could be looked at as good or bad and be debatable seeing that we were still not going to make the playoffs during a couple of those occasions.
Besides last year that was a regular routine for good ol Woody but last year he did a lot more of what it takes(on most nights) to help the team get a win. This could have been because of the pressure he might have felt with a new boss on board.
If he does his job correctly this year and we at least reach expectations, Woody will get a new contract. Sund has already gave him a roster that runs at least 10 deep filling every needed position. All Woody has to do is his job(correctly).
Stackhouse could definitely be a bonus but he could also be a cancer if he is not ready to accept a role he would be given on this team. Chemistry out ways talent. That is how a USA team can lose to a country that is far less talented but everybody knows their role. Look at Horfords team with the Dominican Republic team compared to the teams that beat them. 3 NBA players and a nice D R teammate and they could not advance past their tournament. The deciding game seemed like an easy win but they could not put up the heart at the end that the other team had.
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When Josh puts up a PER of 27 I'll consider the move redundant and if you check their defensive ratings excluding last year they are dead even with Amar'e having the distinct advantage in offensive rating. Garnett is considered the best? Duncan is the best and Amar'e embarassed him thoroughly in the playoffs for an average of 37 points so yeah in about 5,000 ways that move is not redundant. Durability? Amar'e has played 75 games or more in 4 of his 7 seasons. Smoove has played 75 or more games in only 2 of his 5 seasons........
Besides all that if fantasies are the name of the game in this thread I'll at least stick with the Smoove for Amar'e fantasy. That fantasy atleast has a basis in salary cap reality and actually makes this team a contender putting another allstar with our allstar rather than just swapping allstars and thinking that that puts us over the top.
Garnett's considered one of the best if not the best and Smith embaressed (like my spelling) him in a Hawks/Timberwolves
If you are going to change my words to fit your argument and not consider the time table than the point deems useless. You told us to stop fantasizing which is fine. If it can not realistically happen ok but than you put the idea in bold above right after.
Josh is a hometown favorite whether you like it or not and could really become something special and may show the complete package this year.
Although Joe may welcome a trade of Amare think of the rest of our youngsters and the chemistry problems that might occur with new additions altering our main core. If someone as gifted as Josh is expendable on this team after all the hard work he has put in who is gonna be next. We can trade for Amare or Bosh and if they go down or get injured we are right back where we started except the expense and toll it would have on us losing a newly aquired Allstar and top scorer. Stick with the plan it will work.
If this was a fantasy league(me personally I'll still keep Josh) than who ever had the best on paper would probably win. When you are dealing with real people and human emotions alot of factors play into that and that is why chemistry is so important. A guy like Wade has a great work ethic and pride to take what ever team he is on and embrace the challenge of doing what it takes to win.
Which is why he'd be a more welcomed addition if JJ were not here. Besides if you listen to some of Wade's comments about our team he always gives our length and talent credit for the things we are able to do or stop him from doing. Which would enhance chemistry or go along with the sayin if you can't beat' em join em.
Again read my bold statement above but if your going to make a change you want it to also be least likely to change the positive chemistry. Jamal Crawford is a good player going on a good team that still has it's core. Getting a player that is not a superb upgrade that will force lineup changes and dismiss key pieces that helped give a team it's status in the first place does not seem like the best move.
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Right!! Work on it seriously during the off season and add more to your resume. (Hedo/Rashard) Josh and Marvin can add a more athletic mismatch which would cover up some of what Horford is lacking playing his Dwight Howard role. Shooting is a learned skill. Nobodies born with a shot(You can't teach height/athleticism) but you have to learn how to shoot, dribble, pass and things of that nature.
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See this is where you are wrong and why it's a fantasy. We can't sign Wade next offseason unless he decides 6 million dollars means just as much to him as the 20 million he'd be turning down which would go against everything him and Lebron have been discussing for the past 3 years.
Any trade for him would involve a core player to match his salary and some of his potential considering that we don't have enough cap space to absorb him outright and have already traded away our high salaried deadweight in Speedy and Acie. This means that a combination of any or most of Josh, Al, Marvin would have to be involved so he arives here and yea, no championship unless you think Bibby, Wade, Mo, Joe Smith and Zaza is championship worthy. No the fantasy of trading Joe for him is just as unlikely considering that a double sign and trade is just as likely as me owning an elephant.
After all of this the simple fact that other major markets can offer him his money outright without gutting themselves like his hometown Chicago, the number one market in NY and let's not forget in all this "Miami hasn't done anything" talk that they have zero, count it zero guranteed contracts next season if he opts out. That means they can give him the largest pay raises, that all important 6th year and then just to top it off they can add an Amar'e or Bosh or on the outside Lebron even JJ to go along with another high salaried player in the 9-10 million dollar range (Boozer, Ginobili, Josh Howard, Ray Allen) even if the cap drops to the lowest projected amount.
Drop the fantasy people, unless the franchise is going to go through another remodelling, which management has made no indication of, Joe Johnson is the answer unless he decides otherwise. There is an unofficial 2-3 year plan and if we are not at the door in that timespan then and only then will you see your favorite players traded off or let go unless someone (*cough* Amar'e) falls in our lap before then.
/rant
I Agree with most of your post but speaking of fantasy :thumbsdownsmileyanim: I think u can include Amar'e. How would he fall in our lap.
I think Smoove may end up having the better career because of durability alone :helpsmilie: and Smoove has highlight plays against the coveted Amare and Bosh. Yes he can hold his own against both.
Garnett's considered one of the best if not the best and Smith embaressed (like my spelling) him in a Hawks/Timberwolves game not to mention looking pretty good against him in the playoffs (ps embaress by the fact that Garnett could not play up to Garnett standards due to Smith matching up against him).
Which to me will make a trade like this redundant just swapping more defense for more offense which we may not need anymore considering our new additions and certain players added skills.
Unless u mean via free agency and that would create the same debate as the Wade debate as far as money is concerned
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:question: Now wade plays against these teams just like we do right? Ok so when has his slashing ever been nullified? Even with that horrible supporting cast that he has he manages to get bout 30 7 n 5 per, oh not to mention over 2 steals and over a block per game. 3-5 wins??????? Really?????? Thats how much u think of wade's skills? And that laker team was in 2nd place before that gasol trade that year (i think).....but anyway about the big 3.......orlando is a perimeter team first so i think that adding wade would make a difference there, u act like we've never won a game against them before because of our small lineup.......Boston is a very balanced team but we took that SAME team to 7 in the playoffs without an mvp candidate.......Cleveland would b a challenge but with a player like wade he can take over games himself and win us a couple of games (cough cough...like he did to us this year). Anyway being a contender and saying that we're a lock to win is two different things. I don't think many people picked the magic to b in the finals this year and i don't think many picked the pistons to win against the lakers when they did it. Y couldn't we contend? We have good players on this team, n like i said when u add a player like wade he raises the play of his teammates, u know....some players make others better. We would contend, didn't say we would win a ring but we would definately contend
Thank You!! Somebody with some sense(No offense to JJ but reallisticly come on now?)
Y'all are acting as if Horford, Smith, and Marvin are scrubs. I guess some people don't really know their team/players. Yeah they make their mistakes and have their deficiencies but not many players skip this list especially all being under the age of 25 when alot of players don't even reach their prime till about 26-28.
I will admit Sund is a strategist and Crawford is/was insurance not only for Bibby/Murray but for JJ as well. Again not a bad idea seeing that at least 1 of our 3 young players above should have a breakout season or will be coming into their own as well so it is not like Crawford will be by his self as the star of our team if JJ leaves. I know alot of us are weary about rookie point guards but don't sleep on Teague either. If Teague pans out And Y'all can bash me for this but I'll take Marvin, Al Horford, and Teague over Chris Paul Yeah Chris is great but at the time he would have stagnated our growth and we would have to suceed with less talent. Really we'd be the Hornets which isn't bad but eventually it would be dissapointing to be very good without having a chance to be elite.
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I would take Stackhouse and Sims. Bibby, Teague, Crawford, Joe(situational) can all be options at the point. Stackhouse adds a proven vet that can man the 2/3 positions along with Marvin, Joe, Mo,Jamal, Smith(situational). If Sims has anywhere near the potentials of a Javale McGee, Anthony Randolph, Deandre Jordan and others similar, he would be a great addition to add to our team. He can learn from our veteran bigs and may become a vital piece once Joe Smith and Collins are gone.
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I think Crawford's interview with us as he entered the team said it best. This team has great chemistry and was winning before Crawford got here. For somebody as talented as Crawford not having a playoff stat to date he would be a fool to mess it up. At the very worst he could just stay benched and we should still be able to do our thing. Crawford is a professional though and a hungry one at that. I think he will do what it takes and what is needed for the team to go as far as possible(decent defense,assist,big shots,heart/drive to win like Flip had).
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Well, I don't see Joe coming back next year. And I DEFINITELY don't see D-Wade coming here.
Open your eyes to the unexpected this is a new Hawks era we are entering and all of us old Hawks fans hav to learn how to be optimistic again. Things are definitely changing and we hav been routing for the underdog for so long some of us do not know how to handle our team slowly but surely becoming elite.
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Dat was pretty interesting.lol
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Yeah times have changed I went from being the only Hawk fan I know (and I know a lot of people believe me!!) too actually seeing a slow but steady turn around over the years and this year I think the fans are going to have a break out season. For those of us that found comfort in having space with the seatings beware and prepare to stand up for your ATLANTA HAWKS!!
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Let me get this straight.
Bibby, JJ, Marvin, Smoove, and Horford are gonna be practicing against Teague, Crawford, Mo (?Stack), Joe Smith, and ZaZa/Jason Collins...
...We talkin bout practice!
Practice!
...We talkin bout practice!
We ain't even talkin bout the game...
...We talkin bout practice!
How in the hell can the rest of the league stop these teamates when they practin against each other?
We got a team that finished 4th in the conference last year and I would not feel comfortable betting my mortgage that the starting unit could take better than a 60-40 split in games against the backups.
Suffice it to say that I believe the practices will be a lot more intense and productive this year. I think the intensity during games will increase as a result as well as the "basketball I. Q."
Again to the posters above He's taliking about PRACTICE during training camp and the rest of the season!!
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Honestly what would be the difference? The difference between JJ and Wade isn't enough to make us a championship team. Our only chance for us to become champions is if both Smoove and Marvin become star players, or at least Lamar Odom/Artest Caliber
Are u serious? Wade has the skills and the heart of a champion. He is currently the third best player in the league (maybe debatable but only slightly if any) and what seperates him from JJ is his leadership. I have thought about pairing Wade with Smoove for awhile but add Horford, Marvin, Bibby, Teague, Crawford, and the crew. Could u really tell me that we would not be a championship team in the eyes of more than just us Hawks fans.
Back to the subject though I believe this year JJ will go out and earn his money(which may end up getting us further than we would have imagined). Just like Woody was given a roster he has been asking for so has JJ( Please Bring Vets Plea!!) and neither one of them has any excuses. JJ will have a very capable back up in Jamal Crawford whether Crawford's coming off the bench or playing along side JJ (Decreases double teams). Joe Smith is around along with Jason Collins to give the young bigs some wisdom (Might lower possible frustrations that Joe may have felt from our young vets). More back ups more rest!! Winning will always be a motivation but the confidence to win is just as important(Being a team 10 deep can lift spirits and energy). JJ has hit 30 footers and played with Lebron, Wade and others who were impressed with his game(maybe he was holding back or needed a second wind). Competing against Crawford is another motivational tool for Joe to play at a high level every night. Without stating any more of the obvious, Joe should definitely be one of the top tier players next year at least on the brinks with Roy.
He can also be the perfect role player instead of the premier player for our team if everybody steps it up which they should(Smoove,Marvin,Horford,TeagueUnderrated Rookie Plea and Crawford with his new team and playoff hopes )
Josh Smith "hometeam" interview from NBA.com
in Homecourt
Posted
Love the Aviator!! With the Teague/Crawford comparison I think he meant explosive and dynamic combo guards in their own right that can definitely improve the running game(specially when substituting these two for Bibby and JJ). Great Half Court Guards and Great Full Court Guards who can all play each others roles in instances. Looks pretty good!!