davis171

4 minutes ago, Diesel said:

Never worry.  Oubre's contract status will change and you will probably end up giving him Baze money for less production. 

 

I still see we have Crickets. ..

 

Using cap flexibility to sign intriguing vets that fit around the young player... you are overstating it Zach Randolph and George Hill signed with the freaking kings...

Just now, Diesel said:

Never worry.  Oubre's contract status will change and you will probably end up giving him Baze money for less production. 

 

Okay move him before the extension he is making 2 million for the next 2 years! Use that then let him walk or trade him before you give him the big contract.

2 minutes ago, Diesel said:

Sorry but THJr is still better than Oubre Jr.  The problem is again a problem of GMing.  When you made the trade for THjr, you should have been ready to extend him befoe he became a UFA. 

 

 

Not for the contract he isn't Oubre is making 2 million a year to Hardaway's 17! Why would he have not tested the market to be "proud" to be an eastern conference fringe playoff team?

1 minute ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

More like battling Cleveland, Indiana, and Washington for the 3rd seed.

It's cool though.  The Hawks are not only going to add Ayton, we'll add Zion Williamson, and Mac McClung ( when he comes out in his Sophomore year ).  Those 3, along with Collins and Prince, will bring the Hawks back to the glory days by 2025.

 

Huh 3rd seed?????????? Whatcha smoking and can I get some! We were 4th our last year with Al???

DMC was on a prove in contract it makes since. Sap should have been traded the season after for assets. Ik you think that sounds crazy but Boston traded a guy top 5 in MVP voting. After resigning him and making it to the deadline everyone should have realized the core isn't strong enough and made some big shaking moves.

8 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

Sap missed like 10 games down the stretch last season, which caused the late season slide.

Then he was in straight beast mode in the playoffs.

Yup so pay him a third of the cap for the next 3 years to fight for the elusive 8 seed I like it!

1 minute ago, Peoriabird said:

But But But this team can't beat anybody according to the Anti-tank club!  LOL!

OKC doesn't want to win they are tanking now!

Wtf......... PG13 to ATL

6 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

Ferry might not be an idiot, but it was an idiotic move.  Ferry's whole philosophy was "flexibility".  Those contracts made the Hawks "flexible".  It was reported that Millsap himself wanted the 2 year deal.  But if Ferry offered him or Carroll more years, with the option to opt out after Year 2, we retain their Bird Rights.   Once they play in that 3rd year, we have the right to sign them and go over the Salary Cap.

But around these parts, we covet "cap space", even if we don't have a feasible plan on how to use it.

Hopefully Schlenk pulls a "Bullwinkle" and pulls a rabbit out of his hat . . ( showing my age )

 

 

Yeah your just wrong. The point was "Flexability" which is awesome. Sap and DMC were never supposed to be multi contact guys otherwise you pay the extra (hawks went into that season under the cap). The entire point was to move them for assets if they over preform the contract but Ferry wasn't here to make the deals. Schlenk has a plan that ownership likes please just shut up and in 3 years if you don't like the direction I may agree but the dude has been here for less than a year and no one is complaining from the hawks side. How do you know there is no plan on how to use the cap space Schlenk give you a phone call?

1 hour ago, Watchman said:

And who would you say in the 2018 draft is a superstar?  "Superstars" are a very rare commodity, and I don't see any of these guys having what it takes to be considered a superstar. (Marvin Williams anyone?  Al Horford anyone?  Al is a quality player, but he is not even close to being a superstar. Marvin is the poster child for grossly overrated draft picks.) Oh well, on to 2019, 2020, 2021...  I'm 60 years old, and I'd rather have a team that goes deep into the playoffs over one that struggles to win 20 games.  Been there, done that.  Those years drag on and on and on.  I at least want a team I can be proud of, not some perpetual, intentional losers.

So explain what you would do with Dwight and Sap taking up over half your cap this coming off-season so you have no cap space to improve your "proud" 8-seed atl hawks! I honestly don't think had we brought our core back minus THJ we make the playoffs so it would be all for not but just humor me what moves are you making? You have the 15th pick of the draft for past examples the 15th pick was traded for George hill BUT you need to include players because you are over the cap obviously so let's hear it!

33 minutes ago, Watchman said:

Ferry offered them longer contracts, but they weren't interested.  How is Ferry accountable for that?

That's why they should have been moved for assets as I alluded to which I 100% believe was Ferry's plan or just let them walk they weren't meant to be lifers.

6 minutes ago, KB21 said:

Actually, the reason he is there is because he played for Thibodeux in Chicago.

Okay so what did they trade for him?

js the reason Jimmy is there is because of the assets they accumulated.

8 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

So Millsap and Howard are scrubs now?  You think that Collins, right now, are better than those two guys?  Both of those guys could play for another 3 years, easily, and be productive players.

It's hilarious how the narrative on a guy like Millsap has changed dramatically, once he's gone from the team.  A guy that people talked about getting a max deal last summer, would now be on a 30 win Hawks team ( if he were healthy ).

People are talking about how it limits your ability to improve the team, knowing good and well that young teams in this league rarely win.  Even the T-Wolves had to scrap the "youth movement", and had to bring in Butler, Teague, and everybody's favorite gunner Jamal Crawford, in order to get over the hump.  Why?  Because young teams, most of the time, don't improve, even if they have a star talent on the squad.  

Had they continued to covet their cap space and continue to add young pieces, they'd still be on the outside looking in.   And after 13 years of nothing, T-Wolves fans are giddy about the position they're in right now . . . and they're still a potential 4 game losing streak away from missing the playoffs.

People hate mediocrity . . . but consistent losing makes you wish you were mediocre, just to have a little something to cheer about.

I'm sorry nothing you say will make me think giving over half our cap to Sap and Dwight makes since 0.

49 minutes ago, Diesel said:

That's straight up BS. 

They were built to win and they did.  Ferry knew how to put pieces together based on the Spurs system.   While Bud was a part of Spurs System, he didn't know how to put the pieces together.   Neither of them could draft for sh!t.   The other part of bad GMing is that we wasted draft picks. 

Bebe, Payne, Edy... I mean, you can go down the list and see how we take bad picks or just waste picks altogether and Our Loyalty to the spurs Sucked too.  

We took on Splitter's bad contract. 

We did another spurs forward thing that I don't recall right now.. I think we took one of their bad contracts or something. 

But Bad GMing before and after the fact.  We were supposed to start clearing room while we were winning.  We did the same thing with Dennis and Teague and Horford. 

 

They did have a really nice pick in Kelly Oubre Jr and traded him on draft night because "he wasn't immediately ready" for THJ and what did that net us now? Shlenk had no choice but to blow it up Sap THJ, and Dwight are not assets on their current contracts bottom line. Ferry 100% knows about bird rights why would he have not given them contracts that are 3+ years if they were supposed to be around in the future you think Ferry is an idiot?

3 minutes ago, Diesel said:

The Bottom line is that the failure of us after the 60 win season really boils down to Bad GMing. 

1.  We should have seen the possibility of problems before DMC and Millsap became UFA. 

2.  Ferry's comments about Africans messed up our recruitment as well. 

BTW.. add Deng to the list of people who was interested in playing here. 

3.  Bud& Co. Didn't have a blueprint.  No GM blood in them.

 

So really our problems all extend from Ferry who at the same time was the only visionary we had.

 

They weren't supposed to win like they did they were supposed to be assets traded away and never kept. Ferry had a vision and a good one sucks Bud messed it up by not trading assets like Sap. None of that is on Shlenk we had no assets so draft is the best way to acquire them. Al Horford isn't here anymore like when Ferry got here.

8 hours ago, Diesel said:

Something around 96% of tank teams fail to get to championship calibre and you're focused squarely on the two that did AND with that you're denying the impossible circumstances that happened for them to get there. 

1 hour ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

You play Collins behind the vets, but give him 6th man minutes.  Collins can play both forward and center, so he could've played alongside both Howard or Millsap.  He'd develop a lot more in that situation, than in the current one he's in now.  Bud isn't trying to feature him as a legitimate offensive option, so the vets would teach him how to affect the game, even when he's not the feature.

 If the worst case scenario happened, and the Hawks still weren't a playoff level team, they pick at the end of the lottery and have a chance to get this guy.

 

This is a very deep draft with good players.   But unlike most people, I don't believe you have one or two guys who are sure fire Hall of Famers in this draft.   It wouldn't surprise me one bit if the star of this class was picked outside of the top 5, or even the top 10.

You clearly haven't watched enough of the hawks this year. Collins biggest nock is he can't play center due to him seeming to be inept as a rim protector (1.1bpg) which is why a lot of mocks have us pairing bigs like JJJ and Bamba who project out as good rim protectors. Mikal Bridges (Thought you only wanted PG) is good he isn't close to Luka, Ayton, Porter, JJJ, Bamba, and Bagley as a prospect. Worst case my ass they probably wouldn't make it regardless. So lets go with you all's dream scenario we barely slide in as an 8 seed way over the cap with no flexibility and a non lottery pick. Please explain what you would do a year later to try and improve the maybe 8 seed, because clearly you are brighter than the guys being paid millions to do this. This guy needs to be in a hawks uniform next year.

We have been over this Sap's contract makes 0 sense when trying to build. He was less than a 6th of the cap when he came here with Ferry. Ferry was really good at managing cap and deciding how much to spend on guys. Sap was only here in the first place because he signed a team friendly deal. 30 million is by no means team friendly (a third of your cap). When you can go out and sign guys like Hezonja, Exum, Barton, etc and see if they come here with a chip on their shoulder and take the team to unprecedented heights ala DMC and Sap. We don't have that potential with keeping the roster the same.

33 minutes ago, KB21 said:

The Hawks will not even have a good idea of what they have in the first pick they make this year in 3 years time.   There's a better than average chance that you guys will be making the same excuses for their first round pick as people are making for Andrew Wiggins.

Lmao it has been 5 years for the 76ers the longest playoff drought the east is weak so playoff teams tend to fluctuate more than the west 

52 minutes ago, AHF said:

Long-term play for Steph!  (/jk)

No way we want the sister to play for us!

25 minutes ago, Sothron said:

Prime years are 25-31 if that is what you are asking for most players in sports. Age 26 is like the holy year for a baseball player but that's another story.

Exactly Wiggins is just getting better. He has plenty of time to become an all time great even (not saying he will) with at least 10 years left baring injury or off court issues.

17 minutes ago, KB21 said:

Wait until they are 28?  So, this is now the tanking strategy?  Bottom out the roster to get a 19 year old prospect, overpay said prospect on second deal, and then wait till he's 9-10 seasons into his career before making a decision on whether the pick has worked out?

Yes to reach their ceiling. That doesn't mean they aren't good players the Wolves and Bucks are going to the playoffs this season, but to see what the player is truly going to max out at yes. What all time player was best at 22-23?

10 minutes ago, KB21 said:

Yep.  Let's usher in the next round of underdeveloped 19 year olds who will never be as good as their hype.

You are judging 20-23 yr olds please wait until they are at least 28ish to begin thank you. Gordon hayward had a negative bpm as a rookie don't want him either.

3 minutes ago, KB21 said:

I know you guys want to lose, so I can see why you want to use cap space on Jamal Murray.  He's a net negative RPM player.

But come on.  Jamal Murray is your big time addition this off season?  If you add Jamal Murray and let's say DeAndre Ayton, this team might win 25 games in 2018-2019.  Might.  

That's a bet I'm all about Reddish, Barrett, and Doumbouya, but idk if Schröder, Baze, Prince, Collins, Ayton with Murray, cap space, and draft picks only wins 25 games we may win more than that this year.

Andrew Wiggins is 23 please at least let the kid have a 25th birthday before you say he is a terrible player it isn't exactly easy to be starting for a Western confrence playoff team at 23.