Bankingitbig

4 minutes ago, MaceCase said:

There's a lot of problems.  Although things may be technically possible you have to also look at probability.

1stly) You'd have to deal with timing issues of Denver locking up other players while Sap waits out the negotiations without getting nervous that his pond is drying up because after all, he isn't getting any distinct monetary advantage to sign specifically with Denver in this scenario. 

2ndly) Denver would essentially have to work hand in hand with Atlanta throughout free agency which is unheard of.  Denver would have to target, pitch, negotiate and sign these other free agents, do the same for Sap and have Atlanta tag along the whole way believing that they can't do any better than Faried and Arthur as compensation for holding onto Sap's caphold.

Yea agreed. Though it would all occur during the Moratorium period and wouldn't be executed until later, so don't think we would necessarily have to work hand in hand. The biggest thing that would take the longest time would be getting Millsap to agree to it. I am sure he would want to do his due diligence on where he would want to go. Once he agrees, then both teams know how much cap space they would have and they go about doing their own free agent signings with that knowledge. It would essentially be the same effect if we were dealing with a team over the cap as well.

7 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

They could but being open to SnT could be something attractive to team's over the cap like Houston, OKC, Chicago, etc and you never know what other deals these teams want to make

Yea definitely. Was just trying to say that a SnT can serve as a purpose for teams under the cap with max room as well.

Couldn't a team like Denver us the SnT as a way to use their cap space for other free agents? Not 100% on the mechanics of it all. But I believe they could use some cap space to go out and sign free agents that they wouldn't have room to get if they immediately offered the max to Millsap. Then later do the SnT with us by sending salary away such as Faried and Arthur, along with picks as incentives.

16 minutes ago, MaceCase said:

Point out that thread *rolls up sleeves* they need sum fixin'.

 

No, I don't know what they were discussing.  A TPE would have to be generated through a trade with the Hawks over the cap.  Millsap leaving actually frees up cap space.

It's technically true if we sign-and-trade Millsap when we are over the cap. But the TPE would serve no purpose and would likely be renounced anyways since it would prevent us from signing anyone in free agency.

Don't think that people realize that a TPE is actually used as a placeholder against the cap and it can't be used to sign players.

In regards to KP, yea... We don't have the assets to get him when compared to the other 28 teams that would be interested as well.

16 hours ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Cleveland is more than likely looking for a team to take Love to send young players and picks to Bulls.

I think this is the case too, but what I can't understand is why the teams don't just leave the Cavaliers out of the equation. Just do the trade of young players/picks for Butler. No need for the Cavaliers or Love to be involved. Is there any team that actually values Love over Butler? Especially factoring in Butler's great contract.

17 hours ago, JayBirdHawk said:

@Wurider05 Easy answer is we'll have about $20 mill in capspace if you count guaranteed salaries and cap charges for empty roster spots.  

However, if Sap leaves, we can generate a TPE (traded player exception) in the amount of his new contract that can be used in a trade to acquire a player. Can't be used to sign a player though.

I have it at just over $30M if you only count guaranteed salaries (including #19 and #31 draft picks) and roster charges. I don't think a TPE generated from a Millsap Sign-and-Trade would be useful because we would have no cap room to sign players in free agency due to the TPE. Haven't looked at all the possible scenarios, but keeping Millsap's cap hold of $30M on the books and then a potential $30M+ TPE would take away all our salary cap room as far as I understand.

I think Schlenk is going BPA at both #19 and #31. Our roster still has a lot of holes and question marks long-term, so why not go BPA and see who develops. Then use free agency to fill needs.

8 minutes ago, Charman212002 said:

I got this email too but I didn't see any mention of an actual draft party. 

Am I missing it in the message?

I don't think there is one this year (or at least I haven't seen it mentioned) due to the renovations.

11 minutes ago, Dragitoff said:

Tim Legler just proposed on NBA Radio that the Celtics should offer Bradley, Brown and the #3 pick for Paul George and Indy's 1st.  If that's the market for George, Atlanta would have to give up a lot more than we'd want to, especially if it means Baze's salary goes to make it match.  It was just his speculation from what I heard so take it for what it's worth.  Could you imagine a starting 5 of IT, Hayward, George, Crowder and Horford though?  That's pretty stout. 

Almost certain that the Celtics would need to trade Crowder in order to have space to sign Hayward to a max. I think Butler is much more in play for the Celtics than Paul George.

3 minutes ago, Vol4ever said:

Pacers are dreaming at best.  

I could see Pacers doing a three way trade with the Cavaliers and getting Love for PG, then spinning Love for young assets/picks.

9 minutes ago, Dolfan23 said:

Can't have an off-season without trying to trade Schröder to the Kings! What's next talk of adding Rudy Gay? 

Rudy Gay to the Hawks will always be a discussion. Once he retires, there will still be some Hawks fans saying we should go after him and bring him out of retirement to play.

Good thing the Pacers didn't take our rumored offer of up to 4 first round picks at last year's deadline...

Anyways, I am against trading for Paul George even if we are able to dump Bazemore in the process. The main reason is because then we are pretty much forced to resign Paul Millsap to a deal that we will regret. I think our team with PG could potentially make it to the Finals, but I don't see us beating the Warriors and I would actually favor Cleveland in the ECF. Then Paul George bolts in the offseason and we are stuck with an aging Paul Millsap on a massive contract, along with losing a couple of first round picks that we would need to send to IND.

The draft and the start of free agency are probably my favorites times outside of the playoffs (if the Hawks are in it). That said, I have a similar sentiment in terms of the draft and there being just too many variables for the Hawks this year. Add on to the fact that I don't watch college basketball at all, so I have relatively no experience watching the prospects outside of DraftExpress highlights. Definitely excited to see who we pick and what trades go down on draft night, but I am also waiting for the draft to be completed before I really try to analyze and predict our free agency moves.

On ‎6‎/‎16‎/‎2017 at 5:35 PM, GameTime said:

I say stock up with 37%+ shooters and see where we go this year. It should at least be fun to watch. Schlenk knows in this era elite shooting wins championships.

Free Agent 3pt shooting targets

Serge Ibaka 

JJ Redick 

Dion Waiters

Nikola Mirotic

Joe Ingles 

C.J. Miles 

Tony Snell

Bojan Bogdanovic 

Jonas Jerebko

Kelly Olynyk

Nick Young

Omri Casspi

Spencer Hawes

Jodie Meeks

Ian Clark 

Luc Mbah a Moute

Ben McLemore

Deron Williams

Anthony Morrow

Marreese Speights

Kyle Korver (ha)

Now how many of those guys have the D?....  is rolling her eyes.

But seriously... Snell, Ibaka and  Mbah a Moute (though he shouldn't even be on this list, as this last year was an outlier from 3P% on low volume)? Anyone else? Easy to go out and say that you need 3 & D players, but much harder to actually find them.

Looks like Malcolm isn't the biggest fan of our current assistant coaches either..

He later said "Neven is my guy. Thought you were talking about someone I played with in europe."

56 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

So we have to add bad luck and injury to our ever growing list of how to avoid being a treadmill team.  At this point, I might be happy being the treadmill team and by the way, Memphis consistently won 50 plus game per season and is still on the treadmill team list.

Yea..... I think you have to add luck as a pretty big factor to winning a championship. Thought that was fairly obvious.

I think people have done a decent job of illustrating to you how teams have become championship quality, but I haven't seen much from anyone in terms of how teams can make the playoffs for 10+ years in a row and then win a championship. In fact, I believe the Spurs are the only team in NBA history to technically do this by winning in 2014. I would argue that them getting Duncan as a #1 pick overall and getting lucky with Leonard was a big reason as to why this happened.

Not trying to say that we deliberately aim to miss the playoffs. I just think you have to take each situation case by case. And in the case of the current Atlanta Hawks, in my opinion, I think the best path forward is not tying up the salary cap to an aging Paul Millsap. Then you evaluate the rest of the roster and see if the other players fit your potential championship contending window (to an extent; I think vets can play a part in terms of developing young players), which I believe Dwight Howard does not, so I would try and gain assets for him.

Then you want to make sure your roster has the potential for improvement in the future, so you target players that you think have room for improvement (most likely young players) or maybe you think their abilities are a better fit for your system than their current team. You also want to remain flexible from a cap perspective because who knows maybe two stars will want to join each other in a future offseason and we want to make sure that we can accommodate that.

But trying to resign Millsap and Ilyasova just so you can make the playoffs again isn't going to get you anywhere.

12 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

Wasn't Myles Turner the 9th pick in last years draft? But anyway posters were touting any lottery pick including Kobe and Klay Thompson...Heck AHF even included Iguadala in his research paper regarding finals MVPs

He was 11th.

8 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

CP3?  Didnt the Clipper try for 10 years to build around that dude with zero conference finals appearances. Plus getting their azzes handed to them by that treadmill team call Memphis?

Clippers have definitely underperformed, but they have also had some very bad luck in recent years due to injuries.

45 minutes ago, sturt said:

Hmmmm.... so, putting yourself in Bud's shoes, @Bankingitbig, would you be concerned at all for your new boss to tell you he'd like to hire away someone he trusted at GSW?

So, you understand, that's why I didn't even give any thought whatsoever to a Schlenk-led hire.... I want Bud to hire his own coaches. He's the one who has to work with them, and I think he's certainly earned the right to hold that much latitude.  He knows what he's doing. If, though, it's Bud's idea... maybe he says, "ya know, Travis, I've always thought highly of Adams over there at GSW... think you might be able to steal him away?".... then, I'm all for it.

Lol yea I definitely agree. I mean I wouldn't be concerned if it was Ron Adams given that he has made it known he doesn't want to be a head coach and is a top notch assistant, so it would be somewhat understandable to try and gain him as an asset if Schlenk thinks he could. That said, I definitely think it should be Bud that is picking his assistants and that in the Ron Adams hypothetical Schlenk should be running that by Bud beforehand to make sure he is on board.

8 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

Plus it's funny that everyone is changing their tune about the amount of talent on Indy's team now...I seem to remember a lot of posters predicting Indy to challenge Cleveland in the conference finals at the beginning of the season because they added Teague but now they have no talent? Sounds like a Jeff Sessions testimony in front of congress to me. Lol!

Can't speak for others, but I really don't recall many people thinking Indy would challenge Cleveland at the beginning of the season. Though it was pretty much consensus that it would be Cleveland #1 and Boston #2. Many people thought Indiana was flawed from a roster standpoint with Teague and Monta Ellis as the guards, then add in their weak coaching staff. Then account for the fact that Paul Geroge is the only starter-worthy player on the roster that can actually play defense.

16 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

Because all of the talk was getting this so called Superstar by tanking and Indy did just that and are and have been worse than us all but 1 year and almost lost to us in the playoffs with the Hawks missing Horford.  A protanker needs to explain this otherwise admit it isn't an exact science and quit preaching as though it is.

Not sure if Indy truly tanked, as PG was selected at #10, which has been their highest pick since picking #7 in 1989. In fact, I feel like Indy did almost opposite of what tanking is in terms of trying to get high picks and build through the draft. They traded their 2011 first round pick (Kawhi Leonard) for George Hill and traded their 2014 first round pick for Luis Scola....

Don't think I have seen anyone calling tanking an exact science. Think it is a case by case basis.

1 minute ago, Peoriabird said:

Well he is on Indy's team and they were worse than us...in my best Tom Cruz voice...Can you explain that?

In case you didn't know.... Indy doesn't have a player named Paul Millsap or a player that is comparable to him. Nor do they have a coach named Mike Budenholzer or one that is comparable to him. Additionally, their starting five is horribly constructed. Not sure why that truly needed explaining........

32 minutes ago, Peoriabird said:

If paul George is Indy's superstar then why would they have to blow up the team? Kinda doesn't fit the tankers argument right?

They...... Don't........ In fact, I believe @Sothron said he would build around a PG type player. That said, they should have been more prudent with some of the contracts that they took on, but that is always easy to say that in hindsight. Plus, they came fairly close to making the Finals with PG once. Obviously, it's a gamble on whether or not he stays next year though and maybe that is a reason for trading him if you think he won't.

I would like Schlenk to try and steal Ron Adams away from GSW. Think it might be good for Bud to have a more experienced assistant that he can go to for difficult decisions and one that he can rely on more. Don't want Bud continually developing these younger assistants that just leave in a year or two. I also think Adams can instill more of a culture due to his experience and respect that he should garner. He can focus on our defense philosophies, which should allow Bud to focus more on the offense. That said, I doubt Adams would want to leave Kerr and the GSW organization, especially given his age at 69.