beav

NBA's free agents free to sign today Two Blazers on list; many top players already committed FACTBOX Wednesday, July 11, 2007 NBA players are eligible to sign free agent contracts today. But some of the most notable players already have said which teams they intend to sign with, leaving relatively few choices for the rest of the league. Two Trail Blazers -- Ime Udoka and Travis Outlaw -- are free agents. The Blazers, who have set Outlaw as their top priority, must decide if they are willing to pay the necessary cash to retain both players. Portland also could shop for a small forward or point guard among other free agents. Players such as Golden State forward Matt Barnes and Denver guard Steve Blake could fill needs for the team. Top players who have expressed their intentions (with expected terms of new contract in parentheses): Chauncey Billups, PG, Detroit (five years, $60 million). No surprise, the Pistons weren't about to allow another star, after Ben Wallace, to bolt for a second consecutive season. Vince Carter, SG, New Jersey (four years, $61.8 million). He was rumored to be heading home to Orlando but chose to remain with Jason Kidd. Grant Hill, SF, Phoenix (two years, $4 million). He turned down more money to leave Orlando and play for the team he thinks gives him the best chance to win his first title. Rashard Lewis, SF, Orlando (five years, $82 million). The Magic overpaid but got the former SuperSonic to pair with Dwight Howard. Andres Nocioni, PF, Chicago (five years, $38 million). His playoff flameout in the Bulls' series against Detroit didn't hurt his contract value. Jerry Stackhouse, SG, Dallas (three years, $21 million). A perennial contender for the sixth-man award stays with the Mavericks. Best of the players still waiting: Matt Barnes, SF, Golden State. Three-point specialist made a paltry $798,112 with the Warriors last year. He's looking for a raise, but can he duplicate production in a more structured offense? Steve Blake, PG, Denver. Former Blazer made $1.33 million last year, but his value jumped playing alongside Allen Iverson and Carmelo Anthony in Denver. Derek Fisher, PG, Utah. Expected to return to the L.A. Lakers in a city with medical facilities to treat his daughter, who has cancer in one eye. Desmond Mason, SG, New Orleans. A versatile player who can play at shooting guard or small forward. But will anyone offer him a salary near the $8.037 million he made last year? Darko Milicic, SF, Orlando. Agent Marc Cornstein goes into a tizzy when the Magic yanks their original offer off the table after signing Lewis. Mikki Moore, C, New Jersey. Earned extra cash after strong playoff performances. Travis Outlaw, SF, Portland. The Blazers say they're committed to re-signing him. Morris Peterson, G, Toronto. One of the league's better perimeter shooters is receiving plenty of attention. James Posey, SF, Miami. Fell out of favor with Heat coach Pat Riley. Joe Smith, PF, Philadelphia. Not worthy of the top overall pick (1995) but a solid player. Ime Udoka, SF, Portland. Doesn't want to leave Portland, but, hey, money talks. Anderson Varejao, PF, Cleveland. Played important role in Cavaliers' run to the NBA Finals. Gerald Wallace, SF, Charlotte. Looking for a raise over the $5.525 million he made last season and still is coveted by many teams, but is expected to re-sign with the Bobcats. Maurice Williams, PG, Milwaukee. He plays a shoot-first game, but there's a shortage of high-quality point guards in this market. -- Geoffrey C. Arnold

Quote: Balkman from South Carolin made Yi look foolish. Yi was very intimated by the athletecicsm Balkman had. I watch it late last night on NBA TV too. Speaking of Balkman, the guy should get some props for his year last year. I cannot ever remember a pick being booed as loudly as he was by the classless NYers last year. Now he is a fan favorite. He does remind me a little of a young dennis rodman. (wow, isiah thomas was right! can't believe I'm typing that!)

Quote: Looks like Oden will undergo a tonsillectomy within the week, effectively sidelining him for the remainder of summer league. Not that he was that impressive, seeing as how his penchant for drawing fouls followed him from Ohio State. Nothing like drawing a summer league double-double with his 13 points and 10 fouls. All the naysayers are coming out of the woodwork here in Blazer Nation with Oden's unimpressive debut and this recent news. Honestly, I felt like if there was anything to say negatively about Oden, it was his foul troubles. I remember watching him spend long stretches on the bench during the NCAA tourney because he got into foul trouble and I'm still afraid that once he gets into game situations during the regular season, he's gonna get nailed for a lot of tickytack fouls. Yeah that's the problem with casual fans, they see all the hype then are chicken littles when the kid plays a couple of summer league games... Oden is 19 years old and comparing him to people like robinson, duncan, ewing etc. is even more unfair as they were seniors and 3-4 years older entering the league. Oden played with a cold and tonsillitis in a summer league game and looked like crap in one game pretty good in another. Honestly I do not expect Oden to be a big factor his first season particularly on offense. If I'm the blazers I'd start przybilla for at least the first dozen games too. Plus regarding the fouls it will probably take him a few years to start getting Jordan/Shaq/Wade treatment (if he ever does of course!)

I think that Knight believed that he could trade the pick up until perhaps just a day or so before the draft. In fact my guess is that he probably tried to trade up until the hawks number was called. Whether this was for Gasol or some other veteran big I do not know. I think that he probably wanted to trade with the idea that the youngest team in the league needed veteran leadership, as well as the fact that it might save his job (also a good reason to pick a senior in acie law with more game experience than most players). When a suitable trade didn't happen he went with the BPA that is not a SF and could at least play some possible minutes at center given the proper match-ups.

Quote: I am looking at the Celtics today. Their roster is not a finished product. They only have one healthy center on their roster, K. Perkins, and he gave them next to nothing last year. Their roster currently looks like this: Rondo / Telfair / Pruitt R. Allen / A. Ray / T. Allen Pierce / Green / Gomes Jefferson / Scalabrini / Big Baby / Lowe Perkins / Ratliff (played 2 games last year) Jefferson is ready to dominate. Last year he put up 16.1 ppg and 11 rpg. The Celtics are praying for production out of Perkins and some PG on theri roster. They are apparently high on Rondo, who is an atheltic freak with a horrid jump shot and average floor vision. One thing Rondo does great is defense. Rondo defense is a necssity b/c neither Allen or Pierce are know as perimeter defenders. Opposing wings should be ableto get in the lane at will causing foul trouble for their shallow front line. Ratliff is ready to retire and Perkins cannot afford to play more then 20 mpg due to foul trouble and a poor motor. So basically can Allen and Pierce shoot their way to the playoffs ? Not without Jefferson taking the next step. Allen is the type of player who should age gracefully like Reggie Miller did. Hopefully, for the Celtics sake, Pierce's added weight and birthday of 30 do not slow him down either. They have more questions then the Hawks at PG & Center. Even with Allen and Pierce I see them a 1/2 step behind the Hawks. Anxious to hear thoughts on the Celtics ! I agree that Center is a big area of concern given the foot problems that perkins had last year (those things do seem to have a way or lingering/popping up again)... However I don't see PG being as big of a concern... they run the offense primarily through Pierce who needs the ball most of the time anyway.... that's why a west and rondo (defensively minded point guards) are a better fit there... I believe that ratliff's contract is expiring this year so they should be able to trade him for a decent center? They're playing for now obviously after the ray allen trade so my guess is they will add another back-up center type (mikki moore?) before the season starts...

Summer league report By Yahoo! Sports July 8, 2007 LAS VEGAS – Here is who shined and struggled in NBA summer league play Saturday and Sunday, according to various front-office personnel and scouts around the league. SHINING ADVERTISEMENT 1. LaMarcus Aldridge, Portland Trail Blazers – Aldridge continued his impressive play in Vegas. He is shooting well from the outside and has a nice turnaround baseline jumper. He finished Sunday's game with 16 points and 11 rebounds in a 72-68 loss to Dallas. 2. Spencer Hawes, Sacramento Kings – Hawes played well with his back to the basket, displaying good footwork and showing a variety of low-post moves, including a turnaround jumper. He also stepped out and hit a couple of jump shots. He finished with 19 points (on 9-for-14 shooting) and seven rebounds as Sacramento defeated Team China 73-47. 3. Greg Oden, Portland Trail Blazers – Oden still was not great (anything was going to be an improvement over Friday's debacle in which he committed 10 fouls and scored six points), but he played much better on Sunday. He was much more active both offensively and defensively, soaring way above the rim to throw down a thunderous dunk as well as blocking four shots. He finished Sunday's game with 13 points and five rebounds in a losing effort. 4. Jose Juan Barea, Dallas Mavericks – He has played solidly in both of the Mavs' victories. On Friday, Barea finished with 14 points and nine assists and followed that up with 17 points and three assists on Sunday. He is strong with the basketball, gets into the lane and makes good decisions. 5. Marco Belinelli, Golden State Warriors – If he consistently shoots like he did on Saturday, then Golden State got the steal of last month's draft. Belinelli hit from anywhere and everywhere, making 14 of 20 shots from the floor and five of seven on three-pointers as he led the Warriors with 37 points in a 110-102 win over New Orleans. 6. Hilton Armstrong, New Orleans Hornets – Armstrong could be a low-post presence in his second season. On Saturday against Golden State, he showed decent moves around the basket and was active defensively and on the boards, finishing with 17 points, five rebounds and two blocks in only 19 minutes. 7. Jason Maxiell, Detroit Pistons – Maxiell played very well Saturday in displaying a solid low-post game and a nice touch on his jumper. Obviously, he is taking summer league very seriously, having lost all the excess fat he had in college. Maxiell finished Saturday's 91-89 victory over Philadelphia with 22 points on 7-for-10 shooting. 8. Javaris Crittenton, Los Angeles Lakers – He might be the answer for the Lakers at the point guard position. Crittenton displayed nice poise and shot the ball well (8-for-13 for 18 points) in a 66-64 win over Milwaukee. He is very good at changing speeds while handling the basketball, making one move where he hesitated at the top of the key and then exploded to the basket for a resounding dunk. STRUGGLING 1. Francisco Garcia, Sacramento Kings – Garcia continues to have trouble with consistency. He shot a poor 6-for-18 from the field on Saturday and had five turnovers. He did, however, mix in some nice passes. Unfortunately, the Kings do not need flash next season; they need a reliable contributor. 2. Yi Jianlian, Milwaukee Bucks – Yi really struggled in his second game, and, as a result, Team China labored to score in its blowout loss to Sacramento. He had difficulty being guarded by a more athletic forward, winding up only 2-for-14 from the floor with nine points. He also committed five turnovers. 3. Jordan Farmar, Los Angeles Lakers – Farmar had a tough time in almost every aspect Sunday. His decision making was terrible, resulting in six turnovers, and he shot poorly (1-for-8 from the floor). Farmar's ability to fill the Lakers' gaping hole at point guard has never been more in doubt. Updated on Monday, Jul 9, 2007 2:41 am EDT

And on a separate note, I hope that randolph plays well in NY...he is a great rebounder and scorer...and even though he is a complete and utter knucklehead and a colossal screw-up, maybe just maybe he has his crap together to stay out of trouble. Was the trade comparable regarding talent? Of course not, but Portland knew that going in...it was one year ago that randolph was considered by virtually everyone to be untradeable, and they at least got a very good backup/marginal starter on his rookie contract with Frye (who may end up being trade bait but one with value). BTW prior to the trade a buyout for Francis' contract was discussed and he should be bought out this week. Yes he will still be on the cap for two years, but will not infect the young players with his horrible attitude. And someone has told me that the in two years when his contract (and lafrentz' I believe) comes off the books the blazers will have more capspace than anyone else in the league? Enough to sign a free agent as well as extensions for Roy and Aldridge. So to sum up best of luck to Zach, and if he stays out of trouble he is a great player.

Quote: They traded Zach Randolph for: Stevie Franchise = Contract just as bad as Randolphs? Frye = Another soft PF to go into the soft PF collection. I was wrong, I really thought nobody would touch Randolph's contract. Especially after hearing Isiah say he was committed to building an uptempo team. So yes, Diesel was mistaken. However, NY made fools of PTL... Did they not? I mean, they got a legit 20/10 PF and in the process they got rid of a distractive PG with a huge Contract? So somehow, it's pwned or whatever you want to call it because I couldn't predict how STUPID PTL would be in trading Randolph? I apologize to the Diesel faithful about that! I, Diesel, make my posts based on what is logical. So, yes, it seemed very logical that Zach Randolph would be a Trailblazer for life given the circumstance. But you have to give Pritchard credit... I mean it's really thinking out of the box to take just as big a distraction with just as bad a contract...I guess it's like Babcock trading Smitty for Mr. refer in a can himself Isiah Rider. Sure, it could happen, but NFW do you think anybody would be stupid enough to do it. And here I was thinking I was responding to Beav saying that Randolph would be traded for Niocioni (SNT) & Filler. LOL! Only Diesel can make an ass out of himself by going on a rant, then come back and make a post out of this. Sweet! Need I remind you that you were too much of a chickensh*t to actually back up your words a month ago? Nope you can go on a rant when I simply said that the the blazers: 1) would not trade aldridge to atlanta (which they did not) 2) would make every effort to trade randolph (which they did) Geez Diesel you embarass yourself... this is ridiculous even for you...

Quote: Article today mentioned Houston trading a guard that could include Head or Alston. Chicago is also rumored to dealing Duhon. Any takers for these guys? They are more in our cap range. Alston is a really bad shooter...way worse percentage than speedy which is scary! I think that alston is definitely gone from HOU... they traded for mike james and drafted aaron brooks in the first round...

Quote: Yeah I got the same message about the game not being listed in the area. I tried to switch my address to Seattle and that didn't work either lol.The link you put up worked though.So how did Durant look besides weak? This is a liveblogger from the blazers board...Summer League: Seattle/Durant UpdateBy DavePosted on Fri Jul 06, 2007 at 07:43:07 PM EDTFor those of you wondering about the Sonics and Durant, the following brief report:There's a bunch of good news and a little bad news with Durant, all of it fairly predictable. The kid is skinny, even among his young peers. A couple of times he was guarded in the post on the switch by Maurice Ager (6'5" and 202 lbs). He got bodied around. (He can't move anybody out of the post on defense either.) He does have some incredibly smooth finesse moves in the post though. Like all young players he started the game rushing things and missed his shots. Once he settled down though...whooo! He looks unstoppable already. He's just so quick to spin and leap. The key to guarding him will probably be banging him out of position before he ever touches the ball.Durant looks most comfortable when the ball is in his hands. He covers an incredible amount of ground with or without the ball. He switches directions quickly. As soon as the refs let him carry the ball a little he's going to be deadly. He's already drawing fouls off of his moves. He's 6'10" with 6'4" quickness.Durant's most sterling asset is also his most obvious. He is a quick and effortless leaper. Man oh man.Also of note for Seattle: Jeff Green looks pretty smooth and poised. He had a nice short jumper and take off the dribble. He appears to have a ton of confidence.Seattle's going to need somebody to hit shots when Durant gets doubled. I wonder if this could be a good year for Wally Szczerbiak?Jose Juan Barea looking good for Dallas. His passes are smooth as silk and he has a nice shot too. It's too bad he's not three inches taller. Maurice Ager is taking up right where he left off in last year's summer league, which is basically as a leaping scoring machine.A lot of this reinforces that quickness is a real asset in summer league. Those who have it prosper because not everybody does. This is what kills a lot of summer league superstars...they get into regular season play and face people who can stay in front of them and can't produce.One game is way too soon to make judgments about anybody, but I'm impressed with Durant already. We'll see Oden tonight. More to come...

Quote: Maybe because Bibby makes 17 millon per year and he is on the decline.Bibby shot 40% fg last year. That's horrible for a pg. Bibby's career FG% is not bad for a PG and 3 pt shooter (which he is) it is over 44%. He shot badly last year due to a major wrist injury he suffered a few weeks before the start of the season. He tried to be a gamer by coming back a projected two to three weeks early from the injury and it cost his shooting all year. All that being said Bibby is not worth that kind of money. If he were more in the 8-9 million ballpark the hawks should be all over him.

Quote: Quote: The Vick apologists are keeping me away from that board! I used to like it quite a bit actually... Come on over to falcons.scout.com. I post there frequently under the same user name. I'll check it out thanks! So how are things in the Couve lately? I don't get up there so much anymore... I have a lot of friends that went to Fort Vancouver High...

By Bill Simmons When we were in Houston for All-Star Weekend, one of the marquee events was the annual Technology Summit at the Houstonian, featuring celebrities such as Mark Cuban, David Stern, George Bodenheimer, Magic Johnson, Charles Barkley and Anderson Cooper. Little was made of another gathering: The first-annual Atrocious GM Summit, held Sunday morning at the La Quinta Inn. Our dream panel included Philadelphia's Billy King; former Raptors GM Rob Babcock; Lakers GM Mitch Kupchak; former Knicks GM Scott Layden; former Cavs GM Jim Paxson; Minnesota's Kevin McHale; former Orlando GM John Weisbrod; and, of course, Isiah Thomas of the New York Knicks. Sadly, Wes Unseld was unable to make it after he accidentally traded his first-class Delta Airlines ticket to Houston for three Southwest Airlines tickets to Atlanta. (Note: We were going to invite Elgin Baylor, but he was ruled ineligible for the discussion after pulling off the Cassell-Jaric and Radmanovic-Wilcox heists. That's not the Elgin we once knew and loved. Come back to us, Elg.) Of course, when the NBA asked me to moderate this discussion, I couldn't have been prouder. Here's a transcript of what happened: Simmons: Guys, first of all, thanks for joining us today, it's an absolute honor to be here. King: Just remember, if you do a good job for the next two hours, I'll give you a $25 million contract for six years! (Everyone laughs.) Simmons: Jim Paxson, let's start with you. Last February, you traded a 2007 first-round pick to Boston for Jiri Welsch. Four months later, after you were fired by the Cavs, they traded Welsch to Milwaukee for a 2006 second round pick. To my knowledge, that's never happened before. Walk us through that. Paxson: Absolutely. When you're making a bad trade, there are some inherent elements that need to be there. First, are you putting your own short-term interests ahead of the long-term interests of the team? With the Welsch trade, there were rumors I might get fired, and we needed another body to make the playoffs … really, why would I care about protecting future No. 1 picks if I was probably getting canned? McHale: Hear hear! I don't think we have a first-round pick until 2017. And I might trade that one this week. Paxson: See, Kevin knows what I'm talking about here. The second element: Are you rolling the dice with someone with "potential," who has never contributed to a winning team? Jiri had bounced around the league and couldn't even crack Doc Rivers' regular rotation -- and Doc uses 11 guys a night. So that was in place. Third, and most important, are your fans going to be outraged when they hear about the trade and say things like, "What the hell?" and "How can we stop this guy, he's a menace?" That was there, too. And that's what made the trade so appealing. It's not often you can trade for someone who's worth half as much four months later. Along those same lines, we aren't just trying to upset our fans, we're trying to confuse them. For instance, three years ago, I gave Kevin Ollie $15 million over five years. Now, he's a below-average guard with no real skills -- if you rated a point guard in eight different categories, he's probably a C-minus or below in each of them. If you're a Cavs fan, how are you supposed to react to that contract? Complete confusion, right? Well, those are good reactions. At least your fans are discussing the team. If the fans are talking about you, it doesn't matter if it's good or bad, at least they're talking. Layden: And there's another element here, Jim: You want the fans to feel like they could do a better job than you. When I was in New York, every Knicks fan thought they could do better than me. Every one of them. And they were probably right. Well, you know what that really means? There's a small piece inside of them that says, "If this schmuck can run the Knicks, maybe some day, I can run the Knicks." And once they think that, you have them for life. Those are the people who keep buying tickets and jerseys and hats. Simmons: Mitch, when you took over the Lakers, you had the best two players in the league and could have won 10 straight titles with the right moves. Instead, you couldn't get it done. Then you traded Shaq for 30 cents on the dollar; you gave cap-killing contracts to run-of-the-mill guys like Chris Mihm and Devean George; you blew all of your draft picks; you wasted the next three to four years of Kobe's prime by drafting a high school center over someone like Danny Granger, who could have helped right away; and then, you outdid yourself by trading Caron Butler and Chucky Atkins' useful expiring contract for Kwame Brown. But the Shaq-Kobe saga overshadowed everything; you haven't gotten enough credit for being a complete debacle. Does that bother you? Mitch Kupchak AP "Enough about Isiah, let's talk about me." (GM Mitch Kupchak) Kupchak: I'd be lying if I said it didn't. When we made the Kwame trade, I was thinking to myself, "This is it, this is the one, now maybe people will start talking about me." Well, it didn't happen. Then the season starts, and Kwame's just a complete stiff … still, nothing. Then Phil [Jackson] goes on the record and calls Kwame a "p----." Nothing. People in Los Angeles just don't care. When you look at what I've done in L.A., it's amazing, really. I traded the best center in the history of basketball 19 months ago, and all we have to show for it is an unhappy Lamar Odom, Kwame and Brian Grant's eight-figure buyout. And yet, nobody mentions me. No offense, Isiah, but you don't realize how lucky you are -- when you screw up, everyone goes crazy. I built a team in which Smush Parker is our third-best player and the 10th-best guy on the Clippers would play 40 minutes a night for us -- yet does anyone ever talk about me? Of course not. It pisses me off. Thomas: And that's one of the reasons I wanted to work for the Knicks. When I screwed up in Toronto, nobody cared. When I ran the CBA into the ground, nobody cared. When I coached the Pacers and lost a series to Boston in which we had 10 of the best 12 players, nobody cared. In New York, they care. Right now, I'm working on a trade with Orlando where we give up Penny Hardaway's expiring deal and Trevor Ariza for Steve Francis. It's an illogical trade in every respect -- Francis' contract is terrible, there's no way he'll mesh with the other guys, he's never won anything, he gives us the same problems that Marbury gives us, it's a disaster right out of the gate. And that's what makes it so great. When we pull this trade off, New York fans might actually riot. I'm not kidding. Kupchak: Sure, Isiah, rub it in. (Everyone laughs.) Simmons: Isiah, don't you think you're almost too obvious at this point? At least we could see both sides with some of Mitch's moves. In your case … (Editor's note: Over the next 30 minutes, Simmons proceeded to list all of Isiah's terrible decisions since he took over the team in December 2003, in chronological order, as the crowd voraciously applauded each move, almost like how the president gets applauded over and over again during the State of the Union address. For space reasons, we're skipping to the tail end of Simmons' question.) Thanks to all of those moves, the Knicks have more untradable contracts than everyone else in the league combined; they won't be under the cap until 2009; they have a payroll that's $50 million higher than anyone else; and they won't have a high lottery pick until 2008 because of the Curry trade. So how can you sell this as a rebuilding effort when you don't have any picks, and how can you sell this as a move to contend when none of the current guys could possibly mesh? Isiah: That's an excellent question. The key is to make people believe you're trying something that's never been done before. In my case, I always try to acquire the best guy in the trade, regardless of whether it's a good deal or not -- then I can say I'm "stockpiling assets," which throws people off the trail a little bit. Then, I like to float big names to reporters … like right now, I'm making it seem like KG is a possibility for us, and that's why I'm gathering all of these assets. But I don't have a chance in hell of getting KG. If Minnesota trades KG, it's going to be for cap space, picks and young players, and we can't give them two of those three things. So they would never deal with us ---. McHale: I wouldn't be so sure about that! Isiah: Really? McHale: Have you seen some of the moves I have made? Name another GM who cost his team three first-round picks because he wanted to sign someone like Joe Smith to a max contract under the table! Name me another GM who would have willingly traded for Mark Blount, or given huge contracts to Marko Jaric and Troy Hudson, or signed sketchy character guys like Michael Olowokandi and Eddie Griffin! You don't think I would give KG away in a terrible trade? You're crazy! I resent that! Isiah: I didn't mean to offend you-. McHale: Well you did! Simmons: Kevin, let's talk about the Joe Smith debacle. What delighted me wasn't how you lost the picks, but that you were ready to give a max contract to the likes of Joe Smith. Does it hurt your feelings that nobody remembers how dumb this was? McHale: Of course, of course. At the time, Joe was a guy who gave you 13 points and eight rebounds a game -- solid, but not spectacular. We were willing to pay him twice as much as he was worth, we cheated, we got caught, we lost all those picks … and you never hear this mentioned. If we were a big-market team? Different story. Babcock: I have to disagree with that -- I think everyone can agree that I made the worst trade of the past 10 years. Simmons: The Vince Carter trade? Babcock: Right. I gave him away to the Nets. Gave him away. And I'm known for that now -- it didn't matter that I was working for Toronto. So you can have a negative impact on a small-market team, I think. Rob Babcock Ron Turrene/Getty Images Thoughts on trading? For GM Rob Babcock, one step forward and three steps back. (The crowd applauds.) Simmons: Let's talk about that trade, Rob. Walk us through your thought process. Babcock: When you're trading an unhappy superstar, like Isiah said before, you have to get one of three things back: Cap space, draft picks or young stars. Or else your fans will flip out. Especially if the guy immediately starts playing hard again, which was a mortal lock in Vince's case, because he was clearly tanking it for us. Anyway, my goal was to trade Vince without getting cap space, draft picks or another young star -- that's what would have made it the worst trade of all-time. The problem was that you can't be too obvious with this stuff or the commissioner's office will veto the deal. So what ended up happening was, the Nets gave us two non-lottery picks to save face, but everything else worked out -- not only did we not get a superstar back, we took on three bad contracts, including Alonzo Mourning's deal, which we had to buy out. So instead of getting cap space back, the trade hurt our cap space. I was more proud of that than anything. Weisbrod: You know, I loved that trade, but I loved the Rafael Araujo pick even more. Babcock: Thanks! Weisbrod: Passing up Andre Iguodala for a 24 year-old center who averaged 0.1 blocks per game in college and runs like a duck … I just thought that was brilliant. Babcock: Well, you hope with these things, but you never sure how they'll work out until they happen. Simmons: Let's talk about the draft, guys. What are some strategies there? Worst guy available? Taking someone at a position where you already have someone? King: See, that's where you're wrong. It's always better to make good picks in the draft -- this way, your fans can become attached to them, then you can trade them for inferior guys with bad contracts. Plus, it throws the media off your scent a little bit. I would much rather draft a decent guy, then trade him down the road, or overpay him with a crazy contract that makes no sense or kills my cap space. If you're openly tanking draft picks, it's too obvious. Thomas: I agree, Billy. If you look at what I've done over the years, I always drafted well: Stoudamire, T-Mac, Camby, Frye, Ariza … you want to stockpile as many assets as possible, only because it gives you more options to do something dumb. Babcock: I couldn't agree more. That's the single-biggest mistake I made with the Araujo pick. In retrospect, I should have taken Igoudala, kept him for a year, then traded him last summer for Joel Przybilla and immediately given him an $85 million contract extension. Oh, well. You live and you learn. McHale: I'm kicking myself right now … I wish someone had told me this before I drafted Ndudi Ebi and William Avery! (Everyone laughs.) Simmons: So if you don't want to kill your team with bad drafting, what other recourses are there besides trades? Thomas: Keep changing the roster -- you don't want any semblance of continuity. Once guys get used to playing with one another, they might start winning. Look at the teams that have done well over the last 25 years -- it's always been the teams that built around a nucleus. I even played for one in Detroit. That's why I like to keep mixing things up every six to seven weeks. Why chance it? King: I'm also a big fan of giving out absurd contracts that tie up your cap space, for three reasons. First, it drives the fans crazy and gets them talking about the team. Second, your fans won't complain that you aren't making any big moves, simply because you can't make any big moves, your lack of cap space prohibits you from getting quality guys unless they have baggage. And third, when people look back and try to put your reign in some sort of historical context, those salary numbers will jump out even more. Just look at what I've done in Philly: Since we made the 2001 Finals, I gave Mutombo a $68 million extension even though he could have been, like, 48 years old for all we knew. I gave $35.5 million to Aaron McKie. I gave $29 million to Eric Snow. I gave $18 million to Greg Buckner. I gave $40 million to Kenny Thomas and $25 million to Brian Skinner. I gave $25 million to Kyle Korver and $60 million to Sam Dalembert last summer. That's $300 million of contracts to guys who were either on the decline or never that good in the first place. Plus, I traded for other bad contracts, guys like Keith Van Horn, Glenn Robinson, Kevin Ollie, you name it. And then, last February, the pinnacle -- dumping three bad contracts for C-Webb, who everyone thought couldn't be traded because of his contract and because he ran with a limp. Now we have an aging team built around two past-their-prime stars and our cap space is killed through 2008. And we completely wasted Iverson's prime, when he was one of the best players of his generation. (The crowd applauds.) King: Thank you. Thank you very much. Thomas: Billy, if you start getting some heat, there's a way out -- you can sell the situation to your fans by telling them, "Even though these guys are overpaid, they're going to become very valuable in the last year of their contracts as trading chips." Of course, they don't know that the only star players that are ever available are guys like Marbury, Francis, Jalen, Baron Davis, Erick Dampier, Zach Randolph … (Isiah breaks up laughing.) Simmons: What about Vince? Kupchak: That was like the "Perfect Storm," really. You had a very good GM trading with a very bad GM. You had a superstar willing to shame the game of basketball and taint his entire career just to get traded. You had a small market team playing in relative obscurity, in a docile city where the fans really wouldn't revolt beyond a certain degree. I don't think we'll see that again. Paxson: I agree. In just about every case, if there's an expensive name available on the market, there are strings attached. If there weren't strings attached, why would their team be so anxious to trade them? Fundamentally, it makes no sense. For instance, if I offered you a 2003 Jaguar convertible with 12,000 miles on it for $5,000, then claimed nothing was wrong with the car, would you be a little suspicious? Or would you convince yourself that the car just needed a change of scenery? I don't know why the fans haven't figured this out yet -- name players are usually available for a reason. Thomas: That's why, as I said before, I like to float out rumors that we're "arming ourselves with assets" to make a run at guys we could never realistically get -- like KG, Kobe or LeBron -- because it gives our fans hope. They think we have a chance at those guys, when the teams that actually have a chance are the Bulls, Clippers, Hornets, Bobcats, Celtics or anyone else with valuable young players and multiple picks. You really think I could get KG this summer for Jalen's contract, Channing Frye, David Lee and a 2012 No. 1 pick? Come on. McHale: You're doing it again, it's like you're deliberately testing me. Thomas: Whoops, my bad. McHale (hushes voice): Wait, Jalen, Frye, Lee and a 2012 pick … would that be an unprotected pick? Simmons: Guys, guys, wait until after the summit. Weisbrod: Lemme chime in here … you can always disguise a terrible trade by blaming either the luxury tax or a lack of cap space as your reason, like when the Celtics ended up getting stuck with Vin Baker a few years ago, even though he was practically bringing a flask onto the court with him for the layup lines. But if you have an unhappy superstar, you're better off trying to mend fences with him over dealing him, that's the one thing fans won't forgive. Simmons: You learned that the hard way with the Tracy McGrady trade, right? Weisbrod: I sure did. That ended up being your classic three quarters for a dollar trade -- we got Francis, Mobley and Cato for him, or as I liked to call it, "the pu pu platter." For the purposes of destroying a team, it worked fine. But I underestimated how much Orlando fans liked Tracy -- they were just furious with me, I ended up getting death threats and everything. Layden: Cool! Weisbrod: Yeah, apparently that was a first for the league. (Crowd applauds.) Weisbrod: But I went too far -- you don't want to end up losing your job because of one trade, and that's what happened to me. I have a lot of regrets about the whole thing. I had six or seven more horrible moves in me. Simmons: What about acquiring guys with personal problems who could potentially screw up your team chemistry? How important is that? McHale: Oh, it's huge, there's no question. Look at my team right now -- it's like a crazier, more dysfunctional version of the team from "The Fish That Saved Pittsburgh." Crazy is good. Crazy players can throw off the fans because they can say, "Wow, on paper, we look fantastic, the only question is chemistry." But that's the thing -- a good NBA team is 50 percent talent and 50 percent chemistry: Look at Phoenix right now, they're getting it done with two All-Stars and parts that nobody else wanted. How? Chemistry, that's how. On the flip side, if you don't have good chemistry, you're going to lose. Look at my Ricky Davis trade -- we're 4-9 with him, and in 12 of those 13 games, he took more shots than KG. Eventually, they're going to fight to the death. You think I didn't know this when I traded for him? Thomas: I'm with Kevin -- you can never have enough problem guys. When Vin Baker was bought out by Boston because of his drinking problems, we jumped on him. When Qyntel Woods bounced around because he used to fight pit bulls, we jumped on him. I'm even thinking about having Chris Andersen move in with me -- I want to make sure I'm the first one there when his suspension ends. (Everyone laughs.) Simmons: Scott Layden, you were really a pioneer of sorts in terms of screwing up cap space and taking on terrible contracts. Layden: Why thank you. Simmons: You traded for cap-killers like Glen Rice, Luc Longley, Travis Knight, Shandon Anderson and Howard Eisley. You gave Allan Houston $100 million when he couldn't have gotten more than $71 million anywhere else. You gave Charlie Ward $28 million. You traded Marcus Camby and a lottery pick that could have been Amare Stoudamire for Antonio McDyess and his bum knee. By the time you got canned, they were a lottery team. Looking back, did you go overboard? Were you too incompetent? Layden: Oh, absolutely. There's an art to being an atrocious GM -- you can't just destroy a team without leaving any semblance of hope. By the time I got fired, we had one of the highest payrolls in the league and no real assets other than Houston and Sprewell, who weren't even All-Stars. So Knicks fans were depressed, but even worse, they couldn't look at the team and say, "Well, this guy's a name, and we have this guy, and maybe we can trade this guy … " All the hope had been beaten out of them. To me, that's the beauty of what Isiah has been able to pull off. Casual hoops fans can look at the Knicks' roster and say, "Wow, we have Marbury, Eddy Curry and Jalen Rose?!" Diehard fans can look at the roster and say, "This is just crazy enough that it might work," or "Maybe we can package some of these guys for a superstar." So there's a little bit of hope there, even if it's misguided, ridiculous and inane. When I was there? No hope whatsoever. And that was my biggest mistake. Simmons: So you like what Isiah has done? Layden: Hell, yeah. Take the Francis trade, if it happens: Logically, it makes no sense because Francis and Marbury are the same player -- expensive, shoot-first point guards with huge entourages and attitude problems who have never won anything. Even if you're getting Francis for nothing, it still makes no sense on paper. For example, let's say you spent $3,000 on a living room sofa two years ago that you didn't really like. To make the sofa stand out a little less, you bought a leather chair for $2,200 that doesn't match --. Simmons: Marbury is the sofa and Jamal Crawford is the chair in this case? Layden: Precisely. And the room still looks bad. So now, you're on Craigslist and you see that someone is selling another $3,000 sofa for $900 that's almost exactly like the sofa you have. And there's no way you would ever want two big, ugly sofas in the same room. It would just look ridiculous. But your mind-set is, "Hey, how can I turn down a $3,000 sofa for $900?" So you buy the sofa and stick it in the room, which is now cluttered with stuff since you also spent another $10,000 on some crummy art, a coffee table with support problems, two giant bookcases that have to be turned sideways, some wobbly end tables and a smashed sculpture that was patched back together with duct tape. But since it's too late to go back, you spend another $5,000 on an interior decorator to make the room work. Well, you know what would happen? He wouldn't be able to make it work. You bought too much crap. See, this is why Isiah is a genius: He's assembling the basketball version of that nightmare living room, and he has the fans convinced that either the expensive interior decorator -- in this case, Larry Brown -- will be able to make everything work, or he can somehow swap some of that furniture to one of his neighbors for a first-class piece of art. And he's spending an ungodly amount of money! And you never hear rumors that he might get fired! I think it's a tribute to him and his staff. He's the best-ever at being an atrocious GM. He really is. Thomas: Thank you, Scott, that means a lot. Simmons: Lemme ask you, Isiah -- the one red flag seems to be that you're spending an alarming amount of money. Just this year alone, you have a $123 million payroll for 15 wins. When the luxury tax kicks in, you will have shelled out nearly $200 million for a 25-win team. Doesn't fiscal responsibility matter here? (There's a beat, and then everyone laughs.) Simmons: I guess not! Mitch Kupchak, Rob Babcock, Scott Layden, Kevin McHale, Billy King, John Weisbrod, Jim Paxson and Isiah Thomas … thanks for your time! Ladies and gentlemen, the most atrocious GMs of the decade! (The crowd applauds wildly.) Simmons: Guys, what do you say we cap this off with a high-stakes poker game back in my hotel room, just the nine of us? Seriously, what do you say? Please? Pretty please? Bill Simmons is a columnist for Page 2 and ESPN The Magazine, and his Sports Guy's World site is updated every day, Monday through Friday. His new book "Now I Can Die In Peace" is available on Amazon.com and in bookstores everywhere.

The Vick apologists are keeping me away from that board! I used to like it quite a bit actually...

Hey gsu, you post on the falconsroost board too right?

Quote: It's not 100% official yet, but NY got the best of this deal by far and by Large.. They sent: Francis = disruption. Injured. Overpaid. Frye - Good prospect, kinda soft. They got back: Randolph = Beast. Fred Jones = You must be kidding me. Dickau = Gravy! Yeah good thing he doesn't listen to you! Also a good thing that you weren't foolish enough to take me up on my bet challenges one month ago. "Diesel Hawksquawk Supporter Reged: 06/08/02 Posts: 20867 Re: Because Aldridge is not untouchable. [Re: beav] #222711 - 06/03/07 05:33 PM Edit post Edit Reply to this post Reply Reply to this post Quote Quote: They will make every effort to trade Randolph, particularly now since he has had his career season. OMG... A response from a PTL fan... OK Beav, I agree, they will make every effort to trade Zebo... BUT after his latest run in with the Law and with his what 64 million dollars left on his deal... WhO... I said WHO...I SAY WHO will trade for Zach?? YOu were hoping that BK would be stupid enough to do it BUT BK countered your offer and said Aldridge, Jack, and the 08 first. So again.. WHO will trade for Baggage and 64 million dollars left? Wake up to reality Beav. Zach is going to be a Blazer until his blazer days are over. Get used to him. if you couldn't trade him during the last season when he had allstar buzz, he won't get traded. Beav, come up with a name? Who will you trade him to? Isiah doesn't want him? Philly doesn't want him. Hell, you can't get Golden State to trade you Foyle and Pietrus... Who? So you can get your clippings. Get the Oregonian and whatever other paper you want. The Lumberjack times... and show me 1 suitor for Zach. Who?" -------------------- "Everyone in society should be a role model, not only for their own self-respect, but for respect from others." Barry Bonds

Quote: "I wouldn't be surprised," said one West executive with more than 25 years in the league. "He's got talent. I don't know if he'd be the second pick in the draft again, Ummm... you're an NBA executive and don't know the answer to that question?!?

I agree that the 8th seed is a stretch... not only will the hawks have to play better, but there will probably have to be injuries for a few teams But: Indiana is in my mind pretty close to done... they really don't have capspace to sign anyone other than with the MLE which will net them someone like kareem rush, steve blake etc (marginal starters) I see Charlotte being a ray felton injury away from the worst team in the league... Jason Richardson's recent injury history should be a little concerning too... NY got some strong talent with randolph no doubt, but add me to the list of ppl that wonder how he and curry will co-exist... Philly: just not impressed..true I avoided watching them like I would avoid a promised case of chlamydia, but I have seen first hand mo cheeks coaching skills...

It sounds like the clippers are making a big run at him, and his friendship with mobley may be big... Clippers aim to get Francis Sources say L.A. hopes to use part of its mid-level exception to sign the recently traded guard, who could become a free agent this week. By Jason Reid, Times Staff Writer July 2, 2007 Moving to bolster the team at point guard, the Clippers are pursuing three-time All-Star Steve Francis, who could become a free agent this week, league and team sources said Sunday. The Portland Trail Blazers, who acquired the eight-year veteran Thursday, are expected to buy out the final two years and $34.25 million of Francis' contract, freeing him to agree to terms elsewhere after he clears waivers. Teams cannot sign players until July 11. General Manager Elgin Baylor and Coach Mike Dunleavy are also interested in Jason Hart, who joined the team late last season, and Brevin Knight, but Francis is potentially the team's highest-profile option. The Clippers hope to sign Francis, 30, for a portion of the mid-level exception, reuniting him with his longtime friend, guard Cuttino Mobley. Francis and Mobley played together in Houston and Orlando, and Mobley's presence might give the Clippers an edge in reaching a deal, sources said. Francis and the Clippers, however, are in a holding pattern because of NBA rules. Until medical examinations are completed, the league won't approve the five-player trade that brought Francis and center Channing Frye to Portland and sent power forward Zach Randolph and guards Dan Dickau and Fred Jones to New York. Portland must wait for the deal to be finalized before the buyout negotiated by Francis' agent, Jeff Fried, can take effect. Attempts to contact Fried, Baylor and Dunleavy were unsuccessful Sunday, but sources said acquiring Francis is the Clippers' top off-season priority. Sam Cassell turns 38 in November, Shaun Livingston is recovering from a severe knee injury and Daniel Ewing's contract option was declined, so the Clippers say they need help at the point. The Clippers drafted point guard Jared Jordan of Marist in the second round (No. 45 overall), and he's expected to compete with Guillermo Diaz, the team's second selection in last year's draft, and Will Conroy to be the third point guard on the roster. The Clippers envision Cassell and Francis sharing duties, sources said, and Francis also could be an effective scorer off the bench at the other guard spot while Cassell runs the offense. Francis averaged 11.3 points, 3.9 assists and 3.6 rebounds in 44 games for New York in the 2006-07 season, but has career averages of 18.4 points, 6.1 assists and 5.6 rebounds in 566 games. Three times, Francis averaged at least 21 points, 6.2 assists and 5.8 rebounds. Acquired by the Knicks before the 2005-06 trading deadline, Francis never seemed comfortable in New York, stirring questions about whether he could still be productive. In the Knicks' final four games, Francis averaged 25 points. jason.reid@latimes.com

I agree. No doubt that this was a short term fix for ainge to possibly save his job, but this should definitely be a playoff team for the next two years. If (and I know that this is a bit of a big if) Allen can play 75 games there is not a better scoring duo in the East, and Jefferson is becoming a star.

Quote: Quote: Quote: Diesel, stupid post like this are exactly what make you a joke. There is no part of Robert Traylor that resembles Al Horford. Ummm... you may want to re-read his post... Ummmmm. Why ? What is your point. If you think a team that wins the NIT is anything like a two two time defending NCAA squad you need to be in the nut house with Diesel. Well even folks in a nuthouse know the difference between tractor traylor and maurice taylor.

Quote: Diesel, stupid post like this are exactly what make you a joke. There is no part of Robert Traylor that resembles Al Horford. Ummm... you may want to re-read his post...

Beyond Oden and Durant: NBA Draft odds examined Wed, Jun 20, 2007 By Tim Roberts The Finals are but a dreary memory now and the NBA Draft on June 28 promises to freshen up a league suffering from mustiness. The draft can determine a team’s fortunes for years to come and can pad bettors’ bankrolls in the meantime. Ohio State’s Greg Oden and Texas' Kevin Durant will go No. 1 and No. 2 to the Portland Trail Blazers and Seattle SuperSonics respectively. The odds on them suiting up for another team next season (+1200 for both) underline that it’s not worth your while to speculate on their destinations. The intrigue is found in the rest of the first round. Let’s try to make some sense of the draft picture and pinpoint where the betting value lies. Odds courtesy Sportsbook.com and Sportsbetting.com. Draft order (lottery only): No. 1 Portland; 2 Seattle; 3 Atlanta Hawks; 4 Memphis Grizzlies; 5 Boston Celtics; 6 Milwaukee Bucks; 7 Minnesota Timberwolves; 8 Charlotte Bobcats; 9 Chicago Bulls; 10 Sacramento Kings; 11 Atlanta Hawks; 12 Philadelphia 76ers; 13 New Orleans Hornets; 14 Los Angeles Clippers. The next best thing: Nos. 3 through 7 Al Horford, Florida – Pick: No. 3 (9-5) Mike Conley Jr., Ohio State – Pick: No. 4 (6-1) Brandan Wright, North Carolina – Pick: No. 5 (9-2) Yi Jianlin, China – Pick: No. 6 (3-1) Corey Brewer, Florida – Pick: No. 7 (5-1) Hawks GM Billy Knight loves to pass on quality point guards despite his team’s needs and looks to do it again this year. Horford goes No. 3 even though Conley’s a strong man at the point. The Grizzlies also need a PG, meaning there’s value in Conley to go No. 4. Memphis has a two-headed general manager at the moment, however, with Chris Wallace being groomed to replace Jerry West, so the pick is less predictable than might be expected. Boston has talked to Minnesota about trading for Kevin Garnett, a hypothetical deal that would surely include the No. 5 pick. That makes things tricky. Wright has tons of potential, Brewer’s a versatile winner and teams fall over themselves to pick “the next Dirk Nowitzki,” a role played by Yi this year. As such, it’s nigh-impossible to recommend a No. 5 pick, but I would recommend avoiding the “field” option with all of these guys. The order is tricky, but nearly all NBA teams have them as the Nos. 3 through 7 picks in one form or another. The schools who ruled Florida and Ohio State met in college hoops’ top game this past April and they’ll each feature prominently in the NBA Draft in June. Florida Gators drafted in the first round – Pick: under 3.5 (-200) Brewer, Horford and Joakim Noah are lottery picks. Taurean Green was a point guard on a two-time NCAA champ and Chris Richard has size and hops, but neither is likely to crack the first round. Draft order of Florida’s Big Three – Pick: Horford first, Brewer second, Noah third (2-5) It’s the order seen in virtually every mock draft you can find, hence the unattractive odds. Big Al’s going first, so Horford-Noah-Brewer at 12-1 is the only other decent option. Brewer-Horford-Noah at 11-10 likely has the least value among the available options. Ohio State Buckeyes drafted in the first round – Pick: under 2.5 (+135) While oddsmakers seem to assume someone will take a chance on Daequan Cook, the swingman disappeared during the Buckeyes’ late-season run and didn’t hit double-digit points in any of OSU’s 10 games in March and April. Here’s guessing a lot of NBA personnel were watching those games. My conference is more depleted than yours! Big 12 players drafted in the first round – Pick: over 3 (-160) Durant, Julian Wright from Kansas and Acie Law from Texas A&M are sure things, so the under is a no-go. Someone might gamble early on Mario Boggan or JamesOn Curry from Oklahoma State, but setting the number at 3 has “push” written all over it. SEC players drafted in the first round – Pick: over 4.5 (even) Florida’s Big Three are locks. The other Gators are not, but add LSU’s Glen Davis, Vanderbilt’s Derrick Byars and Alabama’s Jermareo Davidson to the mix and the value is on the over again. ACC players drafted in the first round – Pick: over 5.5 (-200) I know, I know. Pick too many overs and you end up with an overcrowded first round. The oddsmakers are right to expect six or more first-rounders from the ACC, though. Wright is going in the top seven, and Georgia Tech’s Javaris Crittenton and Thaddeus Young, Florida State’s Al Thornton and former Boston College shot-blocker Sean Williams will join him in the first round. After that, one or more of BC’s Jared Dudley, Duke’s Josh McRoberts and Virginia Tech’s Zabian Dowdell look likely to crack Round 1 too. PAC 10 players drafted in the first round – Pick: under 3.5 (+135) Spencer Hawes from Washington and USC’s Nick Young are going high. One of USC’s Gabe Pruitt, UCLA’s Aaron Afflalo and Arizona’s Marcus Williams is likely to join the pair in the first round, but will two of them do so? Big 12 vs. PAC 10: Most players drafted in the first round – Pick: PAC 10 -0.5 (-170) The Big 12 has three guaranteed first-rounders, but they could be the only players from the conference taken in the entire draft. The PAC 10 only has two first-round locks, but has more players on the cusp. Even though I took the Pac 10 under 3.5 above, they have a far better chance of having four first-round picks than the Big 12 does.

Quote: #3/Speedy to GS. Jason Richardson/#18 to Milwaukee. #5/Bogut to Atlanta. Not bad, but MIL has the 6th pick...still would do it though....

Quote: In grand Terrell Owens fashion { even though T.O. won his case} It appears Lewis;s agent missed the deadline to file the paper work needed for him to be a free agent. He may still be under contract with Seattle for the next to years at 10 mil plus. Looks like Vecsey strikes again! Ingram: The Reality of the Rashard Story By Bill Ingram for HOOPSWORLD.com Jun 19, 2007, 19:18 Anything that starts with Peter Vecsey should be treated with utmost skepticism. Either he has the worst sources in the NBA, or he has a bad habit of creating news from thin air. Today he sent the free agent gurus into a frenzy when he suggested that Rashard Lewis was not going to be a free agent this summer after all. Lewis is arguably the top free agent available, and has been linked to talks across the NBA. He will most certainly improve his current $10 million pay day - or will he? In a column today Vecsey reported the following: If my information is accurate, Rashard Lewis may not have met the requirement to become one of the NBA's most desirable free agents. If accurate, the Sonics' 28-year-old (on Aug. 8) All-Star (2005) has two guaranteed years ($10,129,870 and $10,909,091) remaining on an agreement signed five years ago when he was represented by Kevin Poston. If accurate, new agent Tony Dutt mishandled critical paperwork regarding his client's escape option. Well, his information was not accurate according to Sonics Director of Public Relations Tom Savage, who today assured us that the paperwork was filed on time and both parties understand that Lewis is a free agent as of July 1st. That's the truth behind the rumor.