Hawkmoor

1 hour ago, Jody23 said:

Strong disagree with the notion Nique didn't have any help.  Over the course of his tenure, he had Moses Malone, Kevin Willis, Tree Rollins, Spud, Theus, Carr (Big Dog), John Battle, Mookie Blaylock, Augmon, and the list goes on.  I'm not saying he had the absolute best, but his supporting casts top ANYTHING Trae has had.

 

Nevermind.  AHF beat me too it and represented.

You mean that chemistry disaster that lasted TWO seasons with Theus (a hot dog) and the black hole called Malone that lasted three seasons and destroyed any sense of chemistry the Hawks had.  That duo lead to that Hawks 80s team's downfall.  I get why the Hawks management wanted them. Conceivably Theus was supposed to be a upgrade over Randy Wittman and Malone was supposed to be the scorer that Tree Rollins never was. 

Boston Celtics players to this day talk about how Dominique never had help in Atlanta.  At times they would say "the right thing" on camera but they knew otherwise.  Blaylock played I believe half a season with Nique and Augmon never played with him (correction, half a season because it was the year Wilkins tore his Achilles).  Antoine Carr, John Battle, they were scrubs compared to what Bird, Jordan, Magic and Isiah had going on.  Spud.  Get real.  Willis is the only legit debate and even he wasn't on the level of what the Lakers, Celtics, Bulls and Pistons could throw at you.  They were good players but not prime time players.  I remember reading a article where Dominique and Mike Fratello were asked why Fratello leaned on Nique soo much in big moments and it was said that the other players DIDN'T WANT THE BALL in big moments, that they were fine with Nique being the guy.  Thats why that team never got over the hump against the big boys.

2 hours ago, Vol4ever said:

I'm highly disappointed in Quinn.   Nate is a much better coach.   That move was a mistake.  

A VERY surprising mistake.  I was for Quin coming here and called for it numerous times.  Dude is a fake.  He has the look and the stare but is not a head coach.  You can watch ANY other random NBA game and see plays being run, see the schemes, see what a team is trying to do to you.  With the Hawks its just the same thing over and over: spread the wings and let either Trae or Murray go one on one or take it into the trees. You don't have to have great shooters if you have a scheme that keeps the defense on its heels.  Players can get in a flow, even bad shooters, when the scheme works. Not saying a team of not great shooters can win consistently, but they don't look THIS bad either.

10 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Nique didn't put anywhere near as much pressure on defenses as Trae does. Hardly anyone has who's played this game at this level. 

Brah...  These types of comments is why I don't post much.

11 minutes ago, givemesome1ce1 said:

Trae went to the Eastern Conference Finals…Dominique never did. 

 

 

Dominique carried the Hawks to FOUR straight 50 wins season by himself with zero help outside of Doc Rivers who wasn't a big time scorer.  He went up against Jordan's Bulls, Bird's Celtics, and Isiah's Pistons.  You think Trae would've beat any of those teams? And Trae HAS HELP compared to Dominique having zero help.  Murray averaging 20 points.  Collins damn near 20 points before Capela phased him out of the offense, then you got guys scoring in the mid to high teens like Hunter, Bogi, etc.   Dominique carried FOUR straight Hawks teams to 50s win by his lonesome in a rugged Eastern Conference.  Any of them players from the 80s would tell you that Nique is a waay better player than Trae.  Its not even a discussion. Heck, Trae ain't even the best shooter on his current team, Bogi and Griffin WAS until he went Mark Jackson. Trae is a better SCORER than those two players but not a better shooter than either one.

3 hours ago, REHawksFan said:

 

So for me, I don't want to give up the best offensive player in franchise history and a legit top 10-15 offensive player in the current NBA. I'd rather keep trying to build defense that fits around Trae.  I get it.  It hasn't worked yet, but I also don't think they've had a great plan yet.  Or at least they haven't implemented the plan well yet.  

Woah. Slow down cowboy.  I was following you into you said THAT...Trae can be stopped.  Defenses double him in big moments and get the ball out of his hands. Dominique would destroy entire defenses.  You couldn't double or triple team him when he was on his game and Nique played when the game was physical, not this current powder puff stuff where they let guards get into the lane.  That wasn't happening when Nique played and old heads on this forum KNOW THAT to be true....

I'm gonna make a serious case that the Hawks looked better under Nate McMillan.  This is a overall statement about the entire season,  both with and without Trae Young in the lineup.  This team looks horrible. No excuse for Quin and that superstaff over there having the Hawks looking like this.  I get that the team doesn't have a bunch of shooters, but they can't run plays on offense OR play defense?

1 hour ago, Packfill said:

JJ would get roasted trying to defend guards. He is barely adequate defending small forwards. 
 

The Hawks need a premium defender at center, another defensive oriented big wing and a strong defensive guard, and they need those players to be real top 8 rotation players. 

Can he at least stay in front of guards long enough to cut off passing lanes with his height?  

2 hours ago, terrell said:

Really? Like who?

https://craftednba.com/player-traits/sieve

https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/worst-defensive-rating-nba-player(3 Hawks starters in the top 10..lol)

 

I mean, those stats tell the story.  It doesn't matter how many points you score if you can't stop anybody.  Thats the Hawks dilemma. If they are really trying to win they have to address it.  IF THEY ARE REALLY TRYING TO WIN. The first step is to evaluate EVERY player.  The next step is to come up with the solution.  Right now the Hawks front office appears to be trying to stradle both sides of a fence and it can't be done.  You have to address the lack of defense in your backcourt and it doesn't matter If Trae Young OR Dejuante Murray doesn't like it (thats player evaluation). 

If you have to go with a bigger point guard more often and in key situations to slow down the other team then so be it. I'm not adverse to playing Jalen Johnson in the backcourt (either guard position).  He has the skillset to do it and would be the player they SAID Bill Simmons WAS suppose to be. 

Dejuante is just out there.  He doesn't care anymore.  Thats the problem with players when they see no vision from the front office. It rubs off on the players and they just show up.  This isn't about Trae Young himself, its about the message you are sending your team.  The Spurs long success was based on treating every player equally and as a cohesive team unit.  The Celtics success is also like that.  The Warriors long success was based on that. They play TEAM ball on offense and defense and nobody is bigger than that.  It starts at the top.

2 hours ago, JayBirdHawk said:

IIRC - only the Friday games are on Peachtree TV. 

The NBA league pass games should be from the original schedule, I think.

When are the Amazon Prime games scheduled to start? I checked 2 weeks ago, but said game was blacked out.

The Amazon games start next season.  As far as this season goes I wasn’t aware the Friday games were moved to Peachtree TV. Thanks.

They got to get this mess sorted.  The bad part is Bally hasn't been forced to be transparent with their issues.  You don't know what channel games are being televised on from moment to moment.  Peachtree tv, NBA league pass, Bally, now Amazon Prime gonna be in the mix.  To make matters even worst, I've been forced to get Bally Sports Plus to watch the games and not all the games are on that subscription service.  

On 8/11/2023 at 9:47 PM, JeffS17 said:

Well, yeah, 99% of his tweets are just quoting scripture... that's not interesting to anyone.  Of course the one where he says going to a Beyonce concert is "promoting Satan" is going to garner attention.  His tweets almost never pass judgement on other people like that.

That will do it.  The moment he points fingers it gonna garner attention.

On 8/10/2023 at 2:12 PM, BangHolman said:

He was tweeting about how the rapture is coming and a bunch of other stuff yesterday.

This is what kicked it off. Then he got some feedback and did a live with more feedback. Just providing for context.

https://twitter.com/whoisAG21/status/1689287339720212480?s=20

Not gonna lie:  This world is soo out of balance right now that even though I'm not a religious fanatic,  I can see it.  We live in a "everything goes" world right now.  As far a A.J. himself, he LOOKS like a religious type.  You can see it in his mannerisms and how he moves up and down the court.  It makes sense now.  Thats his perogative.  He made it the Hawks business though when he started posting about it.  Go see Mark Jackson.

On 8/11/2023 at 9:16 PM, Carmine said:

Y'all would rather have him in Magic City making it rain with a face full of ass? Let's stop clutching pearls lol

9 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

He was out for personal reasons in early December. Personal struggles, death of nephew etc. Read from page 32 in this thread.

My bad.  I'll check it out.

DeAndre I feel could benefit from a offense that lets him be either the first or second primary scorer.  I really believe that.  Jalen has higher overall upside because he is more physical at the rim which is a very weak point of Hunter's game.  Cam Reddish shouldn't even be in the discussion.  Too inconsistent for no reason.

I see too much of this with Hunter at the rim:

Whats the deal with A.J. Griffin?  I haven't been keeping up with him.  Is he having problems picking up the schemes?

2 hours ago, Wretch said:

KAT is a loser that doesn't play defense and doesn't know how to win.  I hope the TWolves get to The Finals and win it all.  Then maybe Hawks fans would stop talking about trading for him and we can focus on defense.

Him and Trae would be a perfect match...

14 minutes ago, AHF said:

 

Acting like Trae is responsible for LP and Nate's departure is pretty rich considering that no NBA is remotely interested in either as a head coach.  Are we ignoring the obvious that they shouldn't be head coaches and Trae didn't hire either one of them? 

Blaming Trae for Reddish wanting a bigger role and then learning some hard lessons in New York is crazy.  Blaming Trae for Schlenk signing JC to a contract with too much money is unbelievable.  Blaming Trae for Ressler being too cheap to pay JC is unbelievable; blaming Trae for Utah wanting to get rid of JC is unbelievable.   Blaming Trae for Ressler booting out Schlenk and putting his son in the front office is unbelievable.  

Trae absolutely has his flaws and bears his share of the blame for the good and bad of the team over the years but this stuff is really reaching.

They don't even want trae on the allstar teams and u.s.a. teams, lmao. "injury replacement allstar"....lmao

2 hours ago, givemesome1ce1 said:

The amount of discussion about Dejounte being a backup plan in case Trae decides to ask out is crazy. Quin likes Trae and Trae believes in Quin’s system. The personnel around Trae has always been the problem. If Trae decides to ask out, we might as well go full rebuild. Dejounte isn’t even half the player Trae is, and we don’t even get half the wins this season without Trae on this team. I rather us trade Dejounte for a forward that can do the stuff that we need than waste time trying to “compete” with Dejounte. It makes no sense. Next season, play Bufkin more (who Quin should’ve played this game), get better defenders who are cheap like Naji Marshall and Torrey Craig, and we will be okay. 
 

This game is so frustrating because this team played well for 20 minutes and then just collapsed and it was in part because Trae and Dejounte just forget how to play basketball. This was a must win game and they blew it. Hope we at least win against the Hornets. 

TWO head coaches later, Cam Reddish, Johnson Collins AND a GM and its still everybody else is the problem and not Trae...

1 hour ago, terrell said:

You got fans still talking about Marvin over CP3 man.. and trading NIque for Manning..

But just let this one go? lol

Hawks gonna Hawk

The Trae love is insane...

7 minutes ago, AHF said:

I'm not following this.  Fields didn't do either of those things but did draft Kobe.  If he is going to be unreasonably emotional as your post suggests, wouldn't he be invested in his own decisions proving to be successful?  I blame Bufkin being anchored to the bench in this one solely on Snyder.  

I'll also put myself on record that I'm ok losing some games down the stretch in order to develop AJ and Kobe.  We need them to be rotation players next year.  Might as well start that now to help them prepare for it.

"The minutia of debating the issues about a team that has zero championships since coming to Atlanta and is in constant rebuild mode. "

9 minutes ago, JeffS17 said:

It's not a point of pride for that our star player has these issues...

this is the point...

26 minutes ago, JeffS17 said:

This game is on Trae -- he was terrible and even more importantly, he played selfishly and with a bad attitude.  The refs allowed a physical game on both sides and that seems to be a recipe for us to lose every time, because Trae cannot let it go when he doesn't get foul calls.  He was significantly better for a 3-4 game stretch there but has returned to his complaining to the refs -- or probably more accurate description, his straight up pouting all game.

It's a huge problem to be honest, as I've outlined before.  Trae has negative leadership qualities.  He sets the tone and energy of the team as the best player, face of the franchise, and the guy with the ball in his hands the most.  And the tone he is setting is one of whining/pouting/complaining incessantly.  And then he gets emotional and tries ridiculous iso shots and starts playing outside his game.  And the worse part is the rest of the team follows suit -- Dre was doing tons of complaining last night, as was Murray.  In fact, Murray seems to have gotten much worse over the past year or so with regard to ref complaining.  Our team culture is to come out and assume we're playing 5v8 from the start of the game and make that a self-fulfilling prophecy.  We'll never win anything with a culture like that.  Seeing Trae flop, get a tech for flopping, then walk around the court doing the money hands symbol as if the refs were rigging the game was an embarrassing spectacle.  Super disappointing game all around.

32 minutes ago, AHF said:

So we saw a good 16 minutes from Bufkin with him most notably showing the ability to move and keep his man in front of him.  The next game both our starting guards are out of sorts and being completely ineffective defensively.  How are there not minutes for Bufkin to see if he can change the pace of things defensively?  You find time for Garrison but not for him?  

Bufkin was the #15 pick in the draft this year and is a combo guard.  This is exactly the kind of game where you'd think by this point in the season he could contribute to turning a loss into a win by bringing energy off the bench and letting the coaches work with DJM and Trae to make adjustments to how they are approaching things on the floor by talking through that while he is out there (maybe even showing what they want done).  

This game was very frustrating to watch period.  Kudos to Hunter and Bogi but they were the only two who had a good game for us.  This is also where your last two first round picks are needed to bring some different looks, energy, and variation to the game.  But apparently that isn't the plan.  Not sure why not.

"but we traded luka for trae and 3 firsts for dejuante...duh"