REHawksFan

2 minutes ago, JayBirdHawk said:

Fatty Sullinger and 'work into shape' should never be in the same sentence. The only shape is 'blob'

If Fatty Sullinger couldn't get in shape in a contract year what makes ypu think he will now. You dissapoint me @kg01. Smh.

It's interesting to me that even in bad shape Sullinger put up numbers that compare favorably to Alice. 

Alice is the better player, but if the Hawks had Sullinger in a backup role, he'd play less minutes so the out of shape problem wouldn't be as big an issue.  Seems like an upgrade to Splitter anyway. 

I know he's not a great outside shooter but he seems like he'd make a decent backup big.  Have no idea what the cost would be.  I've never been a huge Splitter fan and there's no telling what Scott's future holds.  Any interest from the Squawk??

As an aside, now that the Celtics have moved on from Sullinger, I'm even less impressed with their roster moves adding Al and losing Sullinger.  They seem to have gotten less physical and more finesse.  They take a big step back in rebounding (Alice's 10.6 per 48 vs Sullinger's 16.9) and only a marginal uptick in scoring (22.7 pts per 48 for Alice vs 20.9 for Sullinger). 

The reasons I think the Hawks will be better this year have probably been touched on already but I'll just put it out there like this:

1. I think they will be a more balanced team in terms of toughness down low (rebounding) versus shooting outside.  I don't know why but the idea of a Center taking more 3's and getting less Rebs just makes me sick.  I know the Hawks will be sacrificing some scoring by subbing in D12, but I think it will be a net positive as teams won't be as likely to get 2nd chances.  I also think D12 opens up shots for the wings, which can only help.

2. I think the injury to Kyle last summer was really undersold last season in terms of how it impacted his preparation.  I know he's old, but Ray Allen is pushing social security and he can still shoot.  There's a place for guys like Kyle in this league and I think he can excel next year if put in the right situation.  Shooters shoot and Kyle is every bit the sharp shooter that others are.  Give him a full summer of good workouts and I think we'll all see a lot closer to 2014-15 Kyle rather than 2015-16 Kyle.  Hopefully, he comes off the bench and is used as a specialist rather than a 35+ min guy. 

3.  I'm optimistic about Baze and Prince from an offensive standpoint.  I'm hopeful they will start Baze at SG and that Prince will eventually work into starting at SF.  A lineup of D17 / Baze / Prince / Sap / D12 is very intriguing to me. 

So basically, the increased toughness, a healthy and prepared Kyle, and the potential of Baze and Prince give me reasons to think this team will be better than last year.  The first two points are what I'm really hanging my hat on.  The 3rd pt is more hopeful. 

7 minutes ago, Ebert said:

Horford has put himself in a pretty dangerous position. He has lost any love from Hawks' fans. He will be hated in Atlanta now. And no one can guarantee he will success in Boston, their fans will expect a lot from their new "star". 

I was looking over some stats from this past season earlier today and it remarkable how Alice was basically just marginally better than a lot of their Bigs in Boston.   He's obviously a better player than Sullinger and Amir Johnson and Kelly Olynyk but statistically, he's not a HUGE upgrade.  It will be interesting to see if Steven's system increases his productivity compared to Bud's system.  If not, they may have some upset fans in Beantown. 

1 hour ago, hylndr11 said:

I think we are set, at this point - if we trade anything its going to net us nothing better - we have to think splitter will be healthy and baze and Dennis get better, getting rid of scott or tiago totally kills the frontcourt depth - we cant sign anyone like scott for what hes at, or Tiago, ideally we want another scorer but for us we dont have the assets to give.   If things are shitty and not coming together by the deadline, OK

Trade Paul and try to get picks and young talent, probably try and trade Dwight too especially if it looks like we are making progress with him, his contract will look like a steal - AT LEAST get some quality picks and young talent to build with; 

That would be the ideal "tanking" strategy - as mentioned before this new latest dynamic really doesnt bode well at ALL for tanking in a traditional sense too many teams trying to do it, if Boston is kicking ass or CLE or any other teams do better than expected we might be able to pull some serious building blocks from them at the deadline, although when you have two teams that are so far superior to every other one it will be a challenge. 

Here is my question - does anyone here really keep up with college and what the next couple drafts would look like,  is there anyone up and coming that looks to be a talent we should target?  I guess well find out by the deadline, if the staff thinks there is. 

That said the team will be very interesting to watch to see how bad this gets or if by some miracle this actually works. 

PS - is AL horford fking serious not even saying farewell to the fans, hes said a million times how well he was treated here - Im looking at all these players that left there teams and its all respect.  What did we do to really piss this guy off - all this bullshit out there about Howard, OK but he wanted to play with another bigger guy - none of it adds up at all.  I hope one day we get the full story,  Im sure it wasnt just one thing but do you really let ur agent have that much control in changing towns for endoresments and ur family in ur ear - this isnt the NFL. but both KD and Horford got articles out there about making a big splash to shake things up. 

CAN NOT WAIT to play Boston,  and would pay big money to see Dwight throw alice down to the floor. 

 

 

 

 

 

I'm sorry.....I can't seem to get past this statement.  Maybe I'm misreading it cuz, you know, it's Tuesday after the 4th and I'm back at work and not really fully with it today, but ARE YOU REALLY FREAKING CLAIMING THAT BOSTON IS FAR SUPERIOR TO EVERYONE ELSE NOT NAMED CLEVELAND?????

I mean, like, REALLY? 

They sub out (of starting) 10.3 pts / 8.3 Reb / 2.3 Ast / 0.6 Blk per game in Jared Sullinger and sub in Alice and his 15.2 pts / 7.3 Reb / 3.2 Ast / 1.5 Blks per game.  It's a net gain but it's marginal for a team that was middle of the pack in offensive efficiency last season.  They also lost Evan Turner and his 10.5 pts a game. 

PG: Thomas

SG: Bradley

SF: Crowder

PF: Jerebko

C: Alice

How is that "far superior to every other team"??? 

I'd  go with :

Dennis / Delaney

Baze / KK / THj

Prince / Thabo

SAP / HUMP / Moose

D12 / Splitter / Edy

I'd love to swap out Tiago, moose, and Scott for better pieces but not sure who right now. 

Honestly the more I think about it the more I think Al did Atlanta a favor.  Saved them from themselves to a degree.  Yes, I wanted him to sign and the hawks to trade Splitter and parts to keep a Sap/Al/D12 combo, but that wasn't realistic.  And given the option of keeping Sap or keeping Al, I want Sap.  He's a much better player.  I'll worry about 2017 in, well, 2017.  The way he did it sucked and it makes me not really like him but ultimately, I think the Hawks will be better off than if they had tried to ship Sap off and kept Al (obviously we'll never know for sure since we don't know what Sap would have brought in return, but I'm assuming it would have been based on picks rather than players to free up Cap Space). 

Yeah sign me up for a Jamal reunion tour.  He was one of my favorites and is instant offense for a team that struggled to score last year.  I like it. 

Is there any way the Baze deal could be structured with a lower first year (like 14M or so) that would make clearing 18M for Al a little easier?  All I've seen is 4-70M for Baze.  Anyone know the actual starting salary?

4 minutes ago, ATLiott said:

Even if this happens, Baze getting 70 mil seems insane. 

Yeah but the truth of the matter is he was getting that or more regardless.  My question is the team better off with him or without him?  If it's truly a choice between him or Al, I want Al and will make with the wings we have.  But if they somehow get Al to go along with Baze, I have no problem with it as I'm not sure who they'd spend the money on that would be better than Baze. 

1 minute ago, RandomFan said:

With the Bazemore signing, and it appearing that Al might be on the outs, I think people are ignoring the fact that Al could have told the Hawks earlier today that he wasn't going to sign with us, which is what led us to sign Dwight in the first place.

I know everyone want's to blame the Hawks for signing Howard OVER Horford, but it might not be like that at all.

This is a good point, especially when you consider the Hawks offered Howard 64M first and later upped it to $70.5M.  Maybe they got a call from Al inbetween offers?  Who knows really.  But that is certainly plausible.   

8 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Right now, we have 6 million dollars in cap space with 14 players. Since no one can be signed till July 6th, we still have all of our cap holds. 

The mission to keep Al is an extremely tough one. It includes 

A. Trading Splitter. 8.550 million

B. Trading or cutting Scott 3.33 million

C. Trading or cutting Patterson 874k 

 

This gives us over 18 million dollars in cap room.  Now finding a home for Splitter needs to happen right about now. 

I TRULY hope this is the crazy plan.....but what I don't get, is if so why would they announce Baze first and risk it falling through and losing Al when Al is clearly the higher priority?? 

It just seems backwards to me.  Get Al in the house with an agreement and then pursue the trades and crazy stuff to fit Baze in.  I mean this scenario, if it even exists with the Hawks, is about risk losing Al or risk losing Baze.  Losing Al is far worse, imo. 

3 minutes ago, Alex said:

He has a consistent track record for being a whiny baby everywhere he's gone.  He isn't all of a sudden going to change.  Ask LA and Houston if a change of scenery was what he needed.  He wore out his welcome on three different teams and to boot he can't even stay on the court.  

I find this statement extremely ironic for some reason......

Ok so here's my obvious question....if the deal averages 23.5 what does it start at?  If it starts at 20M or so they could theoretically makes some roster moves (splitter, scott, etc.) and free up 12-15 for an additional signing.  Is that accurate?

Alright.....now let's get Al to buy in and see what the hell happens.  It'll be fun to watch anyway.

58 minutes ago, Diesel said:

 

Which Old friend are we talking about?

There's exactly 2 guys in that array of pics that I wouldn't mind having off the bench in the right situation and for the right money. 

1 minute ago, Hotlanta1981 said:

Not buying it....

1. Hawks just beat Boston in the playoffs and so Horf would be going to a worse team.

2. He would be making less money?

3. We can't forget that Boston's biggest talking head has already insulted him.

It doesn't make sense for him to go to Boston unless they landed Durant. That's not going to happen though.

While I ultimately think Al re-signs with ATL, I will point out...

1. Bos + Al is far better than Atl - Al (and likely Baze)

2. Fair point and the reason I doubt Al leaves

3. This is irrelevant

7 minutes ago, RandomFan said:

I imagine a lot of the conversations with the Hawks today are revolving around trying to convince all three of Howard, Horf, and Baze into taking some kind of discount in order to put a championship level team together - at least on some short-term 1+1 deals to try and get all 3 under the cap this year.  With promises of pay increases next year once the cap goes up again.

If one of those three balks, then we'll have a new dilemna on our hands.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but under that scenario, isn't Al's deal sort of irrelevant since the Hawks own his Bird Rights?  I mean, they have an $18M cap hold for Al and isn't that locked in?  That reportedly leaves about  $25M to spend so wouldn't the convo be between Baze and D12 about splitting the $25M?  That's a HUGE sell and not at all likely, imo.  I think Baze is gone and they are going after the D12/Al combo. The challenge or goal would be to get D12 to sign a bargain deal to allow them to go after another player as well. 

4 hours ago, wolvetigers said:

Let me first start by saying I'm not a fan of cry baby Howard, nor paying Horford the Max.  But it is time for the Atlanta Hawks to really roll the dice to prove to it's fans and to the league that we are serious about winning a championship....I realize this move puts Milsap coming off the Bench like Iggy in Golden State. Imagine us playing a platoon system, bringing these two back together will bring intense excitement to the media starve Atlanta Hawks, plus if healthy we basically stake our claim to the ECF and maybe then we can give the Cavs a good series. 

 

PG- Schröder / Jarrett Jack

SG- THJ / Korver

SF- Thabo / Prince / Bembry

PF- Horford / Milsap

C -   Howard / Splitter /Muscala

 

 

AND YES WE LET BAZEMORE WALK...and Move Korver to the bench

 

 

 

 

I don't think you go with that lineup as it leaves offensive voids at 3 positions really.  Plus Sap is the teams best player so not sure there's any scenario where bringing him off the bench makes sense.  But I think I could grow to like the roster.  I'd probably start most games with all three bigs on the floor and then take Al or D12 out first and just rotate around the rest of the game unless matchups dictate a big lineup.  You could easily give each of the 3 30+ min if you wanted to even if they weren't all playing together.  It's not like any of them are young and needing to play 40+ min a game. 

4 minutes ago, Thomas said:

Yeah, tanking hasn't truly worked since the lottery was formed because of Houston's tank job for Olajuwon. We were out of the playoffs close to a decade last time we started over. I myself would be seventy years old if its that long again and don't want to watch a whole lot of losing in the meantime. Want the Hawks to win every game possible. 

If the Hawks decide to go that route after losing Al, I'd much rather they trade Sap for young assets and maybe a lottery pick and then do the best they can.  That way there's not a lot of losing but still some hope for the future.  Sort of like the Boston model.  Heck, if Al agrees to the Max from Boston tonight they should see if they'll do a SNT for some of their assets and maybe the Brooklyn pick next year. 

Just looked it up, DWade's Cap Hold this year is $30M so I'm not sure how the Hawks to even get close under the Cap unless he took way less and then I'm not sure why he'd leave Miami.