sturt

If depth is your biggest strength right now, you're not in a good place, because you had more depth last post season and self-evidently were not satisfied with that depth. Effectively, on the court, the FO has dispatched a starter-level talent (bad), moved up a high-ceiling back-up (good), and have decided to count on a 2nd round rookie to pick up some of those minutes (bad)... and what minutes he doesn't pick up, seem likely to ask two SFs to also share some PF load, ie, who have never exactly excelled yet in their young careers in that role (bad and bad). Nah. Your biggest strength right now, as I'm seeing some saying... you have a head coach that is about as highly regarded and universally regarded as you ever see a head coach become in the National Basketball Association. The players are going to respect his decisions from the first jump ball, almost certainly, and fans are going to respect.... oh, well, who am I kidding... fans will only respect his decisions for a relatively brief honeymoon period, then if he doesn't meet expectations, he's going to be as toasted as the last guy... maybe just a slower burn, but a burn nonetheless. It's only too bad that he's not getting the chance to go to war with a stronger roster. But as I've said more than once, the Mighty Quin might just be that good. And yeah, Jalen, too. But here's what matters. Antony can be happy that there's some reason for hope as the season begins, and he's going to generate some revenue while at the same time not going to risk paying tax. He can be really happy given all that. So, he'll keep owning the team. And after all, isn't that what we all really want... you know what they say... happy owner, happy life. Or something like that.

North... cited RAPTOR. I'd looked it up months ago... believe I examined numbers and graphs of last 3 seasons. Camp, if you're suggesting there is an alternative explanation for why two starter quality talents were sent away in exchange for zero talent in return... in two consecutive off seasons... Have to say that's not like you.

(Forgive me if I'm reading into the reply to my comment something that wasn't intended.) There's never been (to my understanding anyway) any pretense that Siakam was going to be traded for peanuts... ie, a significant haircut, then, for TOR. Indeed, if the 8/8 report was accurate that Hunter and Griffin were part of the package being offered for Siakam, that's a lot for a guy whose numbers of late have mostly resembled the same numbers that Baptist was giving you. (IIRC, their FiveThirtyEight RAPTOR scores have been practically identical.) It is much more like approximate equal talent value than it is a haircut for TOR. There may have been an upgrade in terms of name recognition, mainly b/c years ago Siakam was part of a championship team. Was never any realistic aspiration for significant gain in terms of talent inventory for the head coach to deploy. It's mostly a wash. The logic I laid out undergirding the hamster-wheel conclusion made remains stout. But good luck to you all. I'm not omniscient, I can't pretend to know what the future holds, and anything is possible. I can only claim to know history, and that history is so often a really good teacher as to what is more likely to happen than not.

Quote me please so I know what you're referencing. I may have said something that you interpreted that way (?), but whatever words you read that I would have written were not intended that way. I know. Because I don't believe that. And I don't write things that I don't believe. Yes and no. I've given up on the team because unlike the prime perennial contenders who make deals without any apparent serious heartburn at paying tax, this team is so stomach upset that it will actually move a starter for nothing... and did so, now, twice... in the space of two years. And yet, the owner wants everyone to believe what he wants everyone to believe. I don't trust the owner. And I shouldn't at this point. No one should, imo. His behaviors over the last year and the comments he's made are duplicitous at times, incoherent with the evidence at other times, and self-serving always. I've seen this movie too many times to not know in my heart what's far more likely next... hamster wheel status. Ressler is Lucy, dangling the football. But I'm not Charlie Brown. At least, not anymore. Right. And. It was/is a myth that this team would ever be on the good end (talent) of such an equation at this point.

By definition, because the Raptors are no fools, you were going to have to give up at least what is conventionally perceived as equal talent value for Siakam. It solves nothing basketball-wise, then, to make that deal. You're losing about the same as you're gaining.... ie, after having lost already a starter-quality talent. Here's the essentials of the journey just experienced. The talent inventory on this roster was up significantly last off-season with the addition of DJM. Then, almost as suddenly it was down a Huerter with nothing coming back to balance that out. Until, that is, 2/3 into the season, sending 6 2nds out for Bey. And by most accounts, the team played well, even played extremely well at times... even, at times, the performance level envisioned when the DJM deal was originally made. And now, giving up JC for nothing? Yeah. No draft pick inventory to make up for his loss in another Bey-like trade. The hope is for JJ to be just as good as JC, but not just that... remember, you have to also see someone back-up JJ at a level somewhat equivalent to what he already has shown. But wait... that's just to get to where you were at the end of last season. What you need is someone who's going to make the team even better than the last time the team took the court. Thus, the grand hope that JJ will not just be "as good," but substantially better than JC. Good luck with that. And that's not a snarky comment. I hope it works out for you guys. And it could. Especially with Quinn running things. Who knows.

Know you kid, but probably more truth to that than anyone should feel good about. Ressler, doing his daily routine scan of Squawk, sees this, and something like this can be audibly heard reverberating out of his head... Yikes. Not good. I kid, but I also know of at least one baseball owner who practically said this one time, not long after he'd bought the team and there was talk that local fans were upset because he'd taken a $65m bribe from MLB to move his franchise to the American League. Appeared in a FL newspaper where he owns a golf course, though, not the Houston Chronicle, so he didn't suffer too much for it... and yeah... he was right. They were his beaches, as it turned out over time.

But is it? No, this isn't looking at all things through Eeyore glasses. Like some. My conclusion is rooted in pragmatism, not cynicism. I've cited very precise, very empirical, very cogent reasons for coming to the conclusion I have. It's about reason, not emotion. God knows, I didn't want to get to this place, and what you said above is rooted in that very premise... you know this runs counter to my nature. I certainly understand why most don't wanna go there. I didn't either. I can't not. Thanks, Tony.

camp, I could have written that. You know that, right? And I probably would have even just a year ago. But last year, they were still clearly attempting (to me) to add talent, not subtract it. It was still plausible to say they were prioritizing the on-court talent/performance over the off-court expense to the owner. Not writing that any more. Done defending the decision-making, and God knows, I've defended the Ressler group, the Joneses, and the Lerners/Rizzo to the point of causing others regurgitation of their lunch in the past. I'm not the type to disparage wealthy people in general. I'm not the type to consider my opinion better grounded automatically over people who wealthy people have hired to run their sports operations. But I'm not stupid. And I'm not sheep. Even best case scenario, to the contrary of what I (sarcastically) said above, there is nothing rational that would prevent JJ from getting the same or more minutes than JC. Is it awkward to have someone making so much less to be playing so much in comparison to someone making so much more? Sure. But. Which is worse? To do that... or... to effectively cut JC (and, so, you're having to replace those minutes with a decidedly lesser talent)? One is miles and miles worse, and it's unfortunately the one that happened. And Occam's Razor demands that fans just admit if they haven't already that the waddler and quacker is a duck... this team's owner undeniably at this point is more content with remounting the hamster wheel over all-out pursuit of a championship. They're going to be good enough to be competitive (I think)... and so, arguably--and from Ressler's POV, thankfully--in a good position to sell tickets and merch... but whatever they are, it's going to be less than they would have been on the other side of, effectively, exchanging JC for Patty Mills. If you're not going forward, you're going backward. Last off-season, Huerter was let go for literally nothing positive coming back in the trade. Nothing. This off-season, same story, but substitute Collins. Steve Koonin, I get it. It's your job to sell the team. Literally, your job. You've always been pretty good at it, too. But/and, if you're reading this, the old saying goes "don't piss on me and tell me it's raining." Everything you're saying could play out, but it doesn't change the fact the roster is not improved by subtraction. Even if this team goes on to great success, it will be an inferior success to what would have been with an asset of John Collins' quality. And if this team fails it will be a greater failure because you parted with Collins. Urine, unlike rainwater, smells horrible. This smells horrible. And I'm sure as hell not swallowing it.

That's a choice you get to make for you, of course, as everyone does. Me, I have a big issue because I've seen this movie before. Too many times before. And not just as it applies to the NBA, but definitely as it applies to the NBA nonetheless. It doesn't have to bother me. I can close my eyes to it if I wanted. But I don't want to do that this time. This time is one too many. Ressler betrayed my trust that he was authentic, and I'm not going to be jerked around any more. That's just me.

I love camp, but this mindset is absolutely insane to me, from the standpoint of anyone who has been a ATL fan for more than 20 years. Iow... "They're highly distinguished authorities in their profession... an owner and front office whose decisions are always and completely about winning championships... and so their decisions are indisputably cogent, and it's not like any of us have any choice in the matter anyhow but to be submissive since we're all slaves to their religion. So, look, getting rid of John Collins represents an improvement for the roster... addition by subtraction... keeping him was holding us back... we're better without him... a logical impossibility to give JJ as many or more minutes than JC, so stop yer yammerin." (Oh. I get it now, Steve. Thanks.) Or, more concisely for the TL/DR types, and you know who you are...

Don't think I said I wouldn't be posting ever any more. What I'd said is that this won't consume my time like it used to, because I no longer have any good reason to believe the owner is serious about winning a championship. And yeah, I hate that it's come to this. Hate, hate, hate. This team purposely took a significant step back by totally ditching a starter-quality asset and having no concurrent move that looked to replace that asset. That's a hallmark of hamster-wheel-ism. I've waited all these years for this team to get to this very place where they were legitimately close to getting over the hump. Insert cliche' regarding definition of insanity. This is no longer a journey that I'm willing to take. It's not a religion. It's a consumer entertainment option. I'm choosing other options. So, yeah, I'll still visit, but less out of any interest in the team, more just to check-in on old friends (and otherwise...hehe). More lurking, less posting. Substantially less posting. Lurking maybe once a week or every other. We'll see. And maybe Antony Peter sells the team in a few years... at that point, I'll reassess. Done with him and his shenanigans.

Presented without comment... https://www.sfchronicle.com/sports/warriors/article/grant-liffmann-hawks-vp-18265217.php

Hmmm. Well. Still. Not sure why I'm included in the comment... ie, never was anyone advocating hard for Horf or for DHunt. But to the degree I ever did advocate for DHunt, it was mostly about what camp, iirc, said about what Snyder had indicated he considered most vital to see the team improve, which just happens to be the thing that distinguishes DHunt in the first place... so, more about the likely value Snyder placed on him than any strong opinion I had.

??? Realize you're (at least) half-kidding, but I don't know how I could make myself any clearer than I did 6-ish weeks ago, old friend. Now, if I ever would do what you suggested... ie, at least while the current power structure is in place ... you should be able to gather that by googling the words of the avatar at the left... words which on their own defy the very concept you proposed. For some people, it's more like religion. For others, it's more like a consumer entertainment choice.

Not my problem anymore, and not that my opinion should matter one iota... btw, what's an iota.... but I digress... but... you folks sure as hell better hope that JJ indeed is so superior to JC that he more than replaces JC's minutes. It's football season, tho. Let's do this. Cowboys defense lookin like a juggernaut.

XXX

This, but worse. They're backing away from improving the team at a critical moment, and in my experience, this predicts (yet another) hamster wheel period followed by (yet another) tear down. Back at ya. And at the risk of seeming too proud about it--a genuine risk because it really is chilz, dolfan, and this new regime of the current lead dogs that HS is the success it's been (take a bow, mods and cap)--I founded Hawksquawk in 2000, and was able to coax some AJC board posters like Diesel to join in. So, yeah... longer than everyone, period. Appreciate the good vibes. But unlike a lot of sports fans, I've had some practice at this. I really do approach it as a consumer entertainment choice, not a form of religion. Quit the NBA for a few years until faith was somewhat restored that the league was recommitted to reffing games with some integrity. Stopped being an Astros fan altogether as the new owner accepted the commissioner's bribe to transition to the other league where they played a strategy-starved form of the game that I didn't find entertaining. Stopped being a baseball fan altogether when that strategy-starved form of the game became universal. I generally considered myself among the most optimistic, if not the most optimistic of fans here. Well, maybe except for @Gray Mule. But there can be no real Columbo investigation necessary to understand why my hopes for this franchise dropped off the table. My posts don't leave a lot of room for anyone to claim that they don't know where I stood/stand... with regard to whatever aspect you want to examine. I won't be back for as long as this regime is running the show. And look, I'm one of the last fans to beat on an owner of one of my teams. I really am. I enrage a lot of Cowboys fans with how I defend Jerry Jones on occasion. But the man does spend money and while the team hasn't been super successful, and while he and Stephen don't make all the best decisions, it's hard to question the man's passion for wanting to win first and foremost. He doesn't try to cut corners. If the team has to let go of a Zeke, it's not to save money. If the team has to let go of a Zeke, there's some way the team has reallocated resources to try to improve in spite of that loss. I defended the Hawks lead owner for 7.5-ish years. I kept the faith. These last 6-ish months I've been made to realize that faith was not merited. (Not going to rehearse all that again... the "idiot or sly dog or both" thread speaks to it.) If I'm wrong, I'm wrong. Been wrong a lot. Could be wrong again. Maybe you guys are celebrating this time next year, and there will be egg on my face, having abandoned my fandom. I'll be happy for you, though. Not so much for the owner because at this point I regard any good fortune that happens his way to be complete dumb luck. From a June 2023 perspective, I simply believe there are better ways for me to invest what time I have left on this planet, and after all, I don't answer to any one else in that way but me and my God. So, if indeed you're raising a championship trophy in 2024 or anytime during the Ressler era, don't feel bad for me regardless--win-win. I will be investing my time into some things that are more productive, more rewarding.

hehehehe... the interviewer has no clue that he's stumbled onto the Blackhawks' GM... this is great...

Had never been all that much of a hockey fan. Still probably won't be. It's a unique sport in the fact that it's so much fun to watch in-person, but on TV, it's just never carried the same thrill for whatever reason. Had considered myself a Rangers fan as a kid, and enjoyed the Messier era as I got older, but honestly, it's been decades since I watched an entire hockey game. So, a couple of years back, I pitched a tent with the Blackhawks after they had so responsibly and reasonably responded to the whole Washington Redskins drama... had thought I might reassess whether I could get enthusiastic about the sport. Almost watched an entire game on a couple of occasions, but realized the Blackhawks were just at a down part of the cycle, and it wasn't going to work for me. Tonight, that may have changed. Spent the last hour or so watching his highlight reels, and damn... this kid is scoring the puck with in-between-his-own-legs shots (... see the :30 mark in the tweet video). Evidently, he's essentially the NHL's answer to Wemby, given all the plaudits he's already achieved at age 17. Interviews like he's 27, not 17. This could be fun. One door closes. Another door opens.

Okay. I'm out. I'm done. No more hamster wheels for me. Enjoyed being an Atlanta Hawks fan for the 50-ish years I did... or a lot of em, anyway... not so much the Isiah Rider period. Bye. And I'm not even kidding. This is a stupid way to spend any more of whatever precious minutes I have left on this planet in this life, for me at least. If anyone wants/needs to engage henceforth, try me at spook1320-generaluse@yahoo.com. Good luck to all in whatever personal or family or professional endeavors you pursue. It's been great being part of a community with you.

Yep. I could understand better when you had GSW and everybody else a few years back. But in the current state of the league, there's no such dominance, at the risk of stating the obvious. Imagine a Hawks team where Junior and where Jalen had a whole year under their belts, and where Bey had been with the team a whole year, and where Quin had been the head coach for a full season, having the benefit of installing everything he wanted to install... imagine that team playing the Celtics in the first round, not the one that took the Cs to 6 games as it was. Why wouldn't that team have, in fact, sent the Cs home? And, went on to be what MIA proved to be? There's so much ambiguity right now. No superteams. The opportunity is there.

Power outage has been resolved, but internet... and the ability to type instead of poke... has not, still. 10 days now. Sitting at a local Subway right now, @AHF, doing some combination of actual work and HS play. Can't really afford time-wise to re-dive in, but not b/c I don't wanna. Hopefully soon. It's just that there's a tangled mess here, from my perspective, ie, a combination of things that are and are not valid about my perspective, and I will have to tease out some things in order to try to get on the same page... not that we will... but "to try."

Pardon the observation, but by that definition, almost no primary owner of any sports franchise in existence can be found to be an idiot. That class exists? See, I think there's no single way, but I do think, how ever you get it done, it normally requires a person to be steeped in certain principles/virtues. Tony's changed my mind only recently that he brings the essential principles/virtues to the table.

Honestly. I didn't have that opinion of the man for 7.5 years. Regard for him was relatively high. This last half year has seriously challenged me to think we have an uber-reactionary owner who purposely embraces a convoluted organizational management structure, specifically so that he's able to be an "invisible hand"... able to impose himself into big decisions yet able to claim with some legitimacy that he lets his basketball people make the decisions. Is he an idiot? Depends on how you mean "idiot." He's an idiot, to me, now. He's unstable--prone to embrace one approach one year, and a different one the next. He's prone to saying publicly what he wants people to believe, not what actually is... so he's not trustworthy. And his history is that he seeks out relatively inexperienced people to lead the basketball ops machinery in the organization... which... again, is part of his convoluted organizational management convictions. Hiring inexperienced people is cheaper, but I don't think that's the big deal... rather, inexperienced people are easier to roll over, and easier to lay blame as disappointments occur. That makes him spineless. All of which, can be summed up as qualities of an idiot. Oh. And I didn't even mention not especially self-aware. Who installs his own inexperienced kid into the basketball ops offices, and doesn't get it that naturally people are going to recognize that as an overt mechanism for installing an information channel almost as good as hidden mics and cameras, piped in directly to the owner's desk? Who goes even farther and tells Jeff Schultz how much his kid is universally loved in those offices... as-if anyone would ever have the stupidity to say differently??? My jaw dropped on that one. That's some special self-confirmation bias going on there in the brain of our owner. Our owner. *sigh* He's not an idiot from his own perspective... he's rather simply sly. He's getting what control he wants without having to endure the scrutiny like a Hal Steinbrenner or a Jerry Jones. So, in that way, he's really, really clever.