thesheedera

Quote: Maybe BK is trying to get Belkin to fire him. Then the other owners can show "irreperable harm". Scott I don't doubt at this point he'd try to get Belkin to fire him. If Billy resigns, he stands to lose a lot of money owed to him in his contract. If he's fired, he not only looks like the victim of a egomaniac, he gets his much deserved money.

He's definitely overpaid, but I think he's physical enough that his height is not a problems for him. He uses his body pretty effectively. My question is, after the fiasco with the Cavs, can he be trusted?

I think vets are the next step too. Anyone heard anything about our interest/non-interest in Brevin Knight? I think we'd get him cheap. What big man vets are out there other than the Tractor?

Dolfan, other than Greg Oden, who are these "can't miss prospects"?

how does the team follow through on zaza if the owners are stuck in a court battle? will this get delayed as wwll?

My speculation on this whole ordeal is that Belkin knew the deal, and vocally pitched his case against it. No one agreed with him. He warned them he wouldn't sign off if they went through with it. They figured its 9+ (including mgmt.) against one, we'll show this guy not to mess with us. They allow the press to run with it, seems like a done deal, no way in the world Belkin tries to stop it once the public assumes its cool. I bet he made his threats, and they thought the threats were empty. Belkin believes strongly that its not a good deal and/or he doesn't like being pushed around. He might be right, it is definitely a huge risk. When it became clear that Belkin would try to hold it up and renegotiate, the only way to combat him was to try to remove him from his position. The only way Belkin could stop that is to sue the other guys and hold everything up. Desperation moves leading to a stalemate. Meanwhile the most important offseason in the history of the club continues without us. It AMAZES me that they couldn't work this out somehow. I really don't think Belkin is a moron who decided at the last minute to speak up. I think more likely he's an egomaniac (as are veryone else involved) that drew a line in the sand with his partners, and when the others went on without him, he followed up on his threats at the expense of the Hawks. This is in no way in defense of his despicable actions, but it seems more realistic to me than the idea that he's an idiot that's just now deciding to make a move against the trade. As soon as it went from RFA to a S&T, I imagine this whole thing blew up real fast.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2124766 national news??? very national

Ouch, so this is what the bottom of the barrel feels like? First of all, to everyone I criticized early on about making too big a deal out of this, I apologize. Either you knew more than I did, your instincts were spot on, or I was guilty of thinking we might be developing into a competent franchise. I thought 13 wins was the worst it could get. I was very mistaken. But part of me laughs at myself for not expecting this. With the Hawks, you're supposed to expect the worst, its just that this kind of thing is beyond my imagination. Diesel, I don't agree with you on some things, but you are absolutely correct, this easily makes the list of most embarassing moments, and I think there's a strong case for it being at the top. And its because of where the franchise is right now. Months and months of begging the fans to buy into the new plan and the fresh start. The fans showing some interest despite the worst season imaginable. The promise of solid young talent waiting to be nurtured. 13 freaking wins, and the kids still seem to be playing their hardest. I drank the kool aid, thought that new ownership was having growing pains, but they we're focused on the right path. Now it seems like they're a bunch of spoiled rich kids arguing over their expensive toys. BRATS. And right when it seems like they're taking their chances on a big play, not only is the deal in limbo at the 11th hour, but our owners are suing eachother over the dispute? The JJ deal pales in comparison to what's happening within the leadership of the team. You don't sue over a disagreement on the terms of a trade for a player that everyone wants. You might fight and argue, but it stays in house, and someone wins. Belkin said he wants JJ, just not at this price. He might be right, but it should never escalate to this level. The JJ deal just brought the real issue to a head, and now it bursting. The timing of this couldn't be worse. Had we had a successful season and this happen, it would be a hiccup, we'd purge the problem owner, and move on. But we're at the bottom of the barrel, and just trying to get some traction to move our way up, and this hits us in the stomach and puts us behind where we were, lower than what I thought was possible. I'm disgusted. I think the franchise will be better off if Belkin's tossed to the wayside, but this will have LONG lasting impressions. The Hawks DO NOT get the benefit of the doubt, and honestly don't deserve it. We don't have history on our side to make this look like no big deal. We already are the laughing stock of the league. Fans, players and other teams will most likely assume the very worst of whatever they hear about this, and I don't blame them. Quote: Dominique Wilkins, former Hawks star and current team vice president, did comment: "This is real damaging. This can't work if everybody is pulling in different directions." He's still the soul of the franchise to me, and the dude has got to be hurtin bad right now.

Hollinger's a stat man first and foremost. I'm not saying he's wrong, I just think sometimes stst guys get over obsessed with what the numbers tell him. I think the most important stats are: 70 - as in millions of dollars invested in a risky acquisition and 24 - as in years old. If JJ is as hard working as I've read he is, and he dedicates himself to improvement, then we might still be 5 years away from his prime, which could make this one of the greatest acquisitions of all time. I know that's an ridiculous exageration, but the point is that he has tons of room to grow, if he's dedicated to it. If he does, the past stats Hollinger obsesses over will be distant memories.

link?

So far this board is melting down because someone read posts at espn's message boards, and someone posted a phantom quote by Stein that hasn't been sourced yet? Am I getting this right? If not, PLEASE give me a concrete reason to freak out, and one better than A) the fact that no news is bad news or B) sentences/phrases taken out of stories printed in the middle of the night or this morning, and reading double and triple meanings into the information. Can we keep this thread dedicated to sourced information regarding what's really happening, as opposed to wild speculation and fanatacism? If I get some solid reason to lose my schitt over this, I'll happily do so, but not until then.

anything come of this?

Inside Man - where did this "quote" come from?

source? anywhere? what am I missing?

on tv, or online? any link if online?

Its embarrassing, but it doesn't get consideration for the most embarrassing event in Hawks history until the deal actually falls though. And then, it still has some serious competition. "Playoff bound" may never be topped.

why the need for the new thread?

His price tag might be too high for a lot of teams, but he's a servicable player, and if he's inclined to take the young guards under his wing, he's definitely worth keeping around.

Money can break up the best of relationships, it can easily dismantle a fragmented partnership. I'd be so much happier with a single ego with majority ownership and full control of the team. Even if the dude was crazy (Ted), at least we'd know someone was in charge.

Diesel, I think your concern is warranted, and your suggestion that this is a major problem is very very possible. I just don't think we know enough to assume that its correct. Belkin and Knight might be in the middle of a power struggle over the terms of the deal, the directiopn of the team, the amount of money and/or the loss of the picks. Or it could be ego. It could be terrible. But until more detail is reported, there's just a good a chance that Belkin has an issue with some formalities in the contracts that he wants to clear up before signing off. It might be some minor details that he's concerned with, and wants to address, and he's trying to slow down the process so its done right. The other owners might be frothing over making a big story happen, and are too giddy to slow down. All of this is completely hypothetical, but possible. This is the biggest deal of the new ownership's history, there's a lot riding on it (in many ways the future of the franchise and this ownership group) and there's a lot of risk involved. This is a PR problem, without a doubt, at the very least. But if the deal gets done, and this stall strengthens or secures the Hawks' position in the deal, then it will be worth the minor embarrassment of a day or two stall. If it comes out that there's a power struggle in the ownership or between ownership and Knight, and the deal goes through anyway, its not great for the future of the organization, but at least we get Joe, and hopefully they'll buy him out or settle their differences. If it comes out that there's a power struggle, and we don't land JJ, then this is a monumental disaster in the history of the franchise, and could begin several more years of serious frustration for us fans. I'm holding on to hope for best case scenario until we learn more, but naturally as a Hawks fan, I'm preparing for the worst, and sort of expecting the middle scenario.

Thanks.

dr z - link?

Quote: but if you do a little search on this board you'll see that the guy getting the blame was JT Well that's unfortunate, but not at all unepected from a message board.

Quote: JT was a headache and a constant thorn in Atlanta's side when he was here. I strongly disagree with this statement. He couldn't handle 100% of the load as a Hawk, but he certainly tried. JT played above and beyond what was expected of him. His late game mishaps had more to do with the team around him than the player himself. One of my favorite Hawks of all time, and without a doubt my favorite since Nique. He loved being a Hawk for a majority of his time here, and if he didn't, you'd never know it the way he carried himself and represented the team.

If you took those down to: JJ: 19 ppg 4 rpg Al: 16 ppg 7 rpg Chillz: 12 ppg 7 rpg Smoove: 10 ppg 7 rpg Pachulia: 10 ppg 6 rpg Salim: 8 ppg 2 rpg(only b/c of playing time) Marvin: 8 ppg 5 rpg Delk: 6 ppg 1 rpg (lesser role thanks to Salim) Collier: 4 ppg 2 rpg Ivey and Donta: 4 ppg 2 rpg Total: 97 ppg 43 rpg I think that would be a very lofty, but possibly achievable goal. 97 would put is around 16th in the league last year, which would be a great improvement from 3rd to last with 92.7 ppg. 43 would put us 8th in the league, up from 17th. Just based on those two stats alone, it would be some excellent improvement. Hope it would equal some wins, too.