GoDawgs21

LOL Bavetta officiating this game after all of the stuff that is flying around about him. Thats just funny. Any chance Stern wants a longer series ???? hahahahaha

I am sure most of you read the Sports Guy columns but today he linked back to his 2002 column on the state of NBA refs. I had no idea he was involved in everyone of those games. uh... Quote: Question: What was the most disturbing subplot of the playoffs? Answer: The officiating, also the most disturbing subplot of the past four playoffs. If you examine the last four NBA playoff campaigns, during every situation where the league definitively "needed" one of the two teams involved to win -- either to A) change the momentum of a series so it didn't end prematurely, B) keep an attractive, big-market team alive in a series, or C) advance an attractive, big-market team to another round -- the officiating appeared to be slanted towards the team that needed that game. I use the phrase "appeared to be," because reviewing an official's performance is purely subjective. Maybe I'm dead-wrong. These were just the games that jump out in my mind (again, I could be wrong): 1999, Knicks-Pacers, Game 3 ... LJ sinks a game-winning four-pointer (called a continuation foul by referee Jess Kersey even though LJ was fouled a full second before he released the ball). 1999, Knicks-Pacers, Game 6 ... Knicks last chance to close out Indy before the series shifts back to Indiana for Game 7 ... they get every call. 1999, Spurs-Knicks, Game 3 ... down 2-0, the Knicks get every call in their first home game and win their only game of the series. 2000, Knicks-Heat, Game 7 ... Knicks advance to the conference finals ... falling out of bounds, Latrell Sprewell awarded a timeout by referee Bennett Salvatore with 2.1 seconds left even though none of the Knicks called for one ... Sprewell admits after the game that he hadn't called a timeout ... the Miami players chase the referees off the court after the game, yelling that they had been robbed ... after the game, Jamal Mashburn tells reporters, "They had three officials in their pocket" and Tim Hardaway refers to referee d*ck Bavetta as "Knick Bavetta." 2000, Lakers-Blazers, Game 7 ... LA shoots 21 more free throws and rallies back from a 17-point deficit in the final seven minutes ... Shaq plays an illegal defense down the stretch, undaunted ... Rasheed Wallace absolutely gets manhandled down the stretch, yet doesn't get a single call ... up by four with 25 seconds left, Shaq body-blocks Steve Smith out of bounds and the refs don't make the call (the most egregious non-call in recent memory). 2002, Celtics-Nets, Game 4 ... Celts up 2-1 ... the Nets are inexplicably allowed to push and shove Kenny Anderson and Pierce while they dribble the ball ... a number of head-scratchers go against Boston, including three offensive charges down the stretch ... four different "bull-(bleep)" chants during the game. 2002, Lakers-Kings, Game 6 ... LA needs a win to stay alive ... from an officiating standpoint, the most one-sided game of the past decade ... at least six dubious calls against the Kings in the fourth quarter alone ... LA averaged 22 free throws a game during the first five games of the series, then attempted 27 freebies in the fourth quarter alone of Game 6 ... rumors that David Stern wanted to pull a Vince McMahon and declare himself "The special guest referee" for this game prove unfounded. (By the way, I would feel remiss if I didn't share this information: d*ck Bavetta was assigned to every one of the above games. That's an absolute fact. You can look it up. Doesn't mean anything ... I just felt the need to pass that along. It sure looks bad, doesn't it? Maybe the league could do a favor for Bavetta and not assign him to Game 3 of the Finals, especially if the Lakers jump to a 2-0 lead over New Jersey. You wouldn't want to rile up those conspiracy theorists or anything. Ummmm ...)

If Stern and STu Jackson don't suspend their poster boy from their poster team there will be some serious questions to answer.

Do we all need reading comprehension classes? My point of the thread was the lines are right, and so what are missing that is causing us to be the biggest mismatch of the night? My question was not questioning the line, but questioning all the optimism and if it was just or unjust and what will all the chicken littles do if we do lose by that margin.

Quote: What I am saying is why are being looked at so poorly? Everyone is hyping and getting excited for this game waiting to see our turn around. My point is before we get all excited and worked up, what if the experts are right? We come out and get trashed. What will this board be like tomorrow? I still am looking for a close game, but appreantly those outside of Hawks land and those that do this for a living think this is the biggest mismatch of the night. So my question remains what are we missing?? clearly you missed the entire point of my post, as usual. My point was the guys in Vegas are usually right on about games. I never said I was looking to or betting on the game. I said I went to see what others were viewing our new lineup as. My direct quote was EVERYONE IS EXCITED ABOUT THIS GAME, but ARE WE MISSING THE FACT THAT PEOPLE OUTSIDE OF HERE ARE STILL DOUBTING US. SO WHERE WILL ALL THIS OPTIMISM GO IF WE DO LOSE BY DOUBLE DIGITS.

Oh I can't ever bet on home town teams, to much heartache and frustration. My point I was trying to make was in my last post. Everyone on here is excited after the trade. People talking of taping the game, praying it's on NBA League Pass. So what if we come out and lay an egg? There are so many chicken littles on here that take each game as a mission statement. That was why I brought it up. All the Squawkers are so upbeat and ready for tonight, we come out and lose by dobule digits, what happens here tomorrow. Hence the title "Did we miss something?" I was just excited about tonights game, and wanted another perspective. More times then not the experts are right on the money, its rather creepy sometimes. So that was my question. What happens in Hawkland if we get smoked tongiht with everyone's expectations.

I get that I am not saying win or lose, its about covering the spreads. What I am saying is why are being looked at so poorly? If I walked up to you today and said which game would be closer in a final outcome: Charlotte vs San Antonio or Atlanta vs LA. Which one would this entire board have said??? Everyone is hyping and getting excited for this game waiting to see our turn around. My point is before we get all excited and worked up, what if the experts are right? We come out and get trashed. What will this board be like tomorrow? I still am looking for a close game, but appreantly those outside of Hawks land and those that do this for a living think this is the biggest mismatch of the night. So my question remains what are we missing??

I realize all that you stated. But add that with what I put up. I guess you may not bet that much, or look at lines. But do you realize how absurd 11 points are????? On most nights a normal spread is between 3-7 points depending on match ups. Most nights there isn't even a line over 10. We were still only 8 point dogs at Phoniex. My point was with all the hype regarding the trade etc, we were -2.5 point favorites at home vs the Lakers. Now after the trade we are +11?????? I know it's on the road. But with Kobe hurt and both teams rested. I was expecting 6 or 7. To give you some perspective of how absurd it is. Tonight there are 10 games in the NBA. ONLY 2 are over 10 point spreads. Char. @ SA, SA being -10.5. So your saying that we are likely to lose by more then the Bobcats who are awful, at the defending Champs?????????? Not saying we win. Just trying to understand were Vegas is coming from. We have all the hype form the trade etc. and we are supposed to take the worst beating of any team tonight. It could happen don't get me wrong, just trying to see what they saw that we missed. Just to get perspective on the other games (all lines are shown for home team) NYK @ Was -6.5 Hou@ Cle -1 Orl @ Det -6.5 Phi @ Min +3 Char @ SA -10.5 Bos @ Den (even) GS @ Utah -6.5 Sac @ Por -4.5 Mem @ Sea -5.5 Atl @ LAL -11 So there are two games even close to double figure spreads. One being the 3rd worst team in the NBA vs the NBA Champs, and our game. So my question still is, do we still look that bad to others??????

So the guys in Vegas are usually really good at being right around the final outcomes. Well "if gambling were legal" I went to hypothetically see what a point spread might be, and was stumped. I know the Lakers record is what it is, and we aren't a road team. The Hawks however have played very well against the West, including just beating said Lakers less then two weeks ago. Add Kobe's hurt finger in which he took 0 shots in the All-Star game. Not to mention how upbeat our team should be after gaining a point guard. In saying all this can someone point me to the kool-aid that made us an 11 point dog tonight????????? Just curious.

so the sky smacked us in the head? we are a .500 team in the 6th spot of the playoffs. I will bet you that if I told anyone that before the season started, they would have jumped all over it. If you don't see the mood swings in this board then you are crazy.

Are you not going to grind on the post below by Peoria about his hoping we win so people shut up? Basically the same concept I guess his wanting to hush people met your criteria for posting? Guess you are the one that decides what is right or wrong now? Peoria Post

First of all it was a joke, who are you to think everyone is attacking everyone. I was merely pointing out that we are in the same place we were a month ago when I posted that, and be prepared to see the range of mood swings on this board. We win three and everyone is talking about championship runs. Then we lose two and people want to trade Marvin and Al for Gasol (not singling out, just example) That was my point, you honestly think Chill would sticky this. Maybe one thing a year gets stickied. It was just reminding that this season will be back and forth because thats what team we are. But I love the irony in you claiming I am telling people what to do, thanks for the advice I will TRY TO DO WHAT YOU ARE TELLING ME

Can we get a sticky on this please Chillz? It's amazing how left and right people go with 3 wins, then 2 losses. Everyone calm down, we are still the same team.

Do you ever think before you type? I'm sorry the Eastern Conference Player of the Week, and a player that is as of now in the all-star game with the number of votes received isn't "living" up to his contract. Also, you say we can't hang with any good teams. Funny, if you look at the standings and take the top 8 in each conf. right now the Hawks are 7-8 vs playoff teams and 8-4 vs nonplayoff teams. Funny guess we can't "run" with the good teams?????? Playoff teams played: wins: Dallas, Phoenix, Philly, Orlando, Utah, Wash, Ind losses: Det, Bos, Sa, Wash, NO, Det, Tor, Det, Dal I'm sorry if we aren't a top 3 team, nobody says we are, but of our 8 losses to playoff teams 3 to Det, 1 to Bos, and 1 to SA are the 3 best teams in the NBA. Our nonplayoff: wins: char, mia, min, mil,min, mem, char, mia losses: nj,sea, mil, chi

Overreact a little??? Dallas came out fired up and hit their first 6 three pointers and also started out on a 12-0 run. Take that away the Hawks were only losing by 1 the rest of the game. It was a hot team at home. It happens. Dallas scored 34 pts in the first quarter and only 63 the remaining 3 quarters. I consider that a great job by the defense. We were just a touch cold shooting. I'm sorry you can't see the positive in this game. The last three years the Hawks would have quit and lost by 30, not draw it close to 6 and keep fighting. I hate losing, but I can handle this one ok.

I enjoyed that too. I loved looking back at Sothron, and my how he has grown in a year. That argument and the following drafting argument was priceless. After being completely shot down Soth did the mature thing and put me on block. oh crap

It's from last November. Here is the link, and I love Diesel's and my comments in the first two replies at the time. I guess JJ did turn into that guy: Post Link

From Dec '05. Not saying I called it, but reading all these post lately I just wonder how nobody else saw it. I know many others that did. We all knew it was going to be a slow process, but we had to be patient and see it through. Why would I think a board where anyone one bad quarter let alone a game has people talking trade and chicken little syndrom? Quote: I posted this earlier on the AJC blog and it got me thinking. I did want to respond to something you said in T. (I hate my life, so I take it out on others) Moore's blog. You say we have too many SF, but it is this depth that is allowing for all out effort on defense every minute. You ask what will happen when Marvin comes back? Lets do some simple math. There are 48 minutes at each F spot. It is safe to say Smoove plays alot at the PF. Chill also plays 3-4 minutes at the 2 when JJ goes out, and last night even played 3 at the PG for a long athletic lineup to give the starters a rest. Shelden will also slide over and play 3-4 minutes at the C spot when other teams go small to give ZaZa a breather. Thats 106 total minutes for four players Shelden, Chill, Marvin, SMith. Thats 27 minutes a player. UM, hello most starters average 30-35 minutes a game. So we have our top four players in the entire time. How many games last 2 years would our bench come in and we would be in the game down 1 or 2 and then get blown out by I 15-4 run with our bench in. Now imagine other teams bench going against a fresh, Chill, Marvin, Smith, or Sheldon. Can you say match up problems. Thats 27 minutes that each play can be going all out on defense and offense where some players tank a few positions to rest up. Its this depth that allows us to run, play d, and then not worry if one guy gets in foul trouble (how many times last year if Smith or Al got in trouble did we hear Smitty say who's going ot help Joe score now), or god forbid someone get hurt. Its all about depth, we trade one of these guys and then one gets hurt ala Marvin, Matt Frieje is a starter. Think about that. Teams like Miami and Detriot are succesfull because of depth. Nobody whined about Detriot having Wallace,Wallace,Tashyun, Antonio McDyess. Gee, thats 4 forwards. How did that depth turn out for them??? Miami went out and got Haslam, Wright, Walker, Siemen, Kapono. It seems that everyone points out the Hawks glut at the F spot, but nobody points out that strategy has won several rings in the past 5 years.

In all fairness, the other coach can prevent this. Did you happen to miss the fact that the Heat went to a zone in that quarter as soon as they got in the bonus. It's hard enough to drive on a zone let alone one with Shaq in the middle?? Sometimes I really question the basketball IQ of this board. If we drove and got trapped it would have been Woody's fault for not putting in shooters. Instead he went small and was trying to get the advantage, and he still gets blasted? Sometimes you can't win around here.

I wonder how many Marvin threads D will start tomorrow after a 26,9,3,3 game, and having to guard Wade most of the game. I guess he really is just a role player? All those aggressive drives, and not getting calls he could have had a huge night.

and the foul on Marvin when he just blew on Wade on that fade away. Never even touched him. Yet Shaq and Haslem tackle Marvin, AJ gets hacked, and Joe gets shoved by Shaq in mid-air and nada. I would love to be in the official review room following this game where they have to look at every call and get graded.

Anyone think Big D's head exploded when the halftime break down by Niq was about how Marvin has been playing so well, and vital to the Hawks success? I am imagining a Hiroshima explosion.

My two cents is asking Jay never really mattered. Ron's two big shining examples to prove himself were that media people called him and Jay could say he had a source. 1) My example before was if I say someone is shooting the president and the secert service calls me does that mean I really know anything? No it just means they read what you wrote and are curious proves nothing. 2) Ron has always claimed Jay can verify his source. Thats fine I have never doubted that Ron may know somebody, but that proves nothing. Jay can say he introduced him to someone, but Jay could never verify that Ron isn't making this stuff up. If a mutual friend introduces me to Arthur Blank, and then I go on a Falcons board saying I know an insider well thats true. But then if I post my opinions and what I think will happen, but use the clause well I know somebody what does that prove? Then I can just have you ask my friend that introduced us to confirm I know him, but it doesn't prove I actually get inside info. I know two things: 1) Jay never posted stuff that would hurt the make up of the team, and never admitted to posting false information to make a source happy(which makes nosense, because it makes that source look unrealible and hard to believe in the future). That and EVERYTHING JAY POSTED ACTUALLY HAPPENED. 2) Not a single thing Ron has posted has come true, he is 0-7. So how did a source that gave Jay 100% correct information all of sudden get so bad? Probably because the rely of that message is creating his own fantasy land.

ok, TP that was the point of my post. I'm not ecstatic over this start and have been frustrated. But step back and tell me where you thought we would be to end the season. A right or about .500 team in the 7-9 spots in the conference? Guess what thats exactly what we are. If you thought we would win 42 games then what did you expect coming into the season. A .500 team will win one, loss one, get blown out in one, win a close one. .500 teams aren't exciting and are very frustrating by their nature. As Dennis Green said they are what we thought they were. The are a frustrating .500 team point blank, but that's what we thought they were. I didn't see anyone saying we would win 46-50 games, so nobody should be expecting for 4 and 5 game win streaks so step back and look at it for what it is. be honest after seeing the schedule with sa, dal, phx, nj, det twice, and the other road games did you expect anything but a 8-10 or 9-9 start?? Yes we lost some we shouldn't like Chi and Sea, but we won some we shouldn't have Dal and Phx. So once again we are an up and down team. AKA a .500 team. We aren't the 13 win team of a few years ago, and we aren't the Mavericks yet. But for all the frustration we are playing about even, and are playing awful some nights. but with Acie back and if JJ gets back on track can it not get better? with woody i dont know. but the team record wise is about where i thought they would be, and thats with playing bad. Just imagine if JJ gets back on track and if Acie steps up dare I say we get a little better then a .500 or so team.

in regards to the shots, how many of Marvin's came from the line 10? How many came on the fast break when he leaked out while JJ was rebounding? ( note you are worried about Brewer getting all the rebounds, how many times was Marvin his man running back trying to cherry pick, that one pass from Smooth was the perfect example he was trying to leak out all game, some of the time is ok but not every play when you man is crashing and getting 18 rebounds.) how many shots does Marvin get that is wide open because JJ is being doubled? So now JJ is supposed to shoot perfect when teams scouts have said our only defense is designed to stop JJ, no open looks and trying to get others involved. Do you want him to leap tall buildings in a single bound? stop bullets? run faster then a speeding train? jesus the man can only do so much, sorry he has to lead our team in assist, try and lead us in scoring while having all 5 defenders key on him, and playing 45 minutes a game. I'm not riding his nuts like some, but you go overboard in riping him, when all he has done is give his all for 3 years .