Packfill

19 hours ago, Sothron said:

I've mentioned the interest Atlanta has in Jones/Murphy weeks ago. Interest is real. I can see Jones and two firsts for DJ. 

I think fans are starting to finally see the reality of the new CBA settling in. The NBA has made it practically impossible to have a Big 3 any more because you literally can't pay everyone. So now the stars will get more spread out or stay at home which is frankly what the NBA vastly prefers. 

Can the Pelicans afford Murray given they already have Zion. Ingram and CJ on big money deals (particularly since they would still need a center since Valancius is a free agent this off-season)?  Seems like they would need to do something much more radical to fit Murray from a salary perspective.

23 hours ago, GameTime said:

Thoughts?

I don't see why San Antonio would want to do a deal like this.  Russell does not move the needle for them.  They need to hold on for a real star to pair with Wemby.  They have time.

12 hours ago, AHF said:

Sure wish he was playing.  His health is one of the defining failures of this season.  We miss him and are far too thin to go without him this long.

Hunter's "health" is a defining part of his Hawks tenure.  He can always be counted on to miss at least 15 games unfortunately.  Last year's 67 games played will unfortunately remain his career high since he has already missed too many games this year to reach that level again.

Hawks seem to be showcasing Murray. 

5 minutes ago, Final_quest said:

Depends on the quality of those picks, and the underrated risk in a deal like this is with Grimes having us by the balls when it comes time to negotiate his contract. 

Trying to get in the head of an NBA GM, Murray is the best available piece on the market in a market where multiple teams are trying to get to the next level.  How are offers like Dlo and a first the best out there?  He's signed long term to a really reasonable deal.  Why isn't he valuable?

If the Hawks are not getting better offers than that is a reflection of his value - and unfortunately if this is the state of play no other teams value him like the Hawks did a year ago.  

His matador defense is not helping matters to be sure.

12 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

It's hard for NY to beat us. Randle isn't wanted around the league. Murray is. OO is more coveted than any Knick outside of OG and Brunson.

Atlanta is willing to move real players that teams who win want. 

If Minny is unloading KAT because his $49m salary puts them over the second apron, would they want a package that includes guys like Murray ($25m) and OO ($14m) since that would not result in much of a cap savings?  I guess they would not need to bring back Conley so is that where the savings comes from? 

If the Hawks don't get rid of other salaries would adding KAT but the Hawks into the tax too?  

What is Orlando's rationale for starting someone like Caleb Houstan?  They have better options.  

I don't think the Hawks see Bufkin as a starter long term - more of a combo guard off the bench.  

Personally I have more hope of AJ emerging as a starting caliber 2 guard than Kobe.  

I have to imagine the two 2024 draft picks Indy is giving up are "discounted" given that the draft is not considered to be very good.

7 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

They needed to do more than what they did.

Murray, in the grand scheme of things, isn't the biggest issue on this team.  It's our frontcourt.  And I will continue to say that.

If we can't toss a lob to Clint, he's not scoring unless he's getting an offensive rebound.  And even then, he's rebounding his OWN miss, to get that rebound.

Quin refused to go ahead and start OO instead of Capela, which has possibly limited OO's development.

Quin also didn't even have the foresight to start JJ in the lineup, until it became obvious that JJ was head and shoulders a better player than Bey.

And speaking of Bey, if he can't make open shots, his value plummets tremendously, despite the 2 or 3 hustle plays he makes in a game.

Our only above average frontcourt piece right now, is JJ.

I think if there is one thing Quinn got right it was giving playing time to JJ.  Nate did not give JJ any playing time, but as soon as Quinn arrived JJ entered the rotation and those minutes he got last season have benefitted him now. 

That said, it is hard to understand why the player development is so uneven - OO and AJ have both seemingly regressed and none of this years draft picks are ready to play.  

My expectations for any 2024 draft picks (not even taking into account the fact that this is supposed to be a weak draft) making an impact next season are very, very low.

2 minutes ago, AHF said:

Are we really trying to compare these guys? 

One is 26.  One is 37.

Look at the production per minute, look at the shooting:

Look at the metrics:

Both guys may be low dollar players but let's not at all pretend like these guys are equivalent.  The comparison goes the same way for Garrison except he is younger.

Derrick Jones Jr. isn't just better this season he is worlds better.  We would absolutely be better served if we had him on our roster in place of either of them.

Our problem isn't their low salary.  It is their uselessness on the floor.

Obviously the production is different.  My point was that the Hawks could do a lot better filling out their roster.  

I doubt Dallas was expecting Derrick Jones Jr. or Dante Exum to play big roles when the season started.  

14 minutes ago, Diesel said:

Here's my logic...

 

Trae, DJ, Hunter, JJ, and Vuc...  can win. 

 

That is at best a lateral move in my opinion.  Vuc is in steady decline and his 3-point shooting has not been league average for a couple years now.  Pass.

1 hour ago, Diesel said:

Yeah.. and Kyrie is average 25.2ppg 5.1 apg... shooting 42% from three.   And Derrick Lively III, their rookie is average 7.6 rpg and blocking 1.4 spg.   When you surround good players with Good players, you get good outcomes.  I don't see where Dallas is playing Mathews or anybody of that Ilk. 

 

 

Dallas is starting Derrick Jones Jr. a journeyman and, when he was healthy, giving rotational minutes to Dante Exum, who washed out of the NBA for a couple of years.  Both are basically minimum salary guys like the Matthews.  

24 minutes ago, Jody23 said:

The Pacers' size and length is a problem for the Hawks.

No.  Pacers have only one guy with size. They are smaller than the Hawks. 

5 minutes ago, theheroatl said:

Knicks have worthless players

 

I don’t want to see their trash anywhere near this team

DJM also seems like a bad fit for the Knicks.  

17 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

I'll just put it simply.  I think Trae is good enough to lead a team to a championship with the right go to big.  

Giannis had Middleton 

Jokic had Murray

Tatum and Brown

Suns were interesting.  CP, Booker, Bridges were a good combo with a lot of great role players.  

Trae needs someone like KAT honestly.   Hell he'd probably do pretty good with Randle.  Get us an all star PF and we're cooking with the right other pieces.  

Knicks are 5-0 post OJ trade.  They are going to add pieces not take away.

4 minutes ago, hylndr11 said:

Randle been pretty good this year.  Doubt they are offering that.  

Plus the Knicks have such a dearth of big men then can't possibly trade one without getting another back in return.

2 hours ago, AHF said:

There is no way that playoff Jamal Murray would resemble what we've seen if defenses weren't built to slow down Jokic with him as a secondary priority.  Jokic makes life a lot easier for him.  Doubly so if you start comparing the gravity and focus defenses have had on our frontcourt players the last few playoff appearances for us.

Murray will never see anything like the double and triple teams that were constantly thrown at Trae by Miami for as long as he is playing with Jokic.

Agree 100%.  We either need a guy who can step-up like playoff Jamal Murray (and play at a super high and efficient level in the space created by Trae's gravity) or we need someone with enough gravity of their own to stop the focus on Trae.

Getting a championship is hard.  

Denver won last year because playoff Jamal Murray gives Denver two superstar scoring options in the playoffs (he has been exceptional in the two deep playoff runs this iteration of the Nuggets have had). 

Regular season Trae is way better than regular season Jamal Murray (and more durable to boot) but we can only hope playoff Trae plays at a level that Jamal Murray has in the playoffs.  No doubt the chances of that would be improved by having another scoring option on the team that would prevent defenses from keying exclusively on him. 

So yes, the Hawks still need a Jokic - or at least someone who can be their playoff Jamal Murray.  No easy task.

8 minutes ago, ShooterSays said:

Here's the framework I keep thinking about IF we felt confident about resigning Claxton. JJ/Lauri/Claxton would be a great frontcourt.

I like that trade for the Hawks but don't see the motivation to do anything like that for the other two teams.  Net's lock up a roster with no true number 1 scorer and the Jazz trade away their only good player a package that does not present a clear near term opportunity to acquire a star (unless bottoming out for the 2025 draft is the point, and maybe it is).

Minny is in first place.  I can't see them making a move to save money in-season.  Maybe in the off-season, but not now.  

12 minutes ago, Sothron said:

We are hoping Hunter's knee will hold up for a trade when he is checked out again.

DJM believes he will be traded either before the deadline or this summer.

Capela has said the same.

Knicks are trying hard to swing a deal for DJM. 

I don't understand why the Knicks would want Dejounte.  Even with OJ they need another big wing, not a smallish two guard.

4 hours ago, Diesel said:

 

Is going to have to be for a starter. 

I don't know if Quin will play a player like Gallo or Delon.  Quin's hand has to be forced it seems.  Otherwise, he'll keep playing Garrison and Wes and Patty.

We got guys who shouldn't be in the league... playing as rotational players.

PJ Tucker can't even get minutes in LAC... and we're playing Wes?

 

At this point, it is it more likely they trade for help now or sell assets to get better in the future?  I am not sure anymore.

10 hours ago, Sothron said:

Murray, Capela, Hunter, AJ...I can keep going. There's definitely good matches between both teams if they wanted to go that way.

If the Pels move Zion they need a power forward to replace him.  Much like the Hawks, perhaps moreso, they have a dearth of big men.

1 hour ago, bird_dirt said:

Everyone’s favorite NBA YouTuber laid out a couple of Lakers and Knicks trades. 
Knicks:

Not terrible, but would need another big if Bruno not playing. Maybe follow up with moving Dre for a big?

Lakers (if willing to move Reaves):

Roundabout way of something I proposed earlier of centering a DJM/OGA swap. 
 

Lakers (if they won’t move Reaves):

I don't see why the Lakers or Knicks do those first two trades.  Last trade makes sense for the Lakers but obviously is trash for the Hawks.