What did Dominique say on TNT last night?

[ATLien_]

The funny thing is Trace is that Gannon was the MVP, but when he didn't have ten years to throw the ball he looked 10 times worst than Vick against the bucks.

What people don't understand is that Vick faces that kind of pressure every game because offensive line sucks. It doesn't even have to be the Bucs for him to see pressure like that, but then they talk about him not being a QB. What would make him a QB? If he would just stand there and let his head get knocked off like chandler did behind that Line?

Vick doesn't run because he wants to; he runs because he has to. I do not fault him and say he is not a QB because of this. With a better supporting cast I am sure you will see him not running much at all. He has said that he wants to be a passer so many time that he sound like a broken record. The guy is just flat out good and he wins games. Call him what you want. He wins games. I wish the hawks had a player like that.

[Playmaker0017]

Traceman,

But didn't Joe Montana throw to that Hall Of Fame receiver too? So, I guess that means that he isn't really that good.

Who knows what he would have done with the Raiders. Personally, better receivers means that he is going to throw downfield MORE often. As the season progressed he threw downfield more often and got picked more often. The same would happen here. But, one cannot tell. You can't say that the Raiders would average 40PPG with Vick. That is nonsense.

As for the season the Falcons had... the defense was top five in the league. You don't think that might have equated to a couple wins.

As for being qualified for the Hall of Fame now, your true bias shows in a statement like that. You are a media-mule. When it comes to football, I probably have a bit more acumen than most people you know. Vick is a great player, but NOT a great QB.

As for Vick revolutionizing the QB spot... he has a WHILE to go before he can fondle Cunningham's jockstrap. Cunningham did what Vick did with a talentless Eagles team with a SOLID defense. His line was worse than the Falcons, if that can be imagined.

The QB measure will never include a running stat. And even if you wanted to tack his running yards in there, he STILL is not a great QB.

Quit being such a homer and look at the facts. Not opinions or hopes. Don't look at the "maybes" and "what ifs" because they are undebatable.

Based on his performance, he was not a great QB using QB measures. He was a great player.

Is a running back a better running back if he averages 3.5 yards a carry and 50 yards a game but threw the flea flicker 7 times a game with good results... or the is the running back a better running back who averages 4.5 yards a carry and 96 yards a game.

The better running back is the 4.5 yards a carry guy. The other guy is a better all round player, but the better running back is the guy that runs the ball better.

You have a bias and are arguing to it. Admit the facts, he is not the be all, end all. I want to see 3 years of consistency before he is GREAT. I want to see 58% passing and a QB rating of around 86.3.

Play.

[Playmaker0017]

ATLien,

Every QB in the league, except Vick, is a proven thrower. They wouldn't have gotten to the level they have gotten to without the ability to connect when they have time.

What makes Gannon great is his touch. He leads receivers perfectly. Of course, Gannon IS the product of his line. I don't deny that.

But, Gannon also throws further down field than Vick. Far more often too. Sure he has better receivers, but they are old. He throws way down field with precision. That makes a great QB.

Chandler was a great QB. He was ruined by this O-line.

But, Vick's game and presence brings the threat of a run. If he didn't have the ability to do that, he would be average. Even with a decent line. The guy did not throw much in college. He hasn't thrown much in the pros.

I admit, he does AMAZING things. He is a really good player. He is determined. I think he will eventually be great (if he remains intact for his career, which I find unlikely).

But, based on the performance he gave last year, he was not entitled to the media hype.

He gets it for two words: FAN PARTICIPATION.

All sports are in a decline. There are no true heroes anymore. No one cares about TMac or Kobe or Shaq or Owens or Sapp or McNabb. The true players, who treat fans with loyalty and respect and are about the game and the advancement of it are dead. Montana, Magic, Bird, Aaron, Elway, Sanders, Ryan, etc are gone. When Jordan finally retires it will be a SAD day, because all the nobility in sports will leave with him.

That is why the NBA is hyping LeBron before he has scored a single NBA point. That is why the NFL is clinging to Vick. They need heroes. And, while I can't say anything about LeBron ... Vick, from what I have seen and heard, is a good guy. And that is really something in this day and age of "me, me, me". I want Vick to shine, trust me I do. I want to look at a guy and think that is what I want my kids to see.

That is why I like Reef so much, and want him to do so well. Same with Terry. They are both good guys.

It will be a sad day when Jordan retires, indeed.

Play.

[ATLien_]

If you think the falcons have a top 5 defense you may need to commit yourself soon. The best defensive player on the team is Kerney and he is no superstar. Brooking is pure garbage. The falcons defense was 16th or 17th at best. And likely 24th agains't the run because of the Georgia Tech Grad has no balls. THe only reason the D was that good was because Wade has an excellent system.

The defense definitley had something to do with the wins as did the water boy, its a team sport. However in previous years the defense would just lay down and take it in the rear from the Ram's, Niner's etc... Now that they have Vick they believe they can win and they play hard all the time, because they never know what can happen when Vick is on the field. I have heard several defensive players say this. So I am not making it up. When Manning can do that then I will call him a better QB. I mean the Kicker is dogging him out LOL.