Friday Insider

[Guest]

Ebi OK, Villanueva bombs, Badiane opens eyes

By Chad Ford

NBA Insider

Send an Email to Chad Ford Friday, June 6

Updated: June 6

11:17 AM ET

CHICAGO -- After one day of intense on-court scrutiny of 69 prospects at the Chicago pre-draft camp Wednesday, NBA scouts and GMs turned their attention to more pressing matters on Thursday -- finding the next diamond in the rough.

Thursday's Buzz

Of course, private workouts were only the sideshow to the main event in Chicago. There was plenty going on inside the NBA's pre-draft camp Thursday, where Luke Walton and Troy Bell continued to impress scouts.

Thursday's Buzz

For the most part, the college players here are what they are. With a few exceptions, most of them are college seniors who have been scouted a dozen times. As good as the competition is, there doesn't appear to be a player here who can crack the top 20 in this year's NBA Draft. So the majority of scouts eventually get restless, and their eyes start to wander.

When a few hot high school or international prospects let it leak that they'll be working out at an undisclosed time and location (which, of course, will quickly become the worst-kept secret in Chicago) it's the equivalent of a fire drill.

The mass exodus is staggering.

"We've got a herd mentality in the NBA," one assistant GM told Insider. "If we see something hot or new, we stampede."

Thursday's stampede headed in the direction of three intriguing prospects: High school stars Ndudi Ebi and Charlie Villanueva, and international prospect Malik Badiane. Today, the same herd will be courtside to watch 7-foot-4, 300 pound Russian giant Pavel Podkolzine.

For months the debate has raged over which side of the Atlantic is producing better young prospects. If Thursday was any indication, the international guys have opened up a can of whoop-ass on the Americans.

Here's a look at how the day went down.

1 p.m., Hoops Gym

Ndudi Ebi

Every year one major workout takes place at Hoops, and this year roughly 200 NBA scouts and GMs have crammed into the gym for a good look at Ebi and Villanueva.

Ebi, a skinny, 6-foot-9 forward, went first. It really isn't the best stage for his skills. Ebi was ranked as one of the top three players in the country based on his great defense, shot-blocking (the best in the nation), hustle and ability to score inside and out. Thursday's affair was basically a series of shooting drills, low post exercises and a few examples of running the floor.

Things didn't go all that well for the youngster from Texas. Ebi wasn't shooting the ball particularly well. His shot form looks OK, but nothing was going in on a consistent basis. He had a few nice runs, but it wasn't anything to write home about. Ebi is often compared to Jonathan Bender, because of his slight frame and ability to multi-task on the floor. But it's pretty clear Ebi doesn't have the type of dead-eye range Bender showed as a prospect.

Ebi's best attribute in workouts is his length. His arms are long, and he's able to move quickly to get to the basket. He's pretty impressive taking the ball outside the 3-point line, taking one dribble and driving to the basket. Several scouts that know him well say Ebi is a hard worker, plays with a lot of desire and is constantly working on his game to make it better.

The downside is that he's still very, very raw offensively, needs to add a lot of strength to his frame and he needs to find a position. None of those knocks will stop someone from drafting him ... possibly as high as the middle of the first round.

"If he stayed in college another two years," one scout told Insider, "he'd be a high lottery pick. I wish he'd go back to school, because I think he's so raw, he's better of getting playing time. He'll get stronger quicker if he goes straight to the NBA, but he won't really be able to develop his game instincts. With that said, if I was sitting in the late teens and early 20s and had a couple years to develop him, I'd take him in a heartbeat. He has the desire to get better and will keep working on his game until he earns playing time."

Villanueva's workout, on the other hand, was a disaster. The minute Ebi ended his workout and Villanueva stepped on the floor, roughly half the NBA people in the gym got up and walked out.

Charlie Villanueva was less than impressive on Thursday.

If that isn't a message to Villanueva to go back to school, I don't know what is.

Ironically, Villanueva actually looked much more polished than Ebi. He shot the ball well, showed nice athleticism on several drills, and, at 6-foot-11, he has some skills that are intriguing.

But two related things poisoned the well. Villanueva worked at less than half speed. I'm not sure he even broke a sweat. His play, on a few occasions, bordered on lackadaisical. Midway through the workout, there were less than 50 people left in the gym.

What's the problem?

"Bad attitude," one NBA GM said.

"Terrible attitude," another NBA coach said.

An international scout was furious that he even wasted his time. "Why come to a job interview and goof around?" he said. "I don't understand it. Neither of these kids put on a real workout today. If you want to see someone really work for their bread, come with me ..."

With that, and with Villanueva's workout still not officially over, we were out the door and on the way to see Senegal's Malick Badiane.

2:30 p.m., University Illinois Chicago

A few wrong turns get us to the gym after Badiane's workout has begun.

The difference in the atmosphere is palpable the minute we enter the room. Badiane is grunting and growling. His trainer, Eric Lichter, is putting him through a strenuous drill. Badiane is going full speed.

He's pounding the ball with every dribble. He's clawing, scratching out every drill. He takes the ball at the top of the key, takes one dribble and throws down a huge dunk. He does it again. And again. And again.

For the first time all day, I can smell the sweat in the gym.

Badiane is an impressive physical specimen. He's a 19-year old, 6-foot-11, 234-pound power forward with a 7-foot-4½ wing span and a 32½-inch vertical jump. His body is already ripped, and his frame suggests he could easily bulk up to 250 without losing any speed or agility.

At one point Lichter takes a huge cord that looks like a giant rubber band, ties one end around his waist and the other around Badiane's waist. He then tells Badiane to attack the basket and dunk the ball. As Badiane fights to get there, Lichter is pulling the band in the opposite direction.

Badiane is grunting with each fierce dunk.

"Again!" Lichter shouts as he yanks the cord. Badiane jumps, Lichter pulls. Badiane stretches toward the rim, Lichter keeps pulling.

About 40 NBA scouts and GMs are in the gym. None of them are talking to each other. They're all staring, jaws agape.

"I told you," the international scout said. "That is an NBA workout. He just earned himself a lot of bread."

If Badiane had been on the court with Ebi and Villanueva, he would have killed them both.

"Right now, the international players are hungrier," another scout continues. "They really want it. Over in Europe (Badiane plays for a team in Germany), the conditions still aren't always great. You never know when or if you're getting paid. The facilities aren't that great, and the money isn't very good. You don't play to have seven Bentleys in your garage. You play because it's your passion."

“ Where are you going to find that combination of power and athleticism?" the scout said. "I hate comparisons, but how different is he from Amare Stoudemire in terms of strength and desire? I don't think there's that big a gap. ”

— NBA scout on Malick Badiane of Senegal

Two NBA scouts in the gym have followed Badiane for years. One claims he should be a top 15 pick in the draft. The other won't go that far but does insist he's a lock for the first round.

"Where are you going to find that combination of power and athleticism?" the scout said. "I hate comparisons, but how different is he from Amare Stoudemire in terms of strength and desire? I don't think there's that big a gap."

Another assistant GM walks up to me, smiles and sums up the last 45 minutes. "It looks like you've stumbled onto another goldmine."

Here's the book on Badiane according to several experts in African scouting who know him intimately. He's one of the strongest, most athletic big men in the draft. He is an above-average defender, strong rebounder and a great shot blocker. He runs the floor like a guard and is an explosive leaper. He has a soft shooting touch and his range extends out to 15 feet. Of all of the young, African prospects to come to the NBA in the last 20 years, both scouts claim Badiane has the most offensive potential of any since Hakeem Olajuwon.

Lichter has another comparison that seems to fit. "He reminds me a lot of Nene," said Lichter, who trained Nene Hilaro last summer. "They're both as strong as an ox. Nene is a more talented physical prospect, but Malick is much more skilled around the basket than Nene was when he came over. Badiane is very swift, which is kind of amazing considering how powerful his legs really are. He's got awesome power from his base."

Lichter has helped Badiane improve on his raw ability. He has him working in a sand pit in Cleveland, mimicking NBA moves in sand to increase his strength and explosiveness. In five weeks, Badiane has gained 17 pounds -- all of it muscle.

After the workout, Nuggets GM Kiki Vandeweghe shows Badiane a few moves in the block. He's shaking his head and smiling widely as he walks away.

Badiane is just happy to be here. "I just wanted to work hard and show the NBA what they would be getting if they drafted me," he told Insider. "I've been working very hard and I'll keep working hard if they choose to draft me."

Badiane has plenty of experience against top competition. He played well at the Global Games in Dallas last summer (and held his own against Darko Milicic), and he impressed people at the ABCD camp for high schoolers.

When asked who is favorite NBA player is, he smiles and says Ben Wallace. "I love to play defense like he does. I just want to be strong, grab every rebound and block every shot."

He only has one caveat on that comparison. "But I will score the ball too."

Most scouts have assumed Badiane will be taken by the Mavs at No. 29. But based on what we saw on Thursday, Badiane probably won't be on the board that long.

5 p.m., Gold Coast MultiPlex

Pavel Podkolzine, the 7-foot-4 Siberian kid who was virtually unknown six months ago is finally in the U.S. What does he think?

Podkolzine

"I love America!" he says with a huge smile. He then picks me up off the floor to give me a hug. "America is the best. I don't want to leave!"

He's been here all of two hours.

Pavel got off the seven-hour flight from Milan, took a cab to his hotel, unpacked and called his agent, Justin Zanick, 30 minutes later. "I'm ready to go to the gym. I'm sick of waiting around."

Another 30 minutes later and Pavel is at the MultiPlex, dribbling a basketball in front of a number of stunned onlookers. You really have to see him to believe him. CBA head coach Billy Bayno is at the gym, ready to give Pavel a prep course for his workout Friday.

Pavel picks up the ball and starts running the floor, dribbling between his legs, behind his back and doing a little cross-over move. He then picks it up and starts firing away. His first 12 shots hit nothing but net.

Over the next 30 minutes, Bayno puts Pavel through what essentially is a guard's workout -- perimeter shooting, ball handling, pick and pops. What is he doing?

"I was just trying to get a handle for what the big fella could do," he said. "His skills are pretty amazing, I kind of got carried away."

If you're an NBA team, you don't have much to fear. Pavel won't be chucking up NBA 3-pointers at today's workout. He'll spend his time on the block, displaying his increasingly impressive array of post moves and showing teams how well he runs the floor.

Bayno, for one, is impressed. "He's for real, big time. This workout could last for 15 minutes and I think they'll see everything they need to see."

The plan is to go for 40 minutes. To get ready, Pavel works for an hour at a pretty furious pace. The level of intensity for what was supposed to be a run-through dwarfs what Ebi and Villanueva did in the morning. Not bad for a guy two hours removed from a seven-hour flight.

Pavel seems to be enjoying himself. I ask him if he's nervous for tomorrow's workout, and he just shrugs his shoulders and smiles. "People stare at me wherever I go, what's the difference? I just will try to do my best."

At 7-foot-4, 300 pounds, his best won't have to be too much to get him in the lottery. If he works out today the same way he worked Thursday night, it will be a shock if he doesn't land in the top 13.

Walton, Bell continue to impress

By Chad Ford

NBA Insider

Send an Email to Chad Ford Friday, June 6

Updated: June 6

2:13 PM ET

Of course, private workouts were only the sideshow to the main event in Chicago. There was plenty going on inside the NBA's pre-draft camp Thursday:

Luke Walton continues to quietly impress NBA scouts.

Arizona's Luke Walton continues to be the darling of the camp. He took only four shots Thursday and made just one of them, but his seven assists and six rebounds were impressive. He got big praise from Big East point guard and camp teammate Troy Bell. "It's really fun playing out there with Luke," Bell told Insider. "He really makes things easier on everybody. I really think he'll make it in the league. He just really knows how to play."

Point guards Bell, Maurice Williams and Carl English all continue to play well. But all of them had trouble finding assists on Thursday. Bell fell off the wagon a little bit when he scored 20 points but only netted one assist. After the game Bell told Insider he was trying to pass the ball. "You only get an assist, if the guy who you throw it to knocks down the shot. I was passing the ball." That is true, and a number of scouts felt his performance wouldn't hurt him. His 3-for-5 shooting from beyond the arc certainly didn't hurt, either.

Alabama's Williams had 16 points, but the zero assists came as a shocker. The zero turnovers helped balance things out a bit, but still, you'd like to see a point guard find his teammates once in a while.

Hawaii's English also shot the ball well and ended with 12 points and two assists.

Washington State's Marcus Moore played better on Thursday. His 13 points, five assists and four steals were a big improvement over Wednesday's numbers. However, Moore's 40 percent shooting from the field and four turnovers didn't exactly have scouts gushing.

High school big man James Lang continues to surprise people with his strong play in the post. Lang had 14 points and six rebounds in 16 minutes Thursday.

"He really plays like he belongs out there," one GM told Insider. "You forget (when) you're watching him that he's a high school kid. The comparison to Oliver Miller is pretty surreal. He's got great skills, but the weight thing is going to really hurt him. If he goes back to college, he'll be a big-time player there."

Auburn's Marquis Daniels did a great job attacking the basket. His 16-point, 4-assist performance was only marred by four turnovers.

“ He's got a big-time body, nice athleticism and he's a good rebounder. Someone will take a chance on him. ”

— NBA scout, on Brandon Hunter

Ohio's Brandon Hunter rebounded from a slow start to drop in 16 points and grab five rebounds in 16 minutes. Hunter was a beast in the paint and was sent to the line six times in 16 minutes. He shot 8-for-11 from the free throw line and drew some praise from one NBA scout.

"He measured a little taller (6-foot-8) than we expected," one scout said. "He's got a big-time body, nice athleticism and he's a good rebounder. Someone will take a chance on him."

Duke's Dahntay Jones showed his superior athleticism and grabbed nine boards, but his shot just looks broken at the moment. He has made only 5 of 17 thus far in camp.

"He really needed to shoot the ball well to help himself," one assistant GM said. "He has to prove he can knock down a shot on the wing. I believe he's a better shooter than advertised, but his stock won't rise until he sinks a jumper or two."

Duncan impressing stars past and present

By Terry Brown

NBA Insider

Friday, June 6

Updated: June 6

12:06 PM ET

Superlatives have run dry after only six seasons in the NBA, all of them ending in All NBA First Team selections.

He was Rookie of the Year in 1998, an All Defensive First Team selection every season except for the one he was named to the Second Team. Already an NBA in champion and Finals MVP in 1999, he recently tallied 32 points and 20 boards on 64 percent shooting to end any questions that he wouldn't win his second, on both counts, in 2003.

So as early as it seems, is it actually time to declare 27-year-old Tim Duncan, averaging 22.9 and 12.3 rebounds on 51 percent shooting in 451 games, the greatest power forward of All Time?

Here's how the hierarchy stood, in ascending order, before some kid from the Virgin Islands starting hitting 15-footers off the glass.

Willis Reed, New York Knicks

Career: 18.7 ppg, 12.9 rpg, 47 FG%, 650 games

Skinny: The only power forward other than Tim Duncan to lead his team to an NBA Title. And he did it twice in 1970 and 1973 while being named the Finals MVP both years. And how can we forget about his limp out of the locker room at the beginning of the seventh game of the 1970 Finals to score two buckets and inspire his team on to victory in what could be the greatest moment in NBA history. But aside from winning the ROY in 1965, nothing else sticks out when you get to this caliber of competition. His career scoring average is just average and he played in only 650 games. In four more years, Elton Brand will have posted similar numbers.

Elgin Baylor, Los Angeles Lakers

Career: 27.4 ppg, 13.5 rpg, 43 FG%, 846 games

Skinny: There is this mystique about a guy who averaged more points per game than anyone in NBA history not named Michael Jordan or Wilt Chamberlain but never won a ring, scoring title or MVP trophy. His contemporaries argue that his game was 25 years before its time, lacking the television highlight reels, cereal box covers and shoe deals it deserved. At one time, owned the records for most points scored in a regular season game and postseason game. Absolutely dominated the position during the Sixties on his way to 10 All NBA First Team selections from 1959 thru 1969 and 11 All Star appearances but would a 6-foot-5 guy even survive in the paint today?

Karl Malone, Utah Jazz

Career (active): 25.4 ppg, 10.2 rpg, 51 FG%, 1,434 games

Skinny: The two-time MVP winner (1997 and 1999) is only 2,013 points away from becoming the NBA's all time leading scorer. He's scored more than that in a single season 12 times. And if you thought Baylor's shadow was long, Malone was named to 11 All NBA First Teams and 14 All Star squads. If the voting ended at the end of this article, he would have to be considered the favorite. If it ends after next season and he chooses wisely as an upcoming free agent, he may continue to be the favorite. But lack of an NBA Title will haunt him on Judgement Day.

But an even bigger question is how many of the aforementioned guys will even be remembered after Kevin Garnett, Chris Webber and Dirk Nowitzki are done?

The Golden Age of the power forward is in full swing so isn't it only fitting that we begin comparing the best of this bunch to best of All Time . . .

After all, have power forwards ever dribbled like KG, passed like Webber, shot from range like Nowitzki?

When was the last time your favorite 7-footer moved to small forward because he wanted to get as far away from the restraints of the center position as he could?

"If I had to guard (Tim Duncan), I would make sure that I brought Jamaal Wilkes and Greg Lee, Maurice Lucas, Lionel Hollins and Johnnie Davis," said Hall of Famer Bill Walton in the Dallas Morning News. "And Larry Bird, Kevin McHale, Robert Parish, Dennis Johnson, Danny Ainge and Scott Wedman. And John Wooden, Jack Ramsay, K.C. Jones. And then, I'd pray a lot."

In fact, are there any centers even left?

"Shaq and Tim, they dominate," said Jason Kidd in the New York Post. "1A and 1B when you talk about the best players on the planet."

"He destroyed them," said former NBA great Artis Gilmore in the Kansas City Star when asked of Duncan's performance in the playoffs. "That's how a great big man is supposed to play. Except for Tim and Shaq, you don't see much of that anymore."

And if he has already transcended basketball dogma beginning with guards, forwards and centers leading to ones, twos, threes, fours and fives with the additions of point forwards and swingmen, then where else are we supposed to look but the past as we prepare for the future?

"Tim Duncan is the epitome of old-school basketball," said Hall of Famer Julius "Dr. J" Erving in Kansas City Star. "When you go the playground and see a really dominant big man with great fundamentals, you appreciate it. Tim does the fundamentals first. And, when the smoke clears, he's usually on the winning side."

And if he's already done with the past, then what does the future hold with only three wins left in this year's Finals and Tim Duncan, 7-feet tall and legend already growing, still only 27-years-old?

"Tim is incredible," said future Hall of Famer and teammate David Robinson in the Times-Picayune. "When you get a great player like Tim, you let him do what he does best. The way he is playing he's at his prime and is going to continue to play great. Tim is a unique animal. I've got my own thing, and he's got his own thing."

Or, caught up in asterisks and sore big toes, have we just run out of adjectives?

Tim Brought Shaq Attack

Fred Kerber / New York Post

Duncan's game speaks for itself

Ivan Carter / Kansas City Star

Nets have no answer for Duncan

Eddie Sefko / Dallas Morning News

Duncan creates big problem for N.J.

John Reid / New Orleans Times-Picayune

Peep Show

By Terry Brown

NBA Insider

Friday, June 6

Updated: June 6

12:06 PM ET

Washington Wizards: The wooing of Jeff Van Gundy continues. With everyone expecting the former Knicks coach to end up in Houston, the current TV analyst actually was in Washington, D.C., discussing the Wizards. "Yesterday I spoke to the Wizards for a good length of time," Van Gundy told the Washington Post. "We'll just wait and see how everything works out." Of course, the story didn't run without a quote on the Houston situation. "I was talking to somebody I really trust in basketball," Van Gundy said. "He said the biggest plus about Houston is every day Yao Ming wakes up, he's 7-foot- 5. Ain't that the truth."

Battier

Chicago Bulls: As our own Chad Ford suggested Wednesday, the Bulls are trying to put together a package to get Shane Battier from the Memphis Grizzlies, reports The Chicago Sun Times. Currently, The Bulls are said to be offering Marcus Fizer and their No. 7 pick for Battier and Memphis' No. 13 pick, precisely the swap Ford discussed earlier this week. Meanwhile, in the Jamal Crawford vs. Jay Williams debate, Crawford may have scored a huge victory off the court. The lithe point guard parted company with Seattle-based agent Aaron Goodwin, made famous of late by his signing of LeBron James, and hitched up with Arn Tellem who, the Chicago Tribune reports, "has a strong business relationship with Bulls Chairman Jerry Reinsdorf, also represents Eddy Curry and free- agent guard Fred Hoiberg, among many other NBA players."

Los Angeles Lakers: The tear in Kobe Bryant's shoulder will keep him from his arduous offseason workouts but might give his knees some much-needed rest. "If I don't have surgery, it could get worse," Bryant said in an ESPN interview picked up by the Orange County Register. "And that's something that I don't want to have happen. So it seems as if surgery is inevitable." The early timetable has the all-star guard returning for training camp but missing the Olympic Qualifying Tournament in Puerto Rico. That wouldn't affect his Olympic team status for 2004.

Walker

Boston Celtics: If Tim Grover can get Michael Jordan back into shape twice, maybe he can do it once for Antoine Walker. "We're going to get back his explosiveness, decrease his body fat percentage and take care of his lower extremities," Grover told the Boston Herald. "He needs to work on his legs to keep them strong for the full season." But anything the famous trainer does in the gym will have little effect if Walker doesn't respond when away from it. "He's got to make a commitment to change his (nutritional) habits away from the court," Grover said. "He can work as hard as he wants inside the gym, but it's what he does when he's outside the gym that determines how that will carry over to your game. Put it this way, you're only in the gym for two hours a day. What you do those other 22 hours makes the bigger difference. If it was the other way around and we had him for 22 hours, he could pretty much do whatever he wanted for those two hours."

Wizards Join the Rockets in Talking to Van Gundy

Chris Broussard / New York Times

Spurs coach sticks neck out for Carlesimo

Frank Isola / New York Daily News

Van Gundy, Wizards Discuss Coaching Job

Steve Wyche / Washington Post

Crawford signs with Reinsdorf ally

K.C. Johnson / Chicago Tribune

Trainer has plan to trim 'Toine

Steve Bulpett / Boston Herald

Bulls interested in Grizzlies forward Battier

Roman Modrowski / Chicago Sun-Times

Wolves might go after Malone

Charley Walters / St. Paul Pioneer Press

Kobe might be headed for surgery

Kevin Ding / Orange County Register

[coachx]

I posted a thought on the draft forum about him yesterday that he could be the Hawks pick at #37. I had never heard of him until recently. Now I think he should be the pick at #21 if he is still there, since the secret is out.

It now seems obvious he has the physical attributes and the natural intangibles (hunger, heart, desire), he just needs to add to the cerebral aspect of the game like all 19 year olds. Gamble on this kid before some spoiled American high-schooler. He sounds like a young Theo who will grow to be bigger and more polished offensively then Theo.

(Spoiled compared to the conditions in Senegal)

[Boondocks]

Let's wait untill we get some more info from other workouts, although I love Malick he didn't average double figures all season long on the division 2 team in Germany. He's an amazing physical specimen but RAW.

I myself am hoping insider will witness a workout by Pavlovic, a 6'8" sg with mad handles and a deft stroke from all over the court. He's my pick if he's still on the board for our 21st pick.

[TJ_Swann]

I too rather get Pavlovic with the 21st pick. But Badiane sounds like he's making him some extra money. Villanueava needs to read the handwriting on the wall or he'll be this years DeAngelo Collins, undrafted.