sillent

These past 2 games Trae Young has done something that I initially hoped when we built this team the way we did last yr.

I expected Trae to be 15+ on assist because of all the shooters we added mainly ( Huerter, Hunter, Gallo and Bogi) on top of having JC and CC.

He was almost averaging double digits in assist or close to it so I didn't think that was too much of a challenge. 

Now that he's doing it we're able to really  open the game up and dominate. With the  defense not being able to key in on anybody it makes us that much lethal offensively.

With everybody happy people are much more engaged which gets us up more defensively and when we have our defense going not too many can compete with us.

If Trae continues to be flexible and play unselfishly enough to average 15+ in assist then the narrative will change quickly about us as we power our way thru the play in and playoffs. Time will tell but with Trae playing this way we definitely have an opportunity to change our narrative during the post season.

Just now, sillent said:

Quavo did say we should get Trae and have our own Splash brothers. Can't remember who else was already on the team that made him say that (Korver?? Belinelli?? *insert here) but I definitely remember that.

Good thing for us is Travis came fresh from the Warriors and already had that game plan in mind to pick the next "Stef" = Trae , "Klay" = Huerter, "Draymond" = Omari Spellman almost but he missed the most important part of Draymond's game (IQ/the mental's).

JC is actually an upgrade in my opinion and if he isn't Travis Draymond he has OO, JJ, CC and Gallo to recreate peak Draymond type production.

Travis loves to double/triple up.

He has atleast 2 more "Klays" Bogi(offense)/*cough TLC(defense) wish I could put Cam here.

Lou Will and Sharife  are very Trae like or atleast can be.

DeAndre is the Harrison Barnes/X factor type. Him and Cam together would've been "Durantish" but I can't really go there now.

All that to say it may be more than basketball but it's definitely basketball  

 

Can't believe I forgot Iggy.

4 hours ago, Diesel said:

I watched a video called Coverstory (ESPN) on Trae Young. 

There in the story, Quavo talks about how he saw Trae at OU and he reached out to Hawks FO persons before the Draft and said You gotta get Trae. You gotta get Trae.  Later Quavo says something to the effect that the FO told him that his request was received and that he has a powerful voice.   Check it out, it's in there.   Along with the IceTrae Moniker. 

I can't say that I'm a migos fan.. because I know nothing about them.. but they are popular (so I hear)...

Could it be dismissed that Trae Young's drafting was more about creating a buzz among young hip-hop fans than it was about basketball?

Could it all have been more than Basketball?

Quavo did say we should get Trae and have our own Splash brothers. Can't remember who else was already on the team that made him say that (Korver?? Belinelli?? *insert here) but I definitely remember that.

Good thing for us is Travis came fresh from the Warriors and already had that game plan in mind to pick the next "Stef" = Trae , "Klay" = Huerter, "Draymond" = Omari Spellman almost but he missed the most important part of Draymond's game (IQ/the mental's).

JC is actually an upgrade in my opinion and if he isn't Travis Draymond he has OO, JJ, CC and Gallo to recreate peak Draymond type production.

Travis loves to double/triple up.

He has atleast 2 more "Klays" Bogi(offense)/*cough TLC(defense) wish I could put Cam here.

Lou Will and Sharife  are very Trae like or atleast can be.

DeAndre is the Harrison Barnes/X factor type. Him and Cam together would've been "Durantish" but I can't really go there now.

All that to say it may be more than basketball but it's definitely basketball  

Somebody's price is going up $$$ *JJ

A little extra time to develop has been paying off

5 minutes ago, LucastheThird said:

I'm one of the biggest Jalen Johnson fans here, but he isn't a Guard. He's a Power Forward who *can* play SF and Small ball Center. 

I feel ya. I was just looking at him like we would have if we got Ben Simmons. I know he's not there yet.

Increase Trae, Collins, OO, Gallo (a 6'10 inside/out weapon that not many teams possess)

Holding Clint (if he could just be more consistent inside), Kevin (has become a true weapon from the mid range and closer and when his 3 is on and he's playing D we usually W), Louis Will

Decrease Bogi (mainly until he starts moving the ball more and shooting in rhythm but he's Iso Bogi as a 6 man so it's hard to complain) Hunter (has been solid but compared to his trajectory from his rookie yr to now it's a step down. I'm sure he'll get it back during the playoffs though. Yes I did say playoffs)

PG Trae Young

SG Jalen Johnson (developed)

SF DeAndre Hunter 

PF John Collins 

C Onyeka Okongwu 

PG Delon Wright/Sharife Cooper 

SG Bogdan Bogdanovic/Skylar Mays 

SF Kevin Huerter 

PF Gallo/ (rookie maybe or I'd take Nathan Knight)

C Clint Capela 

Honestly we built a nice squad around Trae. I'd love to still have Cam but we definitely have the squad.

21 hours ago, JayBirdHawk said:

I don't think there is anyone that doesn't think that JJ needs time to be 'ready'.  He struggled in the early GLeague games but has been so much better over the course of the season.

Again, no one is saying to entrench him as a mainstay in the regular rotation, but rather give him the minutes they have given to Knox in his short stints.  If he does some positive things give him another go, if not then he sits.

Believe me I wanted the same thing. I just looked at it from a GM/Front office standpoint of trying to figure out how to keep and grow as much of the core as possible. They can gain a lot more by developing him "behind the scenes" while  keeping his value low.

I feel the same about playing Sharife especially when Trae is out but I do understand it from other sides. Just like I understand people need someone to point a finger at for the good and the bad. I was just trying to share that it might not be that simple as we wish it would.

16 hours ago, REHawksFan said:

The 2 bolded statements are the only parts of that worth responding to. The rest is just pie in the sky wishful thinking. 

First, you don't know JJ isn't ready to contribute. He hasn't been given any chance. This idea you have that this is some title team where a rookie can't develop is straight nonsense. Do you even know what you are saying? I mean nearly every other playoff team has played 1 or more rookies more than JJ has played this year. The assertion that the Hawks are above that somehow is asinine and frankly laughable if the reality of it all wasn't so damn depressing. 

And secondly,  the HAWKS will be going into next season with  a rookie that has zero experience and will be learning the ropes whereas Tor, Cleveland, BKN, Boston, Cha, Mia, and even Mil - all playoff teams btw - will have 2nd year players with more NBA experience than JJ. You talk about development but other teams are developing their players while still managing to put a playoff team on the floor. What a novel concept.

It's ridiculous. 

 

I know basketball and it's wasn't hard to tell that he would need some serious time before he was ready. Basketball is more about the physical it's about the mental. JJ as most rookies do have been working on mentally maturing more than anything.

I know exactly what I'm  saying. I just see things a little deeper than the average. It's easy to imagine what you'd/we'd like to believe would happen if we played JJ but reality could take away from that illusion.

I could break down scenarios but those too would be illusions and the reality is what it is.

8 hours ago, REHawksFan said:

But they DO need the young guys.  That's the point.  The front office had to tell the coaching staff last year to play OO 5 minutes a game and see how he does.  If he earns the minutes then give him more.  Nate specifically quoted this in the clip you posted. This year, it may have been a front office & coaching decision to not do that but Nate needs to have the flexibility and awareness to call an audible when injuries happen and it's CLEARLY not working as planned.  

IF the Hawks were 49-23 and a TOP 3 seed in the East, then everyone would understand that JJ just couldn't break the rotation.  But they aren't.  They are 35-36 and playing TLC and Kevin Knox some nights because their starting PF is hurt and the backup is old and often gimpy.  

Nate has a history of not wanting to play young players. EVEN IF this year they started with some collective agreement that JJ would not play, there's ZERO reason for that stance to remain in effect given the reality of the way the season unfolded.  And NO ONE in the front office is prohibiting Nate from playing JJ if he actually had a desire to do so.  

I agree with everything above the bold. Nate wasn't our coach then so I can't give you that unless they were going behind LP's back which I doubt since we have an upfront front office.

The 2 main issues that allow me to understand their decision making more than us fans is the fact that JJ isn't ready to be a difference maker on our team yet so playing him doesn't/wouldn't change that.

Before I start I know it's twisted and may not make sense to the average fan but our team is in the position that it wants to be in even currently. The head of our snake loves a challenge and gets up for the playoffs so I would not be surprised at all (actually I still expect it) if we win a championship.

In the words of JSmooth fans are fickle and won't remember or care just how bad our season is/was if we step up when it counts.

We still have all the pieces and have atleast made it a point to pretty much beat every team that would be a playoff threat when it counts so we really don't care who we face.

The fan in me would love to see the playoff matchups that are currently set which means we'd have to beat the Hornets, Miami, Boston/Chicago and then whoever out of the Bucks,76ers and Nets in the Eastern Finals.

The East is hands down better than the west this year and Nate does have an upper hand on Montey so far if it so happens to be the Suns.

I didn't mean to post this long but I guess this is my version of calm down. We're good. Let's let the rookies develop at a rookie pace so we can truly praise them later when they're ready.

13 hours ago, REHawksFan said:

Did you expect Nate to say anything differently? Is he gonna say, "well I'm only playing him because it's a directive from the front office?"

Between Nates coach speak or the beat writers statement, I think I'm inclined to believe the beat writer. Especially when it aligns exactly with what we see now with JJ. Why would the beat writer lie about this?

That was before Nate became our interim head coach.. Nate was still under Lloyd Pierce then. He could have kept them young guys on the bench like LP was doing but as soon as he got an opportunity to sub he gave them more minutes. Nobody's asking the assistant coach for much but to hold down the fort. 

13 hours ago, JayBirdHawk said:

....Nate coached this game...LP was out for the birth of child.

What's telling for me.....when young guys play and get opportunities just go out and give all your energy and scrap don't worry about making mistakes, match minutes with veterans....

...but here's the rub....Jalen has not had that opportunity for minutes at all despite the injuries.

Exactly. Meaning it's not just Nate's say so on why the rooks aren't playing. That was a whole front office discussion before this season started and they opted on not needing to play the young guys early like we have in the past. This is the 1st yr in a while that we haven't just thrown young guys to the fire.

21 hours ago, REHawksFan said:

Disagree with this entirely.  The article I linked in the OP (and that @JayBirdHawk quoted) specifically stated that Travis had to force Nate to play OO last year so they could see what he had.  If left up to Nate, OO would never have gotten any run and would not have been used in the playoffs.  Now we see the same with JJ this year.  

What different position are we in? We were in the playoff last year and this year we are trying to be.  The young guys can absolutely be useful in achieving that goal.  Not playing JJ to see if he can help when JC is out and Gallo is oft-injured is idiotic.  

As for Cam, are you really arguing that he "had to be traded" because he "blossomed too soon"??  Really??  That's insane.  He had to be traded because he literally went to Travis and demanded a trade and then pouted when his role wasn't big enough.  If Cam has truly blossomed at this point then his career will be over before it ever starts.  He's a bit player that needs more time on the court so that he can blossom.  

Finally, I don't know what to tell you if you actually think Trae is the reason they are losing.  That's just dumb. Nate's way is old, antiquated, and proven not to work.  The hope was that he had changed his ways after last years success.  But now we are all realizing a leopard doesn't change his spots.  Nate is who he is.  And he's the same guy that refuses to play young guys unless he is forced by management to do so.  

So I guess the front office told Nate to play Onyeka when Nate was still an assistant for LP 

The whole video puts it all into perspective on Nate's feelings for young guys but if you want to get to the point of Onyeka check of out around the 6:15 mark of the video. 

And by the way I didn't know Nate was still out there playing and running the team every game. The coach can only scheme and create plays. The players have to execute.

On 3/18/2022 at 10:49 AM, REHawksFan said:

....then he should pack his bags and be shown the door.  Is he really going to take the position that he trusts TLC and Knox (who have PROVEN to be marginal NBA players in their careers) over the unknown potential of JJ?  If so, then we are royally screwed as long as Nate is at the helm.  The whole "stuck in his ways" crap is just writer code for he'd rather lose doing it HIS way than try something else.  

Jami gonna be like....

 

https://theathletic.com/3192618/2022/03/18/i-do-see-a-mini-lebron-in-him-so-why-cant-hawks-rookie-jalen-johnson-crack-atlantas-rotation/

 

I would blame Nate but it actually looks like something he and Travis discussed before the season started.

Nate was the same guy last year that opted to give OO more minutes and it panned out so I don't think he's fully opposed. We are just in a different position than we were last yr and possibly financial  reasons as well has kinda forced us to slow grow our youngsters so we can keep them in the budget with the rest of our talent. If they blossom to fast it doesn't just effect what they do on the court but the overall payroll and being able to keep the team together.

That's why Cam had to be traded even though most of us including Travis knew he was one of our best players and will only get better.

Do we want a deep talented team that can survive an 82 game season or a top heavy team with most of the weight being carried by our stars? Slow grooming our rooks allows the financial cycle to flow a little more naturally and leave us flexible. 

We just need guys to actually buy into the system enough *cough* Trae. When we do we tend to win no matter who's out there. When you're winning within the system it's hard to say Nate's way isn't working even if there could be other options.

On 12/3/2021 at 10:21 PM, sillent said:

Like them or not. They are obviously not for us and our success lol... If we win in them we're definitely championship bound. Especially against a worthwhile team

Championship Bound!!!

On 11/5/2021 at 11:06 AM, Spud2nique said:

I actually do too but keep it between us.  

Like them or not. They are obviously not for us and our success lol... If we win in them we're definitely championship bound. Especially against a worthwhile team

Funny how tones and faces change on a roller coaster but glad to hear the cheers now!

We still got the longest winning streak in Hawks history coming to reach the top but we're aiming for it.

On 11/14/2021 at 12:54 AM, Diesel said:

Yeah... but the point is that we need that kind of team consistency.    We don't have a shooter like Curry or a playmaker like Green... but they don't have a player like Trae or a hard working efficiency guy like JC.   It's not that we have to mimic their play, we should mimic how hard they work to play as a team..

I can't stand watching Cam hit the floor.   Like against Denver... He gets the ball, Wright is out ahead of him on the break.. what does he do... NOT give it up and wind up losing the darn ball. -4.   Some of the dumb things we do can't be given to youth anymore... we've been here... we're just not learning because we don't have the desire. 

I feel like last year we played so well because we had something to prove and the desire to overcome mistakes were there.   This season, it's more like we've proved it. No desire.   Sometimes, I can see Trae just going through the motions. 

The Warriors play like they want it. Very Badly.  Even their bench players come in hungry.   And even though all the cameras are pointed at Curry... He's not a glory hog.  He wants it very badly.  I saw him setting picks last night.  I cursed at him... what the hell are you doing??  But then I saw it.  Every player plays selflessly. 

That's what we had last year.   Every player playing selflessly because we wanted to win more than we wanted to look good.  So far, we have a few times that we have shown up as a team.. I mean against Denver in the 2nd half, we went on a 15-2 run.   It was the second squad with JC and it was all team.  They got JC the damn ball.  Nobody was really taking heat checks.  Defense was ticked up. Kvon was scoring in rhythm and passing in rhythm...  It's beautiful.   But it didn't last. 

I don't want to say it's Bogi because he has heart and he hits shots.  I just believe that each player at this point should know their role.   I'm not down about the losing streak but the Denver game was a winnable game. 

We forgot that you don't have to stop Joker... Just stop the rest. Cut off Joker's passing lanes... Make him pick the ball up.  Keep a hand in his face and if he hits it.. OK..   but don't let him get other guys started.  It's the same Embiid plan. 

I believe that we will start running better.. we just need to avoid injuries and remember our roles. 

Please relax. I understand the concerns but we haven't even seen our squad for real. Maybe the last 2 games were the best definition of our true squad but we haven't begun to play our game for real.

Judging amy team less than 20 games in usually turns out bad for the judge. 

I know we wanted them to jump out the gate like they could have but I think we'd all rather them save their best for when it matters most.

I definitely wanted Bol Bol over Bruno and this might be another opportunity if he is available.

I believe Bol Bol is a hidden gem just like I believe Cam is a hidden gem but if the Nuggets don't see the value I'd love to snatch him up!

I do feel like they may be our finals opponent over the Jazz. It's still early in the season though.

We also have to see if the Warriors curse is finally broken. They've had too many injuries to key players throughout the yrs.

 https://www.hawksquawk.net/topic/434151-coaching-staff-additions/?do=findComment&comment=1112222

3 hours ago, sturt said:

I think this point is probably a novel one to some, if not many, if not most... including our media friends who've taken for granted that Gallo won't be a Hawk next season. It's probable, sure, but as you've suggested, there's a plausible scenario where his agent and Schlenk figure out something longer term.

Jalen Johnson is here so we can stay good or get even better while continuing to stay young.

It's a natural process just like aging and Gallo isn't a two way player.

That's why we need to win a ring with him this yr. He can depart happy or be happy to be a 2/3 man for the low off the bench.

To keep as many good players as we have, sacrifices have to be made along the road in order to have longevity.