sillent

Understandable!! But we are all grown hopefully and we got to look at what we have now. True BK is no longer with us(at least on the payroll) but the core that he used to build this team is still present to this day. How can you like the team without giving some credit to the person that built the team? Simple question for adults young and old and would of could of should of's should be left for that type of post. This was not one of those. This was suppose to be a reality based grown man topic showing appreciation where it was due. Point Blank.

Conversation Terminated not only did you not answer the question( Who has a better drafting record than BK). Pau Gasol, Boris Diaw, Josh Smith, Marvin Williams, Al Horford, Josh Childress to name a few (Regardless of where they are now, there should not be no denying these are pretty good players). But you attack back with the bold statement above and really it's hard to even read the rest of your paragraph.

A fool is only based on actions. Anybody can be anything at any time depending on their actions. I just feel that it's kind of foolish to celebrate accomplishments or the makeup of our current team without at least giving credit to those that took part in building the team. Yeah it was a slow process but a steady process and we can all (hopefully) see the dividends. We've(Most Hawks Fans including myself Vaughn and Lue were not my favorites) ridiculed BK for all the actions he did or didn't make but we can't give any credit when we see the latter results?

Damn!! I thought for sure BK drafted Smoove (Marvin, Horford, Childress, Salim, Solomon, Mario, Law) who all undeniably have skills and just because they didn't make it in our system or a system for that matter BK f***ed up? Even Sheldon is servicable(ask the Boston Celtics) but just because they didn't turn out/or weren't picked to be a Paul, Roy or Deron there is problems. Naw, I think if we would have picked every player us fans wanted that there would be problems whether it hit us now or later. Say what you want but you are going to end up laughing (bandwagon, I see your type all the time) with those who have the last laugh(us, who already knew better). Please continue the hate it will make the statements of those with understanding and appreciation look that much better!! "Quote this, I ignore ignorance and arguing with fools will only make you a fool" so I'll be the first to apologize for my foolish ways!!

Playoffs baby playoffs!! All the Elite( playoff teams especially in the east have good bigs to boast). It will be an advantage in the playoffs to have depth in the front court position that can work(foul/frustrate/defend) the other bigs at times when it really counts.

Yeah I only said this because with our small front court we need somebody big or athletic at the point guard position. If not we'll just be the suns from a couple years ago which will be exciting but won't grant a championship (defense wins championships).

I said this, people doubt, time will tell!!

hungh!! You know we got Teague right?

Yep!! It's not improving our defense that will make us lose against teams like the Bobcats(Another Wake up call game). We won't be as good as we can be until we learn to bring intensity every game against every team on offense and definitely defense.

Let's see how Marvin does with more offensive freedom before we just decide to send him sailing. Right now he is just struggling(as an unselfish player) to see where he fits in with so much talent on the team.

I think we should just be patient and if anything go after him during the off season. Again chemistry is very important(See CP3/Tyson Chandler) and when it is good you don't want to change that. We've paid the kid(Marvin) and he has a nice reasonable contract. If Joe decides to go else where then Rudy could actually be our shooting guard. Our small front court want be so small with a lineup of Horford Smoove Marvin Rudy Jamal/Teague/Bibby

Are you Ernie. I know I've seen you on some show/movie before. What a character!! :laughing5:

We are in the future and as you notice teams are starting to follow footsteps. The problem is most teams, fans, coaches, GM's lack the patience to really enjoy what they have created. Some just put talent together but we brought in all good character guys with a will to get better and to win!!

No BK drafted Marvin because he knew he would be good but not good right away giving him time to develop while continue to stock pile the roster via draft. Meaning a continuation of getting even more good players on rookie salaries instead of being to good to get to the lotto. But not good enough to win it all with what you have or what you can get with limited resources. True but if you all are not realizing we have all-star caliber talent in Smoove, Horford, Marvin, Crawford(I know he's not from BK era), Teague(hopefully) and they would be able to showcase that more if they were not all on the same team. Even in an all-star game you notice how all players are good/great but defer to the hot man or the greater players to get the win. It's called sacrifice and team basketball. Again we swept them last year and split even the year before that. But thanks for proving my point that because Paul was so good so early it stagnated the teams growth and now they can only go as far as Paul can take them(Even my boi Wade has to go through this). Maybe maybe not. Maybe Smoove is too good too soon and his ego kicks in and he demands a trade. Maybe Joe defers to the point where he is barely an all-star. Maybe we are but still struggle to compete against the likes of the Celtics/Lakers and Dwights of the league and still have to eventually move in another direction. Who knows but it would have definitely looked good on paper if Woody would have allowed Paul and the others to blossom correctly. Because we have gotten better every year and are looking to go no where but up while still having the main core that BK brought in. Now Can I Ask Y'all A Question? WHY ARE Y'ALL HAWKS FANS? I am a fan of the Garnett's, McGrady's, Wade, Gilbert's,Rashard Lewis's, Lamar Odom's but I am not going to cry and complain about who my team doesn't have. Matter of fact I am kind of happy about who my team doesn't have (the egos like the Iverson's, heart lacking Carter's, Chemically embalanced Artest's, contracts of Lewis).

Reading the bold statement let's me know you understand logic but you only use it to defend your statement. The point is nobody knows exactly who will do what coming out of the draft and one of our players currently who was a number one pick(Joe Smith) shows that. Marcus Camby was better than Tim Duncan in college. Paul could have came to our team and had Speedy(Craig) Claxton luck. The point is again that GM's get it right or wrong all the time and even when they do get it right other circumstances could be involved. Boston might have kept Joe Johnson if they knew he could be this type of player eventually and could've went in a whole nother direction. Yes who knows what would've, could've, should've nobody but we do know who we have now and in my opinion it looks pretty darn good.

I recall sweeping New Orleans last year and splitting with them the year before that. Salim gave him a showing his rookie season. I believe we were down by at least 20 in the 4th. We lost that game by 3 because Salim was hitting every shot but the last one. I believe Salim either had 27 or 30 points that game and I knew we had a diamond in the rough. If Woody would have continued to groom Salim instead of breaking and building em like his mentor does we could be having a whole nother debate. Again in the NBA everyone has talent(some more than others) but it is the confidence, will, opportunity and work ethic that makes the greats great. I can only imagine us getting Paul for Woody to sit him after a great game for Lue or somebody because he would rather teach him the game from the bench. I can only imagine the ups and downs Paul would have had playing for a losing team and still not getting a chance to go out their and show his full potential. Woody's excuse might be that he didn't understand the switch defense or whatever. Than we may be talking about how Marvin's this great star in someone else's system with less talent around him and saying I can't believe we picked Paul over Marvin when we all knew he was the "best player" coming out of the draft. If we picked Sean May or Rashad McCants that would be debatable but Marvin is a very serviceable player on a great up and coming team (him being a big part in that) and will be an all-star someday. David West(All-Star?) Peja(At least was a better than average shooter) Tyson (Better than average shot blocker/rebounder) Not really buying the better than average statement because you need key pieces on every team that can play these roles and they all were above average.

That's the whole point to draft these "better" players with the budget BK was given would have been detriment to the team. It would not have made us better it would have made us New Orleans. A Hall of Fame player (see Stockton/Malone) or two that does not have the necessary tools to win a champion. The Hornets can stay good but not good enough for as long as Paul's tenure or they can do what we all dread seeing again for a while and that is rebuild. They owe that to Paul but will Paul really want to stick around during this process? Now, as a Hawks fans would you really want to take the risk of being teaser good but reaching a climax before having to start all over. Chris and David West are still young (but not that young), in their prime years and they are going to want to win now!! Who is going to take Peja contract or make a trade with them significant enough to put them over the top? Do they have the money to just sign a big name? If the answer is no and they are not mediocre enough to get a good draft pick they are going to have to reconstruct this team. They were there 5 years ago they are going to have to consider doing it again now. In Hindsight why would you continue to cry for this fate for our team?

Unless he has won the games that count. That goes for Paul, Deron, Roy, Foye and who ever else you want to throw out their then your debate is irrelevant. They are still in the same boat as BK's players in not winning a championship. But at least Marvin and Roy can boast that they have a team that is on the up rise because of the way their teams were constructed.

So I guess we just don't have the talent. Man!! I hope the other NBA teams don't hear about this or they might not let us win anymore. Shaq,Karl Malone,Kobe,Payton I'm sorry but because you didn't have talent a ring was just not going to come your way. Championships take cohesiveness!! Everybody has talent in the NBA but they have to play the role that best suits the team in order to win. Good team chemistry and strategy along with someone(s) who knows how to take over/win wins Championships. Whether that someone just has the confidence to hit the big shot(Steve Kerr) or someone that refuses to be stopped by the defense(MJ). But again we just don't have talent which means no all-stars which means no Championship. Funk!!

The way our team is composed (young athletic) I would add Rudy Gay. He is close to being a star if not already but he doesn't take away from our current core. Josh and Jamal will be closer to taking this team over by next year so Rudy can just compliment what we already have. Since Horford and Smith (athletic but small) are our starting center and power forwards. Marvin and Gay would help bolster that fact and Crawford will also make us more athletic and lengthy. He would fit right into Woody's switch defense without losing a step(once he learns the system). He can shoot/score and also is a pretty good defender because of his length, size and athleticism. He does not have to come in being the star and can kind of just fill his way out and if we ISO anybody it will be Jamal who is a pretty good decision maker.

We've had a team that boasted the lineup of Jason Terry ( Up and Coming Guard) Stephen Jackson( Getting into his prime) Glen Robinson(All star scorer) Shareef Abdul Rahim( All star) Theo Ratliff(all star shot blocker at the time) Didn't work we had to rebuild, Guess What? We are not the only team in the NBA that has tried and failed and won't be the last. Most of us are so mad at BK because nobody likes the rebuilding process especially when you are struggling to even be considered Mediocre. Get over it, his plan worked. He did in one of the hardest ways possible by starting from scratch with pretty much all draft picks. No he did not pick the best player and was more focused on creating the best team. Now all Sund has to do is fill in the blanks(not saying that this is always easy but I like the way he is going about filling it). Currently these are the teams that have or are close to reaching their ceiling and need to rebuild eventually to get out of this box. Spurs Their All-Stars are getting old and on the decline. Hornets Can not get Paul enough help in their current stage and Paul has too much pride to let his team be under mediocre to get it. Jazz Have gone about as far as they can with their current roster and some of their key peices are declining or distracted. Celtics Will be on their last legs in a couple of years. Lakers Bynum is going to have to reign supreme in about 4 years. Clippers Are just cursed but even if they get it together most of their stars are getting up in age. Suns Are already beginning the course. Heat Are a year into their rebuilding process. Wade is just that good so it's hard to notice. Wizards Can give it another good run or two maybe but if you notice they have Blatche, Young, McGee, Crittenton, Foye hiding in the background. Well maybe not hiding. Cavaliers Are in a make and break season and even if they keep Lebron but don't win they may be in need of some major revamping. OKC May be seeing close to their finished product and just need time to develop. Bobcats Are still trying to figure out how to get to the playoffs in what is now an even tougher conference/division. Rockets Have been rebuilding slowly but surely they just haven't fell much because they are a tough bunch. Mavericks Have to go for it all because they do not have much time left and are getting up in age in basketball years. Pistons Started the process once they got rid of Ben/Chauncey. Bulls Are close to their last stages of rebuilding. Raptors Are currently looking like a team that maybe good but not great and Chris Bosh may not have the patience to wait. Nuggets Are in their prime now but will have to start making some decisions if they can't win it all soon because they won't be in their prime for long. But Carmelo like Wade,Dwight, Lebron are always good pieces to build around. It's just hard on a minimum budget to get them more star power. All these teams are obviously rebuilding. Knicks Warriors Pacers Nets Grizzilies Bucks Kings Wolves Besides us the Blazers, Magic, 76ers in the next 5 years their are going to be a whole lot of changes in personal and power(elite status). I just wanted to give credit to BK/Sund for making sure our rebuilding process is not continues. They did not spend a whole lot of money for stars in their prime to get the win now and rebuild later. Even when doing things like this chemistry can be an issue(Look at Grizzilies on paper talent wise they look great). But the players they brought in might be cancerous enough for them to lose Rudy Gay and who knows who else. Look at Dallas who feel like they have too much money to have to rebuild but may eventually see their core not getting them too much farther. Or the Knicks waiting on pipe dreams that may or may not happen. Warriors have plenty of talent but look to be running in circles. Can we as Hawks fans at least be thankful that our core is very talented and should have some of the strongest chemistry in the league(which is very important to win a championship) in a couple of years. We may not have to worry about rebuilding for many years to come and can now just add in pieces that fit.

It would be brilliant with the right pieces at the right time. It does throw you off when you make a play based on the guy immediately guarding you and then that guy ends up being a longer,stronger or quicker guy and you have to change schemes mid move or pass. Say Joe had a smaller man he planned on backing down and then help not only comes but switches. He would either have to settle for a tough shot or pass the ball hoping the passing lane is not blocked off because your advantage is gone and the next move is already anticipated. Watch as Smoove/Marvin and the bunch rack up on their steal/rebound total because they are already anticipating a players next move after the switch. The catch to that is the offense can bait you into switches when they already know it is coming especially early during the shot clock. Most teams make Bibby the target for our defenders to have to help and when we take the bait it makes our switches late or leaves a hole in the middle or a wide open shot with a couple of quick passes.

It's funnier that you called Foye a role player(It's hard to take anything else from this statement) and also funny that that bust landed us Mike Bibby and is currently playing for a dominant Celtics team right now. 5th pick(kinda overseas him self right now).

Smoove be on 1 either this year or next and if he continues the trend that's at least 5 or 6 from him alone.