Is this HatetheHawks.net? C'mon people

[Diesel]

At no time in his career has Thomas been asked to carry the offensive load of a team.

I think that's the one thing about Reef that his detractors always miss. Since coming into the league, Reef has been a marked man because he has been the only real offense his teams have had.

Thomas is a good compliment although I hate his game.

Reef to me is like Webber in Washington.

He has the offensive skills but he doesn't have the help.

Building around Reef means getting players who will help to make him the best he can possible be.

That means a PG who can get the ball into the post.

That means a C who can score.

That means another scorer at the 2 or the 3 who can hit the outside shot.

That means a coach who can teach Reef how to pass out of the double team in the low post.

[Hawksman]

I'm just saying, the good fans are the ones that try to bring in the positives and stick with the team and don't hate on them every second. Right now, I guess everyone is giving up besides me, Jason, and some others.

[Diesel]

The good fans are not those who praise everything the team does. The good fans are the ones who point out the wrongs honestly but still stick with the team through their mistakes.

What you are describing is a FANATIC.

A person who doubles his effort while losing sight of the goal.

However, that's not a fan.

A fan is someone who is honest about his team but still is with HIS team.

I think there are a lot of Good Fans here.

However, there's that Small % of Fanatics as well.

[Carl_Spackler]

***

[Traceman]

[Guest]

It's the truth. I'm not going to watch most games this

year because this is going to be one on the most painful

years in Hawks history.. When I watch really bad play

it all gets uninteresting you know. There will be a race

for the top 5 spots this year. Nobody should be expected

to watch most of the games this year? What's the point?

Heck, the Hawks aren't going to even be developing young

talent like a Chicaago/Denver and Cleveland are doing.

This year will be played just because the team has to

playout the schedule. It's terrible.

[Playmaker0017]

Diesel,

Your comments on Reef echo my sentiment EXACTLY.

Gordon.

[Traceman]

Still, $8 million is a big difference in my opinion. If their salaries were relatively close, there would be no need to discuss the situation. Reef is clearly the better player. The question is whether you would rather have Reef or Kenny Thomas and say Gilbert Arenas or Rashard Lewis.

As for building around Reef, yes, he DOES need all those things around him but I think the fact that he needs those things around him to be successful is what puts him a tier below the top PFs like Duncan, Garnett, Webber, Nowitzki, etc. I don't think those guys need as much around them to be successful.

[Hawksman]

Ok, I have said that we need to move Dog right? I've said that we had awful chemistry right? If you think that I'M not a fan, then that's just plain dumbness right there. I'm not trying to start anything, but I have told you guys my share of what I think the problems are. I think we are a young talented team that is capable of being good. I like the direction we are going in. I am sorry that I'm not beating up the team as much as you and some of these other guys. Whoops, My bad! If you don't like the Hawks right now, then why do you even waste your time posting here? I know some people here are hearing me clearly.

[Diesel]

Still, I must disagree with you and show you why.

Remember CWebb in Washington?

Why wasn't he a top tier PF while there?

Year Team MPG FG% 3P% FT% Off Def Tot APG SPG BPG TO A/TO PF PPG

1994-95 WAS 38.3 .495 .276 .502 3.7 5.9 9.6 4.7 1.5 1.6 3.1 1.5 3.4 20.1

1995-96 WAS 37.2 .543 .441 .594 2.5 5.1 7.6 5.0 1.8 0.6 3.3 1.5 3.4 23.7

1996-97 WAS 39.0 .518 .397 .565 3.3 7.0 10.3 4.6 1.7 1.9 3.2 1.4 3.6 20.1

1997-98 WAS 39.6 .482 .317 .589 2.5 7.0 9.5 3.8 1.6 1.7 2.6 1.5 3.8 21.9

1998-99 SAC 40.9 .486 .118 .454 3.5 9.4 13.0 4.1 1.4 2.1 3.5 1.2 3.5 20.0

A lot of it has to do with what kind of team you're playing on. In SacTown, Webber was coupled with a good Passing team. They have good passing from every position. Better passers certainly helped CWebb's game.

I would say it's a little different for Duncan, KG, and Malone. It's really anybody's guess about these guys. They all have played under the same coach, same system, with basically the same players for their careers.

when you look at what reef has had:

Bryant Reeves, Blue Edwards.

Bryant Reeves, Otis Thorpe.

Dickerson, Reeves.

Bibby, Dickerson.

JT/Nazr/Toni

JT/Grob/Theo.

Not really a whole lot of great players that match his game. Coach wise...

Stu Jackson

Sidney Lowe

Lon Kruger.

Terry Stotts.

I'm sure that there's some sorry Joker I missed.

[Traceman]

He was very good. The team made the playoffs one year when he was there. The problem with him in WAS was his off the court stuff. That's what got him traded. No way was an aging Mitch Richmond anywhere NEAR worth C Webb but the team decided that C Webb had to go and that was the best they could do with him being in constant trouble off the court.

[Diesel]

Actually, in his first year he faired well. He kept the momentum he had with GS. He also had Muresean, Howard, and Wallace playing with him. They were a good team, just happened to meet Jordan and the gang in the first round. However, those next years, Webber's stats went down and by the time his last year with Washington came around, he was a 21 ppg, 9.5 rpg hasbeen forward with 2 dope arrests and one sexual abused charge. NOBODY Wanted him. Babcock even turned him down. It was the saddest thing, Babcock was supposed to be in the three way that landed us CWebb, got Washington Mitch Richmond, and got SACtown Smith and Gray.

Somehow, Hendu was more appealing than CWebb. That tells you where we were at that time.

I can only imagine:

Deke/Webber in the frontcourt together.