The South Got Something to Say.

[00Blink]

First, this is my all time Hawks list. Second, the best TALENT, isnt always the arbritator of who wins. Its how they PLAY TOGETHER.

 

How Shaq and Kareem BOTH gonna play in the starting five? NEITHER has a jump shot. lmao  Baylor. Look, i dont count ANYBODY who played back in Baylor's days. The best talent WASNT in the NBA. Thats why i left Petit off my all time Hawks team. I know that will be met with lots of criticizism, but it is what it is.......

 

I can agree with EVERYTHING you said. Chemistry 'can' trump talent but it takes A LOT of chemistry to trump talent. It is rare as well. See Detroit vs Lakers and that is the only time that chemistry has truly trumped talent. Well, also maybe Spurs vs Heat because Miami clearly had better talent but didn't have the chemistry and pedigree of the Spurs.

 

Also, counting old school players and comparing their game is a bit asinine. However, from late 70s on up should be fair game. And we would still lose by a long shot. Even with Shaq and Kareem, look at the twin towers. Kareem didn't have a jumpshot, he had a LETHAL, DEADLY, UNSTOPPABLE, jump hook.

 

All in all, we don't stand a snowballs chance in Hades.

[Diesel]

For rankings, this is how I have it:

 

Centers: 

1.  Deke

2.  Moses Malone

3.  Z. Beaty

4.  W. Bellamy

5.  A. Horford

 

Power Forwards

1.  Bob Petit

2.  Kevin Willis

3.  Millsap

4.  Dan Roundfield

5.  Shareef

 

Small Forwards

1.  Dominique

2.  Cliff Hagan

3.  John Drew

4.  Josh Smith

5.  Al Harrington

 

Shooting Guard

1.  Lou Hudson

2.  Joe Johnson

3.  Fast Eddie Johnson

4.  Kyle Korver

5.  Jason Terry

 

Point Guard

1.  Mookie Blaylock

2.  Pete Maravich

3.  Doc Rivers

4.  Jeff Teague

5.  Lenny Wilkens

[Diesel]

I can agree with EVERYTHING you said. Chemistry 'can' trump talent but it takes A LOT of chemistry to trump talent. It is rare as well. See Detroit vs Lakers and that is the only time that chemistry has truly trumped talent. Well, also maybe Spurs vs Heat because Miami clearly had better talent but didn't have the chemistry and pedigree of the Spurs.

 

Also, counting old school players and comparing their game is a bit asinine. However, from late 70s on up should be fair game. And we would still lose by a long shot. Even with Shaq and Kareem, look at the twin towers. Kareem didn't have a jumpshot, he had a LETHAL, DEADLY, UNSTOPPABLE, jump hook.

 

All in all, we don't stand a snowballs chance in Hades.

 

Let's revisit...

Chemistry trumping talent.

 

1.  Pistons vs. Lakers.  

2.  Mavs. vs. Heat.

3.  Spurs vs. Heat.

4.  Houston vs. Knicks.

5.  Hawks vs. Magic

6.  Nuggets vs. Sonics (for some of you older heads).

 

Like it or not, when you talk about the Spurs vs. the Heat... the Heat had:  The top three player at their respective positions when they combined Lebron, Wade, and Bosh.  They added to that, very good players like Allen, Miller, even former #1 picks.   The Spurs couldn't match their talent.  I mean, Duncan is the best PF ever.. but Parker on any other team is just ordinary.    Moreover, the year before, the Spurs should have won with less talent.

 

There are some other examples in my listing.   Not to mention that Iverson made it to the finals.

[atlhawks1]

I can agree with EVERYTHING you said. Chemistry 'can' trump talent but it takes A LOT of chemistry to trump talent. It is rare as well. See Detroit vs Lakers and that is the only time that chemistry has truly trumped talent. Well, also maybe Spurs vs Heat because Miami clearly had better talent but didn't have the chemistry and pedigree of the Spurs.

 

Also, counting old school players and comparing their game is a bit asinine. However, from late 70s on up should be fair game. And we would still lose by a long shot. Even with Shaq and Kareem, look at the twin towers. Kareem didn't have a jumpshot, he had a LETHAL, DEADLY, UNSTOPPABLE, jump hook.

 

All in all, we don't stand a snowballs chance in Hades.

 

Appreciate the comments. Ok, if you look at Mutumbo and Roundfield, two of the GREATEST alltime defenders in NBA history, the Hawks WOULD stand a chance. Dominique was under ranked as a defender because thats not was MIke Fratello wanted him to concentrate on. Nique and Roundfield played together are were a awesome defensive front court. Most people dont know that. I think the Hawks could hang with them.

 

 

 

 

 

1979-1980 defensive player of the year, Dan Roundfield:

 

 

Edited July 23, 2015 by atlhawks1

[capstone21]

For rankings, this is how I have it:

 

Centers: 

1.  Deke

2.  Moses Malone

3.  Z. Beaty

4.  W. Bellamy

5.  A. Horford

 

Power Forwards

1.  Bob Petit

2.  Kevin Willis

3.  Millsap

4.  Dan Roundfield

5.  Shareef

 

Small Forwards

1.  Dominique

2.  Cliff Hagan

3.  John Drew

4.  Josh Smith

5.  Al Harrington

 

Shooting Guard

1.  Lou Hudson

2.  Joe Johnson

3.  Fast Eddie Johnson

4.  Kyle Korver

5.  Jason Terry

 

Point Guard

1.  Mookie Blaylock

2.  Pete Maravich

3.  Doc Rivers

4.  Jeff Teague

5.  Lenny Wilkens

First You forgot Steve Smith and second Moses Malone was not that good when he was here ... sure he put up some stats but a lot of rebounds were just hitting the rim a few times so he could get extra ones ... his defense was horrid and he couldn't guard a paper bag.  He even eventually lost his starting job to Jon Koncak in his third season here.  I would take Al and his skill set every day of the year over the past his prime Moses we got.  

[nonono]

can we not count moses and beaty, that is like the clippers or spurs couting nique...just seems odd

 

roundfield should definitely be above millsap, agree with most else though

[atlhawks1]

all time Hawks. I dont count ANYBODY that played the majority of their time before 1970. It is what it is:

 

center:

 

1. mutumbo

2. rollins

3. malone

4. horford

5. koncak

 

power forward:

 

1. roundfield

2. willis

3. rahim

4. sap

5. henderson

 

small forward:

 

1. wilkins

2. drew

3. harrington

4. smith

5. augmon

 

shooting guard:

 

1. Hudson

2. j johnson

3. terry

4. korver

5. wittman

 

point guard:

 

1a. mavarich

1b. mookie

2. rivers

3. teague

4. matthews

Edited July 23, 2015 by atlhawks1

[capstone21]

all time Hawks. I dont count ANYBODY that played the majority of their time before 1970. It is what it is:

 

center:

 

1. mutumbo

2. rollins

3. malone

4. horford

5. koncak

 

power forward:

 

1. roundfield

2. willis

3. rahim

4. sap

5. henderson

 

small forward:

 

1. wilkins

2. drew

3. harrington

4. smith

5. augmon

 

shooting guard:

 

1. Hudson

2. j johnson

3. terry

4. korver

5. wittman

 

point guard:

 

1a. mavarich

1b. mookie

2. rivers

3. teague

4. matthews

You rate Terry and Korver over Steve Smith?

[atlhawks1]

You rate Terry and Korver over Steve Smith?

 

lol, cant remember everybody.................you right, smitty above both of them........

 

 

 

[Diesel]

First You forgot Steve Smith and second Moses Malone was not that good when he was here ... sure he put up some stats but a lot of rebounds were just hitting the rim a few times so he could get extra ones ... his defense was horrid and he couldn't guard a paper bag.  He even eventually lost his starting job to Jon Koncak in his third season here.  I would take Al and his skill set every day of the year over the past his prime Moses we got.  

 

youre right i did forget Smitty.  he goes before Korver.  However, Al still sits behind the three ahead of him.  Maybe Mo drops to 4 but you cant discount stats.

[Diesel]

all time Hawks. I dont count ANYBODY that played the majority of their time before 1970. It is what it is:

 

center:

 

lets make thatba rule... Atlanta Hawks only....  i'll relist.

 

also 3yr guys

or should it be 2?

[capstone21]

youre right i did forget Smitty.  he goes before Korver.  However, Al still sits behind the three ahead of him.  Maybe Mo drops to 4 but you cant discount stats.

Mo didn't make us better ... actually the team got worse when we got rid of Tree ... he really only contributed for one maybe 2 seasons ... Al is glue/chemistry/hard work/defense/rebounding/teamwork/sacrifice for team/consistency/leadership ... its not a coincidence that we started making the playoffs when he joined the team.  He doesn't do the 20/10 but he does so many more things then the old non defensive playing Moses Malone we got ever did.  Moses killed a lot of chemistry (as did Theus) and was a black hole when the ball went into him.  He was about getting his stats but he never ever made an impact for us at all.   Al has had a SIGNIFICANTLY bigger and better impact on the team then Moses Malone did.  There is no way Mo could/should be rated before him.

Edited July 23, 2015 by capstone21

[Diesel]

New thing...  Coach ranks...

 

1.  Bud

2.  Lenny

3.  Fratello

4.  H. Brown

5.  L. Drew

[atlhawks1]

lets make thatba rule... Atlanta Hawks only....  i'll relist.

 

also 3yr guys

or should it be 2?

 

I say 3 years. Lots of guys gave the Hawks 1 or 2 good years. 

[atlhawks1]

New thing...  Coach ranks...

 

1.  Bud

2.  Lenny

3.  Fratello

4.  H. Brown

5.  L. Drew

 

EEEEHHH, based on POTENTIAL, Bud has gotten it. I know, Eastern Conference finals carries a LOT of weight, but, if you going on TENURE and knowledge, i would rank it as below. Dont get me wrong, Bud will come out on top, but i cant do it after just two seasons. Fratello has more wins than Hubie, but Hubie is the man........Heck, Fratello coached UNDER Hubie..In fact, to me, Hubie MIGHT be the best coach ever. He can take a bunch of scrubs and MAKE them play elite basketball.......Bud is in the vicinity, just give him more years to prove it...

 

1. Brown

2. Fratello

3. Wilkins

4. Bud

5. Drew

Edited July 23, 2015 by atlhawks1

[AHF]

Petit is the #3 PF all time if you count Duncan as a PF. He and Duncan are near mirror images with their impact.

Pistol is way overrated. He was an inefficient ball hog whose teams never won anything with him dominating the ball in college or the NBA.

Love Deke but he isn't in the conversation with the greatest centers.

Nique is among the great SFs, with D being the big differentiator.

Lou is a stud.

[Diesel]

EEEEHHH, based on POTENTIAL, Bud has gotten it. I know, Eastern Conference finals carries a LOT of weight, but, if you going on TENURE and knowledge, i would rank it as below. Dont get me wrong, Bud will come out on top, but i cant do it after just two seasons. Fratello has more wins than Hubie, but Hubie is the man........Heck, Fratello coached UNDER Hubie..In fact, to me, Hubie MIGHT be the best coach ever. He can take a bunch of scrubs and MAKE them play elite basketball.......Bud is in the vicinity, just give him more years to prove it...

 

1. Brown

2. Fratello

3. Wilkins

4. Bud

5. Drew

 

I was purely analytical with it.   Bud has the best winning percents... average of 49 wins per season... I know... small population.  Still the first coach to get us to the ECF means a lot to me.  Brown... wasn't as good a coach here.  I almost put Loughery above him.  Moreover, Woody's early years kept him off the list, but his late years which led into Drew's time... were pretty good.

[Diesel]

So Here is my redo following the rules.   (at least 3 years, starting in 1970)

 

Centers: 

1.  Deke

2.  Z Beaty

3.  W. Bellamy

4.  A. Horford

5.  M. Malone

 

Power Forwards

1.  Kevin Willis

2.  Dan Roundfield

3.  Josh Smith

4.  Shareef Abdur Rahim.

5.  Christian Laettner

 

Small Forwards

1.  Dominique

2.  John Drew

3.  Josh Childress

4.  Craig Ehlo

5.  Ty Corbin

 

Shooting Guard

1.  Lou Hudson

2.  Joe Johnson

3. Steve Smith

4.  Kyle Korver

5.  Jason Terry

 

Point Guard

1.  Mookie Blaylock

2.  Pete Maravich

3.  Doc Rivers

4.  Jeff Teague

5.  Mike Bibby

 

Coaches

1.  Bud

2.  Lenny  Wilkens

3.  Mike Fratello

4.  Larry Drew

5.  Hubey Brown

 

Discussions:

Ty Corbin vs. Marvin Williams vs. Cliff Levingston?

Lenny Wilkens vs. Mike Fratello?

Mookie vs. Pistol Pete?

Josh Smith vs. Rahim vs. Laettner vs. Steve Hawes?

Mike Bibby vs. Jason Terry?

 

Honorable mentions:  Spudd Webb, Charlie Criss, Mike Bibby, Tyron Lue, Dwight Jones, Ken Norman, and Alan Henderson.

 

Do we let our hate keep Josh Smith and Joe Johnson from going higher on the list?

 

Is tree Rollins a top 5 Center despite what the stats Say?

Edited July 24, 2015 by Diesel

[Guest]

So Here is my redo following the rules. (at least 3 years, starting in 1970)

Centers:

1. Deke

2. Z Beaty

3. W. Bellamy

4. A. Horford

5. M. Malone

Power Forwards

1. Kevin Willis

2. Dan Roundfield

3. Josh Smith

4. Shareef Abdur Rahim.

5. Christian Laettner

Small Forwards

1. Dominique

2. John Drew

3. Josh Childress

4. Craig Ehlo

5. Ty Corbin

Shooting Guard

1. Lou Hudson

2. Joe Johnson

3. Steve Smith

4. Kyle Korver

5. Jason Terry

Point Guard

1. Mookie Blaylock

2. Pete Maravich

3. Doc Rivers

4. Jeff Teague

5. Mike Bibby

Coaches

1. Bud

2. Lenny Wilkens

3. Mike Fratello

4. Larry Drew

5. Hubey Brown

Discussions:

Ty Corbin vs. Marvin Williams vs. Cliff Levingston?

Lenny Wilkens vs. Mike Fratello?

Mookie vs. Pistol Pete?

Josh Smith vs. Rahim vs. Laettner vs. Steve Hawes?

Mike Bibby vs. Jason Terry?

Honorable mentions: Spudd Webb, Charlie Criss, Mike Bibby, Tyron Lue, Dwight Jones, Ken Norman, and Alan Henderson.

Do we let our hate keep Josh Smith and Joe Johnson from going higher on the list?

Is tree Rollins a top 5 Center despite what the stats Say?

Josh Childress as the 3rd best SF in Hawks history????? That's just sad and wrong.

Stacy Augmon.

And as much as Marvin didn't live up to his draft selection spot I'd definitely take him over Childress.

Edited July 24, 2015 by JayBirdHawk

[Guest]

Josh Childress as the 3rd best SF in Hawks history????? That's just sad and wrong.

Stacy Augmon.

And as much as Marvin didn't live up to his draft selection spot I'd definitely take him over Childress.

Haha omg Childress? Augmon>>>>>>> Childress