Poll: Fox vs Newble! everyone vote!

[Gray Mule]

Force the ball outside to Newble? When J.T. and DerMarr

are already outside just waiting for a chance to sink the

three? Come on, guys. Newble will be one of the three

"Inside" players, banging away and forcing the action

to the outside.

He may be "Just a good bench player" but I'll keep him.

He will make his difference on the defensive side of the

court, not from the three point line and the defense

is what the Hawks really need. If the opponent can't

score, they can't beat you!

I'll still vote Newble. You haven't convinced me yet.

Gray Mule

[Teeareess]

Do you honestly think going 1 for 7 means anything reguarding his ability to become a decent 3 point shooter? 7 shots. If he would've hit a couple more of them (3/7) he'd be a 43 percent shooter. Would that make him a great shooter? The season before he was 4/9. 44% looks pretty good doesn't it?

He was not asked to shoot 3's. He was asked to play shutdown defense against the top opposing perimeter scorer, create passing lanes when SAR and JT are doubled, and stay out of the way. The teams higher winning percentage with him starting proves that he did his job well. The fact that he shot such a high percentage last season shows that he never allowed the defence to dictate what kind of shot he would take. He stayed within his range and within his game. Open 15 footers, garbage layups, fast breaks.

[Diesel]

Again explain it how you like...

The fact that he only took 7 three pt shots should tell you something.

Then you try to place the blame on our offense...

"He was not asked to..."??

Why not?

Ira played in 42 games and started 35... averaged 30.3 mpg. Shot 7 3 pters...

Toni played in 55 games, started in 9.... averaged 25.3 mpg. Shot

171 times from 3.

Glover played in 55 g, started 25... averaged 21 mpg. Shot 91 times from 3.

Why is it that our other Sfs shot so much from three and Ira didn't? It has nothing to do with the offense. It has everything to do with Ira. He cannot shoot from 3.

[Guest Walter]

Diesel responds to my standing his silly characterization of Ira Newble as Ty Corbin on its head by demonstrating Fox is F-A-R more like Ty Corbin than Ira is by saying...

"Your point is not important to the topic..."

Is this the closest thing to Diesel admitting he was wrong ever recorded? I'm not sure. However the distinction is important since he used a proven erroneous comparison to Ty Corbin as an slight to Ira. If being like Ty Corbin is a slight to Diesel, then Rick Fox should now consider himself slighted by Diesel.

Now onto the rest of Diesel's post...

In reply to:

---

"Ira is a defensive specialist whoose offense arises from putbacks and break away layups.

Fox does the same but Fox can also hit from outside."

---

Fox doesn't "(do) the same" because he gets almost just half as many (1.9 to 1.1) offensive rebounds as Ira. He isn't getting put backs without offensive boards!?!?!?!?! Moreover, I don't think I've seen too many break aways from Fox (cough).

In fact, Fox utterly lacks offensive aggressiveness. Even his good defense is about staying in front of his man or denying him the ball. There is nothing wrong with this defense and a team would do well to have players who excell at different types of good defense, but it's simply not aggressive.

Now a good objective way to measure aggressiveness, especially between players at the same position, is to measure their number of FTs per minute played.

Rick Fox only attempted 85 FTAs for the season (during which he played all 82 games). That comes out to 1 FTA every 26.9 MPG! THAT IS HORRIBLE! That's 1 FTA a game for Rick Fox.

Similarly, Newble attempted 88 FTs in 42 games. His FTAs per minute average is 1 FTA for every 14.5 MPG. This is a huge difference as Newble goes to the line TWICE as often as Rick Fox (and converted 9% more last year). One could easily argue from this statistical analysis and simple observation of the two players that Ira was twice as aggressive as Rick Fox was (primarily offensively).

In short, "FOX DOES (NOT) DO THE SAME". Why is this important? I guess if you can't convince the world of the untruth that Ira is like Ty Corbin, you can try to get in the back door by conceeding Fox is F-A-R more like Ty Corbin than Ira, insist the point isn't important, and then add that Fox and Ira are "the same".

I agree that Fox's outside shooting is better (although 31% 3pt shooting is pretty d@mn bad for a guy Shaq and Kobe make WIDE open and not something other teams "respect"), however, I didn't ever accuse that aspect makes him weaker than Newble. What I did say was that the lack of aggressiveness or a "perimeter only" offensive game was weaker (not my word) than Ira and his 50% shooting, slashing, finishing, put back equal scoring.

Ira's cheaper, younger, has more potential much less isn't on the decline, better, better for our team (in that with DJ on the perimeter and JT there or creating for his teamates, we need an aggressive offensive player who slashes, cuts, etc. and doesn't have to have the ball to be effective and efficient offensively), and he plays a thuroughly different style - while playing the same position - offensively and defensively.

W

[Guest]

Sorry that doesn't work.Most every team has that ONE

GUY they want to keep even though he isn't much...

Look at Minnesota acting like Joe Smith is a superstar...

Look at us probably going to keep Hanno even though

we should cut him lose....Look at how teams are gunna

sign Oakley dispite his eroaded basketball skills.

Look at how Detroit keeps Micheal Curry despite the fact

the dude has very little game.

Nice try,but alot of head coaches have these guys they

want to keep even if they shouldn't.George should be

starting over Fox.

Nice try Diesel.

[cyman3]

Newble shot 7 times and made 1. If Alan Henderson shot 2 3-pointers in his life and made all 2, does that make him the best 3 point shooter in the NBA?

He must be better than BIRD in shooting 3s, he shoots it 100%!

C'mon, ive seen Newble shoot the 3 two times. Both times was in a situation where the clock was winding down and he had to hit some RED in order to keep the possession alive.

Other than the 3 point category, Newble is CLEARLY BETTER!