Ring-Brat Brotherhood = Mercenary Basketball Association Era = Race to the Bottom?

[AHF]

57 minutes ago, sturt said:

@sillent, It's not at all the same thing, though. Ainge did what GMs are supposed to do. He didn't actually do anything novel.

Agreed.  No different than Magic, Worthy, Kareem...Bird, McHale, Parish...Jordan, Pippen, Grant/Rodman...etc.  All those teams were put together organically with trades, draft picks, and arms length bargaining.  The whole "let's talk about competing against the team that is currently paying my contract" stuff is a more recent and much more sinister development for competitive balance in the league.

[Royjr9]

1 hour ago, AHF said:

Agreed.  No different than Magic, Worthy, Kareem...Bird, McHale, Parish...Jordan, Pippen, Grant/Rodman...etc.  All those teams were put together organically with trades, draft picks, and arms length bargaining.  The whole "let's talk about competing against the team that is currently paying my contract" stuff is a more recent and much more sinister development for competitive balance in the league.

I give you the easy way argument although I contend he didn’t see himself winning with what okc laid in front of him and to some degree him and Westbrook dynamic.  Also I don’t blame the players  an organization will trade there ass as soon as it’s benificial to them. What LA did to Blake if I were him I’d be pissed the mantra of shut up and play is kinda played out. Same thing with illysova I was pissed but I don’t blame him that he balked when they even mentioned trading him to a place he didn’t want to go. 

[AHF]

Just now, Royjr9 said:

I give you the easy way argument although I contend he didn’t see himself winning with what okc laid in front of him and to some degree him and Westbrook dynamic.  Also I don’t blame the players  an organization will trade there ass as soon as it’s benificial to them. What LA did to Blake if I were him I’d be pissed the mantra of shut up and play is kinda played out. Same thing with illysova I was pissed but I don’t blame him that he balked when they even mentioned trading him to a place he didn’t want to go. 

We are conflating a few issues here.

First, we have a system issue for the league.  The players today have the right to go whereever they want in FA for whatever price they can negotiate subject to the league salary rules.  The max salary rule is a huge problem because it allows teams to stack multiple MVP level players on the same roster for approximately the same price as a Joe Johnson type player.  The league also currently has zero intention of enforcing rules prohibiting players from colluding about future team-ups while they are under contract.  All that is a system problem that leads to stacking of teams which both disenfranchises many teams from even becoming viable and also sidelines would-be competitors into clear also-ran status.  The players aren't to blame for this systemic issue - that is a function of the league and union and they need to fix it because it erodes fan interest when the perception is that the playing field isn't level.  Whether the playing field is being unleveled by the players or management isn't the issue - it is a fundamental fairness concern for the entire NBA product.

Second, players have the right to absolutely pick what teams they go to but fan backlash is going to be something they have to live with.  That backlash is not the same as "shut up and play."  When a guy like KG is winning in the WCF 3-1 against a team and then plays poorly and ends up loosing the series 3-4 and then joins the defending NBA champs that beat him there is nothing demeaning about fan backlash.  He backed down from a challenge and that affects the perception of him as a competitor and rightfully so.  Players do run the risk of getting traded like Blake but that isn't an issue for a guy like KD because he has the leverage to negotiate a no-trade clause.  Even guys like Ilyasova can get that protection so it isn't impossible by any means.  Pity the players who don't have that leverage when they get dumped like Boston dumped IT but don't excuse someone like KD because of that.

Third, how can you argue that Oklahoma had no chance of winning if KD stayed?  They made their second conference final in 3 years (after previously making the finals) and literally had the series against GS in their hand and coughed it up.  A big reason they coughed it up was that Durant shot 38% from the floor on 31 attempts and 27% from 3pt range in Game 5 and then 32% from the floor on 31 FGA and 12.5% from 3pt range at home in Game 6.  They were up 3-1 and spit the bit.  How much more viable as a contender can you get than that? 

[Royjr9]

28 minutes ago, AHF said:

We are conflating a few issues here.

First, we have a system issue for the league.  The players today have the right to go whereever they want in FA for whatever price they can negotiate subject to the league salary rules.  The max salary rule is a huge problem because it allows teams to stack multiple MVP level players on the same roster for approximately the same price as a Joe Johnson type player.  The league also currently has zero intention of enforcing rules prohibiting players from colluding about future team-ups while they are under contract.  All that is a system problem that leads to stacking of teams which both disenfranchises many teams from even becoming viable and also sidelines would-be competitors into clear also-ran status.  The players aren't to blame for this systemic issue - that is a function of the league and union and they need to fix it because it erodes fan interest when the perception is that the playing field isn't level.  Whether the playing field is being unleveled by the players or management isn't the issue - it is a fundamental fairness concern for the entire NBA product.

Second, players have the right to absolutely pick what teams they go to but fan backlash is going to be something they have to live with.  That backlash is not the same as "shut up and play."  When a guy like KG is winning in the WCF 3-1 against a team and then plays poorly and ends up loosing the series 3-4 and then joins the defending NBA champs that beat him there is nothing demeaning about fan backlash.  He backed down from a challenge and that affects the perception of him as a competitor and rightfully so.  Players do run the risk of getting traded like Blake but that isn't an issue for a guy like KD because he has the leverage to negotiate a no-trade clause.  Even guys like Ilyasova can get that protection so it isn't impossible by any means.  Pity the players who don't have that leverage when they get dumped like Boston dumped IT but don't excuse someone like KD because of that.

Third, how can you argue that Oklahoma had no chance of winning if KD stayed?  They made their second conference final in 3 years (after previously making the finals) and literally had the series against GS in their hand and coughed it up.  A big reason they coughed it up was that Durant shot 38% from the floor on 31 attempts and 27% from 3pt range in Game 5 and then 32% from the floor on 31 FGA and 12.5% from 3pt range at home in Game 6.  They were up 3-1 and spit the bit.  How much more viable as a contender can you get than that? 

Yes it’s a system issue. But it’s also on the owners I feel bad for Davis if he leaves New Orleans then he’s a bad guy,if he stays he’s foolish there’s no middle ground given. 

No trade clause are hard to come by. The problem was the short term deal signed. 

I didn’t say they didn’t have a chance. Everybody knows they choked but obviously something wasn’t rosy in OKC. Given the circumstances Anybody else in the same position would do the same. You aren’t going to exactly sign with the kings in that situation. 

[AHF]

1 hour ago, Royjr9 said:

Yes it’s a system issue. But it’s also on the owners I feel bad for Davis if he leaves New Orleans then he’s a bad guy,if he stays he’s foolish there’s no middle ground given. 

No trade clause are hard to come by. The problem was the short term deal signed. 

I didn’t say they didn’t have a chance. Everybody knows they choked but obviously something wasn’t rosy in OKC. Given the circumstances Anybody else in the same position would do the same. You aren’t going to exactly sign with the kings in that situation. 

Davis leaving NY will not be a problem.  Their management has been hit garbage.  If he signs with a team that isn’t already on the precipice of a title without him nobody will bark.  They haven’t made the finals already. They have surrounded him with garbage over the years.  Gross incompetence.