REHawksFan

Joker effect

Trae hits 3 in a row then doesn't take the next 4 shots as teammates brick. SMH

Disinterested.

Too many jump shots. Denver made their run when Hawks stopped going inside and started missing all their jumpers. Gotta get back to pts in the paint. Trae floater. JC in the paint Clint boarding Bogie driving

From the Athletic: Rajon Rondo headed to the Clippers, Lou Williams to Atlanta The Hawks and Clippers are finalizing a deal to send Rajon Rondo to L.A. for Lou Williams, two second-round picks and cash, sources tell The Athletic. — Shams Charania and Sam Amick Go ahead and make your wings jokes. In this Lou Williams-Rajon Rondo trade, I’m thinking about Rondo playing for the Celtics while Tyronn Lue was an assistant there. He trusts Rondo and wants the playmaker Rondo for the playoffs (which is why there is such a thing as “playoff Rondo.” And I am thinking about Williams, having a down year, not getting as many touches and as many minutes, and being told the reason was the Clippers were preserving him for the playoffs. Guess not. — Joe Vardon So here’s the backstory on this Lou Williams-Rajon Rondo deal: During the offseason, when the Clippers were still stinging from their playoff collapse against Denver, rival executives were well aware that Williams was very available. This, of course, surprised no one. Not only had he not played well during the bubble experience, but his well-chronicled trip to the Magic City gentlemen’s club in Atlanta in July was the kind of distraction that left him on the outs in terms of his vibe with the organization. And while that dynamic had improved quite a bit since then, the Clippers still wanted to upgrade their roster with a playmaker. Enter Rondo, who cost them two second-rounders in addition to Williams to land. Yet while Rondo will certainly bring a defensive reputation that Williams doesn’t have as well as his championship credentials, the Clippers still lose their fourth-leading scorer (12.1 points per game) and third-leading assist man (3.4 per). Rondo, meanwhile, will leave an unfulfilling legacy in Atlanta. He played in just 27 games because of injuries, averaging 3.9 points, 3.5 assists and 14.9 minutes per game. The Clippers, clearly, are counting on “Playoff Rondo” making a well-timed return when it matters most. — Sam Amick It’s absolutely hilarious that the Hawks’ worst offseason move just turned into an elite sixth man, two second-round picks and cash. No, I don’t understand the Clippers’ interest in Rajon Rondo, especially at the cost of a pretty good player in Lou Williams, and I’m amazed that Atlanta was able to blast itself out of the deal while actually receiving assets in return. I have a running joke with my fellow Atlanta-based colleague Chris Kirchner that nobody in the NBA actually watches the Hawks, one that we hatched after Damian Jones, Jeff Teague and DeAndre’ Bembry all got guaranteed money this offseason. But seriously … did the Clippers watch the Hawks this year? I’m trying to imagine myself as a fly on the wall as the Clippers offered one second and cash for Rondo and the Hawks, suppressing chuckles, were like “no, that’s not enough.” OK, let me try to put myself in the Clippers’ shoes and argue for this deal. The glass half-full perspective for the Clips requires a belief in “Playoff Rondo,” the guy who showed in the bubble for the Lakers last season after being only mildly effective over the course of the regular season. Rondo does have a well-earned history of outperforming his regular-season numbers in the playoffs, but his regular-season numbers this year were also bad enough that he’d have to outperform them by a pretty massive extent this time around. Certainly L.A. has long felt it needs another offensive organizer to take some of the heavy lifting out of Kawhi Leonard’s and Paul George’s hands, and that’s not something that their other small guards (Patrick Beverley, Reggie Jackson, Luke Kennard) have in their toolset. L.A.’s locker-room leadership has also been …. questioned, let’s say … and Rondo can certainly help them there as well. And, of course, in L.A.’s win-now mindset, what is two seconds and cash when you already surrendered five firsts to open this window in the first place. But wow, does this feel like a reach. Start with the fact that the 35-year-old Rondo is also owed $7.5 million next year, and that money will be a significant drag on the Clippers because it takes them out of any hope of using their full mid-level exception. Between his struggles this season and the money he’s owed a year from now, you’d think the Hawks would be the ones incentivizing the deal with picks, not the other way around. (Atlanta, by the way, will receive second rounders in 2023 and 2027; the 2023 second is Portland’s). As for Williams, one can certainly agree that he hasn’t made quite his usual impact this season. He may be slowing down at 34, and his defensive shortcomings were likely to render him a major liability in the playoffs. He is the match to Trae Young’s gasoline on defense if the Hawks ever try playing the two of them together. Nonetheless, in a bench role he may be a nice fit for an Atlanta team whose offense goes off the rails any time Young checks out of the game. Getting off Rondo’s money for next year is also a big deal for Atlanta’s cap scenarios, as it opens up the possibility of using their full midlevel exception and still paying John Collins. And if Collins walks, of course, they could have more than $20 million in cap room to chase a replacement. Walking out of the deal with that kind of flexibility plus draft picks makes this one a home run for Atlanta. — John Hollinger

With the way the cap works, does this mean the Hawks could go out and sign a guy in FA for $21,000,000 per year AND THEN match an offer for JC, even a max offer? Do they actually have $21M or is that before JC's cap hold? @thecampster

Mays is solid. I got no complaints about him. But I view him more as a developmental player than a guy ready to play crunch time minutes on a regular basis. He's fine on occasion right now and in certain situations, but do I want him playing every night during the last 5 minutes of the 3rd in a close game? Nope.

Not only that but 17 points in the 3rd quarter ain't gonna cut it. They only gave up 28 which isn't terrible for an offense as good as Kings. The Hawks offense blew it and it started late in the 3rd. The last 5 minutes of the 3rd were terrible. 3.5 of those saw Trae on the bench with no real PG leader on the court. Begs the question now that Rondo is gone, who's going to back up Trae? Lou?

I've always like Lou (even though he's a poor man's Jamal Crawford, imo) but I don't see the fit with this team. We'll see how it all works out but I could see him disrupting things without contributing anything.

It doesn't make sense to acquire Lou. Would have to be the 3rd team option I would think. Lou gives us nothing at this point.

Shams says Lou Williams

And you and I both know that was a Hail Mary by the Clippers. They ain't putting their hopes of a win on Luke Kennard and Terrance Mann on a regular basis. They rely on their stars. Absolutely. I agree. And like I said, he's still learning. He still has to figure it all out. With Nate at the helm, the hope is he gets excellent PG coaching and will continue to get better at knowing when is his time and when isn't.

Agree 100%. He's still learning. And for the shot last night, it seemed to me like he thought his floater going in a few times in a row would give him confidence to see the 3 ball go in. It obviously didn't. I thought that was a dumb decision as well. But that dumb decision does not negate the fact that the 3 ball is a huge part of his game so he can't just abandon it all together even if it's not going in for a stretch.

Because he gets to the the line so much when he's attacking (which is what we are advocating for), he's the most efficient scorer on the team despite having a relatively average FG%. That's part of what makes him so dynamic as a player. He can attack and put pressure on the defense and then kick out to teammates. What gets lost in this whole debate is he's still Top 3 in the NBA in assists so it's not like he's ignoring his teammates. He's still going to get them involved. He just has to walk that line of knowing when to take over and when to get them involved. He's still learning in that regard.

Of course it makes sense. And in theory, I don't agree with that. The problem, that several of us have stated over and over again, is that the guys that we need to rely on, ARE NOT CONSISTENT. You yourself have argued that Bogie shouldn't even play let alone get major minutes because he's struggled so much. And yet last night he was 7-11 for 20 pts. You have advocated for Keven to play more at times and then benched at times. Why? Because he's so inconsistent. He's equally likely to go 4-7 from 3pt as he is 1-9. The same is said for Cam when he's healthy and even Gallo. I agree that when Trae is off like last night, he shouldn't take 7 3pt shots. But he's not often off like that. And my position is that when he is, he needs to attack the rim just like he did last night and use his floater to score. Even you have to agree that the only reason the Hawks were in the game in the 4th was because Trae was aggressive in his scoring and attacking. Yes, I agree he took too many 3's last night (only because he was struggling), but I'll also say I have confidence that even if he misses the first 6, the 7th will go in. He's that kind of player. You say he isn't a superstar yet. And you are probably right. But the Hawks have built a team around him that more often than not NEEDS him to be a superstar for it to have consistent success. That's just the reality of where we are from my vantage point.

LOL. Man, you can scream this from the tallest building but your other words contradict yourself. You say, "All I care about is winning" You say, "I have no agenda. Just win." BUT.... You reject any and all talk of the data that actually shows HOW the Hawks win. You care not for what style or method of play actually produces those wins you say you want. And you criticize and mock anyone that wants to support winning with data (which is oddly your agenda). You say you don't want Trae to be the scoring superstar, just win. But you reject and readily dismiss the FACTS that the Hawks are 14-7 when he scores 28 pts or more and 8-15 when scores less than 28 pts. You don't care that in the games the Hawks win, he avgs 29.3 pts AND 8.7 assists while in the games the Hawks lose, he avgs only 22.0 pts while still getting 10.1 assists. You can't say, "ALL I care about is winning" while simultaneously arguing vehemently AGAINST Trae being a scoring superstar. Your AGENDA is that you want the Hawks to win without Trae scoring or being the superstar. But the problem with that is the Hawks CONSTRUCTED this team with Trae as the Sun. Everyone else revolves around him, but he's the central point. That's why they NEED him to be a superstar to have ultimate success.

SMH. You one of those dudes that goes down swinging no matter how wrong you are. I get it. Nothing anybody says gonna change your mind. It's all good. We all want Hawks to win. You keep rationalizing to make your agenda felt. That's fine. You focus on the 3 games against Houston, Cleveland, and Lakers. I'll continue to look at the landscape of the entire season and how games have played out. Bottom line is Hawks need Trae to be the superstar that he is if they want to have the best chance at a W in any given game. Doesn't mean they can't win occasionally without him. But more times than not, they aren't winning if Trae struggles.

If that were true you would recognize and admit that the Hawks have the best chance to win any given game when Trae plays scores instead of just being a facilitator. That means Trae scoring AND distributing to teammates. But also it means recognizing just what @TheNorthCydeRises and @JayBirdHawk have said that the supporting cast around Trae is inconsistent to the point that most nights they still NEED him to score a bunch to win.

First of all, you are moving the goalposts and changing your argument. Do you want him to stop shooting 3's all together or just the deep 3's? Make up your mind. And yes, he's in a massive slump. I agree. But it's still a part of his game. How's he going to get out of that slump if he doesn't keep shooting 3's??

I'm sorry spud but you haven't proven anything except that you continually ignore what is convenient and only talk about the few examples that support your agenda. You think winning TWO games out of 22 when Trae doesn't score proves we are wrong when there's about 35 games (wins and losses) that prove we are right. Hell, last night when you weren't around the Hawks were LOSING by double digits while Trae wasn't scoring and it wasn't until he took the over when his shot started falling that they came back to tie the game.

Trae has taken 54 30+ foot shots in 42 games on the season. I mean, come on. People attach themselves to a narrative and won't let it go.

Yeah. And? The "EARLY SHOT CLOCK ATTEMPTS" are the problem. We've all said that. It's not the deep 3's that you are talking about. He's taken deep 3's well into the shot clock far more than early clock shots.

Sounds like an awful lot of supposition to me. You got any evidence to support any of that?

So he should only take lower % shots? That's a pretty dumb strategy to me. Also, what does playing defense or not have to do with shot selection?

Such a weird take. He makes a higher % of the deep 3's than he does the standard 3's. He's 37% on shots 30+ feet and only 35% on shots between 25-30 feet.