My assessment after some reflection

[Jdawgflow]

I have just been inspired to start my first thread in quite some time. A couple of things.

1- School and Xmas break have done a good job of keeping me away from the Hawks. Thankfully, I did not have much time to think about our losing streak. But now I am back. The players must have known I have started watching again.

2- Watching tonight and the Boston game made me realize we actually do have some talented players. I can honestly see what BK was trying to do with this team. That zone is great when we have all five guys hustling and playing hard. It helps to have many long, athletic players. We can really disrupt the passing lanes and grab rebounds when these guys work as a unit.

3- The problem with BK's vision is that for it to work it requires a tall, strong, quick, distributing, fastbreaking PG that can spot up and a physical C that can score in the post (Let's just say this is my vision of what his vision should be...but I am guessing that BK does not envision my vision of his vision working...and to this I say "it cannot be any worse than what we have done").

4- Speedy was doing pretty good when healthy (which is seldom unfortunately) in playing the PG role, except for the tall, strong, and spot up part. I feel that Ivey and Chill (like Diesel said) are our best option right now at the one, though. We have great ball movement with them in and they both hustle and can switch on screens with other players. Lo is also doing a better job of being the starting center that we need because he will pound people. He just can't score much (...lets not even talk about FT). Zaza is much more suited to coming off the bench IMO.

5- I think Woody is finally figuring out how to use our players. This group we have right now play really good together. This leads me to thinking that we should try and trade Lue. Many think this would be tanking, but I feel that we would actually play better because Lue, while good, just tries to do too much by himself. If we can get a pick, some financial relief, and/or a prospect I think it would be worth it. A trade with the Heat or Lakers comes to mind. I would personally prefer the Lakers. Trading with Seattle for Ridnour would also be a possibility. He could be a good option, too.

6- Like I said, I like our lineup right now.

Ivey can be described as solid. He hustles, tries hard, and ALWAYS plays D. If he can keep giving good minutes and make some shots, he will be okay.

JJ is our main man. I like the way he does his thing and always plays hard. He is not selfish and keeps everyone involved.

Marvin is struggling right now shooting, but he is trying to do the little things to make up for it. I know this is not what I, or many others expected, but at least he is contributing. His shots will start to fall if he quits the off balance junk. And he needs to start driving with authority again.

JS is the heart and soul of this team right now. His impact is obvious now and is much greater than what I thought. He is letting the game come to him and is not forcing shots. It is beautiful to see. He outplayed KG tonight IMO. If he can keep this up, we have a chance.

Lo is doing a good job of being physical and setting the tone. He can't shoot FT at all, but he can do, and is doing, what we need better than any other big on the roster at the starting center spot. He doesn't need too many minutes, just good minutes.

Chill is the third best player on our team. He brings the energy that we need night in and night out. He is a leader and stand up person (it seems). He is much more athletic than most give him credit for. His shooting is also making JJ's life much easier because he actually hits open shots. That is why he is so good IMO, he just knows where to be on the court.

Zaza is a great backup center. This is the spot he needs to stay in. With limited time, Zaza plays much smarter, more physical, and actually shares the ball. He is also not hesitating as much to take the open 15 footer. When he was starting, he got cocky IMO. That turned him into a black hole TO machine (not sure how he can be both, but it fits...come on, work with me people ). Woody did a good job with this move.

Shelden is not getting as much burn as I thought. He is doing a good job of playing his role, but he needs to step it up with his scoring. Personally, I think he lacks confidence right now (the same could be said for Marvin, too).

Salim is getting too many minutes right now. I would only play him if we are in need of scoring because no one else can make a basket. Salim reminds me of Lue with his idea of emphasizing the "point" in point guard. I will give him credit that he at least tries on defense now.

Solomon will be very good for us when he bulks up. He already can provide much needed energy. For now, that should be his role. Provide energy with blocks and rebounds (and occasional baskets) when we have bigs in foul trouble or playing horrible.

Este also deserves some PT periodically IMO. He is a bruiser that can provide the physical presence that is sometimes needed to remind the other team that we mean business.

7- I am hoping to go to the game on Jan 27th and am interested to find out if anyone wants to try and meet up at some point. Lascar has already contacted me, but it would be fun to meet some more Squawkers.

[vdunkndunk]

I agree...we should try and trade Lue to the Lakers for a late first round pick, and Speedy to Miami or another team that needs PG help...not sure that anyone would be interested in Speedy at the moment, though.

I'm one of those people who thinks the importance of the PG in the NBA is a little overrated, and whether or not you agree with me on that one, it seems clear that we are playing better as a team without Speedy or Lue at the moment.

For one thing, I think both of our veteran PG's dribble and shoot too much, and I like to see the ball moving around more.

Plus, when we have Joe, Chill, Smoove, and Marvin on the court at the same time, we're really long and athletic and versatile (just like BK's vision, I guess), and we're tough to handle on the boards and in transition, and we play a mean zone. And so far, the PG by committee approach hasn't really hurt us.

Then we could continue our search for a PG that would fit better with our team (maybe Jarvis C. from Tech with Indy's pick?).

Maybe I'm just overreacting to what we've seen the last 3 games, but I like having all our long athletic swingmen on the court at the same time. And I've felt the offensive chemistry with Speedy has been screwy for the entire season so far. Lue is a leader and hits big shots, but if we could get the Lakers' pick for him, it seems like maybe we should think about it. And getting rid of Speedy seems like a no-brainer, if only to lose that contract of his.

[Jdawgflow]

I do agree that Speedy might need to be traded IF he cannot stay healthy. But then who would want him anyways? That is the tough part. He can be good for us IF he can play all out for the whole year.

[KB21]

It's all about the defense. That's the common thread in the Hawks three game winning streak and pretty much the month of January at this point. When this team decides that they want to play defense, they can and will win some games. The problem seems to be getting that consistent effort on defense.

Offensively, this team has 31 assists tonight. That has to be a game high for the Hawks this season. It shows me that we are passing the ball around trying to get a good shot. When you don't have a point guard that can dictate the tempo, you have to let the motion of the offense dictate the tempo of the game. I didn't see the game, but I can't believe that there were very many isolation plays with this team getting 31 assists. Salim even got 5 assists while playing 16 minutes. He had one fewer assist than attempted field goals in this game. That's pretty remarkable for Salim. As I was driving home from the clinic today, I was honestly thinking about whether I thought the Hawks should try to deal Salim to the Grizzlies for Chucky Atkins, a point guard that will play some defense.

[vdunkndunk]

Not only did we get all those assists, but I think we also had a season low in turnovers (or close to it).

[Popeye]

This was a perfect game and everybody played well, but HOW WILL WE COME OUT TO PLAY AGAINST BOBCATS TOMORROW?

Big question,

We got to be consistent, it's hard to get 31 assist and only 9 TO in every game.

[Swatguy]

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I agree...we should try and trade Lue to the Lakers for a late first round pick, and Speedy to Miami or another team that needs PG help...not sure that anyone would be interested in Speedy at the moment, though.

I'm one of those people who thinks the importance of the PG in the NBA is a little overrated, and whether or not you agree with me on that one, it seems clear that we are playing better as a team without Speedy or Lue at the moment.

For one thing, I think both of our veteran PG's dribble and shoot too much, and I like to see the ball moving around more.

Plus, when we have Joe, Chill, Smoove, and Marvin on the court at the same time, we're really long and athletic and versatile (just like BK's vision, I guess), and we're tough to handle on the boards and in transition, and we play a mean zone. And so far, the PG by committee approach hasn't really hurt us.

Then we could continue our search for a PG that would fit better with our team (maybe Jarvis C. from Tech with Indy's pick?).

Maybe I'm just overreacting to what we've seen the last 3 games, but I like having all our long athletic swingmen on the court at the same time. And I've felt the offensive chemistry with Speedy has been screwy for the entire season so far. Lue is a leader and hits big shots, but if we could get the Lakers' pick for him, it seems like maybe we should think about it. And getting rid of Speedy seems like a no-brainer, if only to lose that contract of his.

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Javaris will be a low pick. someone may reach and get him as low as 5. I don't know if anyone will trade for speedy while hurt or as often he is. I would hate to see Lue traded because of his obvious abilities and his leadership. Lue IS the Leader of this team. Josh will be but Ty Lue is the locker room/bench/clutch on the floor shooter leader of this team. Behind JJ no one is better to shoot in the clutch on this team.

[TheDude]

and whats up with Salim? His new nickname should be MrFrownNMurmur.....something goes wrong, especially if someone else is responsible and he frowns and murmurs under his breath.....relax Salim.

[Swatguy]

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and whats up with Salim? His new nickname should be MrFrownNMurmur.....something goes wrong, especially if someone else is responsible and he frowns and murmurs under his breath.....relax Salim.

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Salim is possible the most competative dude on earth. Off the court he is calm and unassuming. His game face is always intense.

[Johnnybravo4]

I disagree on your assesment of Salim. He is the only point on the squad who actually wants to run and start a fast break. He had a couple of good fast break points last night including a steal and a coast to coast stop and pop which should have been on Sportcenter.

[vdunkndunk]

Salim is looking a little better lately. He obviously has talent, but he also has some pretty big limitations.

On the plus side, he's quick, explosive, athletic, and has a lightening release on his jump shot. He can also finish around the rim fairly well for a player his size.

On the minus side, he's small, doesn't handle the ball well enough, makes too many mistakes, and is streaky (partly because he takes too many tough shots).

If he could limit his turnovers, improve his defense, and take better shots, and improve his passing and ballhandling, he could be a solid player off the bench.

[Johnnybravo4]

I still don't know where this bad handles stuff comes from. He handles the ball damn well. He brings the ball up court under pressure and he can blow by 99% of the points that guard him. My only criticism of Salim is his shot selection of times. He tends to shoot while on the move unstead of taking a rhythm dribble setting his feet and shooting. When he is allowed to set his feet he is almost automatic. I think that he could run the rack in a 3 point competition, but because of his shot selection he wouldn't get invited.

But some of you folks act as if Salim is the worst player on the team, which is insane.

[bfwolf]

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Salim is looking a little better lately. He obviously has talent, but he also has some pretty big limitations.

On the plus side, he's quick, explosive, athletic, and has a lightening release on his jump shot. He can also finish around the rim fairly well for a player his size.

On the minus side, he's small, doesn't handle the ball well enough, makes too many mistakes, and is streaky (partly because he takes too many tough shots).

If he could limit his turnovers, improve his defense, and take better shots, and improve his passing and ballhandling, he could be a solid player off the bench.

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I guess I disagree with pretty much all the things you list as strengths for Salim. For an NBA guard (especially an NBA point guard), I don't consider him quick, explosive, or athletic. I think he's average to below average in all these categories. I also believe he has a rather slow release due to a funny little double-clutch he does on his shot. As for his play around the rim, I've never seen him take a shot around the rim, so I'm not sure I can comment. He does, however, have the ability to hit the pull up floating jump shot in the 10-12 foot range which is a plus.

[Johnnybravo4]

You obviously don't watch a lot of games then.

[bfwolf]

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You obviously don't watch a lot of games then.

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I have the NBA League Pass and have watched a majority of the Hawks games this year. My opinion is my opinion. You don't have to agree.

[PlayaPat420]

do you watch? because i've watched every Hawks game since Salim has been here (as well as years many many years before so) and i would have to agree. he is not explosive nor athletic. he is a streaky jump shooter who NEVER goes to the rim, falls away or leans in on every jump shot and a poor defender. and turnover prone.

and im not even a Salim hater, thats just what he is.

[Swatguy]

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I guess I disagree with pretty much all the things you list as strengths for Salim. For an NBA guard (especially an NBA point guard), I don't consider him quick, explosive, or athletic. I think he's average to below average in all these categories. I also believe he has a rather slow release due to a funny little double-clutch he does on his shot. As for his play around the rim, I've never seen him take a shot around the rim, so I'm not sure I can comment. He does, however, have the ability to hit the pull up floating jump shot in the 10-12 foot range which is a plus.

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You gotta be kidding or something. Salim is certainly athletic, quick and fast. To say he has not a quick shot is ridiculous, you must be confused with someone else. Take a look at the picture of the sports section of the AJC, ah he went to the rim with authority. Look for your self.

[bfwolf]

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I guess I disagree with pretty much all the things you list as strengths for Salim. For an NBA guard (especially an NBA point guard), I don't consider him quick, explosive, or athletic. I think he's average to below average in all these categories. I also believe he has a rather slow release due to a funny little double-clutch he does on his shot. As for his play around the rim, I've never seen him take a shot around the rim, so I'm not sure I can comment. He does, however, have the ability to hit the pull up floating jump shot in the 10-12 foot range which is a plus.

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You gotta be kidding or something. Salim is certainly athletic, quick and fast. To say he has not a quick shot is ridiculous, you must be confused with someone else. Take a look at the picture of the sports section of the AJC, ah he went to the rim with authority. Look for your self.

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Sorry, I don't see it. Is he quick vs. an average NBA player? Sure. Is he quick vs. an average NBA guard? Not really. Is he quick vs. an average NBA point guard? Absolutely not. And what exactly are you calling athleticism. Does he have an incredible verticle leap that I'm not aware of? Or is it something else that I'm missing? And please take a look at his shot during the next game. He has a funny little double clutch on his outside shot that slows it down. I'm not sure this is any sort of real weakness in his game since he's really only effective as an outside shooter when he's wide open anyway, but I don't think qualifying it as a quick release is accurate.

[Johnnybravo4]

He has a decent vertical. I have seen him dunk with 2 hands on occasion. And he should go to the rim more, but when he does he does so with a nice touch. To me he is just as good as JT was when he was here, it is just that he doesn't get the minutes.