Why Van Gundy turned Cleveland down

[Guest]

http://www.nypost.com/sports/58287.htm

" Let's start with the Cavaliers. Everything appeared to going smoothly regarding Van Gundy's hiring until Paxson tried to undermine his coach before he was even hired.

"Are you a man of your word?" Paxson asked.

"Yes, I am. But what are you talking about?"

"What I mean is, if you make an agreement to play certain players a number of minutes will you abide by it?" Paxson explained, obviously referring to LeBron James and the importance of him seeing quantity daylight so management can market him.

"I'm a coach," Van Gundy replied, angrily. "I don't make agreements like that. I play the players the amount of minutes they deserve to play."

Yesterday, Van Gundy alerted at least three confidants he is now officially a Cav-Not. "

Also read about Rick C...There was without a doubt some

big problems that caused him to get fired.

[KB21]

And that's why the Cavs aren't going to be winning anytime soon. Their GM is hands down the worst in the NBA, and their priorities are all in the wrong place.

I can't believe that Silas took that job.

[Guest]

If thy throw LaBron out there to the loins to quick he

could suffer....It's [censored] that he ends up in Cleveland.

I also don't understand why Paul took the job...I

thought he had alittle more self respect than that.

[chillzatl]

he's a good coach, they offered the money and he took it. It doesn't hurt that they can also dangle the possibility of being the guy who coaches one of the NBA's biggest future stars to becoming a leader and champion.

I definitely think there were better opportunities for him. But money and the chance to win behind a superstar is powerful bait for anyone.

[Boondocks]

Well I love Paul Silas, but I despise the management of the cleveland cadavers.

They practically gave away Person and Murray, while trading Miller for Miles looked like a wrong trade at the time as well.

I just hope Silas gets the better end of the stick this time, and isn't a sacrificial lamb while cleveland gets it act together.

[KB21]

This is a decision that may ultimately hurt Silas's long term career.

This is a team that will have an 18 year old Lebron James and an injury prone Zydrunas Ilgauskas as it's best players after the draft. They have an unknown in Dejaun Wagner. Is he going to be a point guard or a shooting guard for them? Will James play point guard or shooting guard? Where will Ricky Davis end up?

Too many questions and not enough answers. Darius Miles and Carlos Boozer are role players. Chris Mihm is a fringe NBA player, and Desagana Diop is wasted size at this point.

Chances are, the forced starting line up for the Cavs will be

PG - Dejaun Wagner

SG - Lebron James

SF - Darius Miles

PF - Carlos Boozer

C - Zydrunas Ilgauskas

If they can't move Ricky Davis, there will be a lot of internal strife on that team.

[TJ_Swann]

If they don't trade him Ricky's got game to get playing time if the Manangement does right. The two interesting players I'll watch or try to watch are Wagner and Miles. Miles' growth is already stunted. What will become of Wagner?

[Traceman]

I read another report where Van Gundy says that Paxson never said that and that LeBron's PT never came up during their meeting. All these rumors are out there floating around but only about half of them (if that many) are true.

It's just like the Carlisle situation. Some rumors say it was Dumars, some say it was the owner and some say Carlisle is an inflexible a-hole who treated players, staff and management poorly. I'm sure the truth is somewhere in the middle.

[Guest]

That made that decision. I'm not a Pistons fan, but I follow the L pretty closely, and what he's been able to do and the method in which he's gone about building that team have earned my respect. However, I thought that the firing of Carlisle was an abomination, a truly low-class thing to do. It sent all sorts of wrong signals about trust and loyalty - things Dumars possessed as a player and appeared to as a GM.

Carlisle did great there. He didn't deserve what he got. I'm not faulting Brown really, it wasn't a situation he created. Regardless, I truly hope that Dumars did not play an intergral part in the firing of Carlisle.

[Traceman]

However, whether or not he made the final decision is questionable. I don't think there is any question regarding whether or not Carlisle is a good coach ON THE FLOOR. Back to back 50 win seasons, an NBA Coach of the Year Award and a spot in the EC Finals with marginal talent is more than enough proof that the guy can coach. But for an NBA coach, coaching is only 1 part of the job. IF Carlisle truly was rude to the players, management and even the support staff of the Pistons organization on a regular basis PLUS he had a different vision than Dumars did with regard to how the team should play, it is not surprising to me that the team would go in a different direction and that Dumars would bless this decision. Dumars really liked the team's defensive intensity but he felt that offensively, they could have been a LOT better (I don't know if he was right about that or not because I don't see a lot of offensive talent on that team). If Carlisle's vision had differed from Dumars' vision but he (Carlisle) still got along with everybody, he would probably still be the coach. But apparently, that was not the case.

From what I'm hearing, a lot of the Piston's fans DO blame Dumars and they are not happy. It will be interesting to see what happens in Detroit. If they go to the Finals after getting Darko, everyone will say that Carlisle would have got them there too with Darko. If they fall short of the Finals, everyone will say that Carlisle would have taken them to the Finals. All I know is that Dumars and Brown are going to be under a microscope from Day 1.

[Guest]

Who really cares if he alienated upper mgt. If he alienated the players, or seemed aloof to them, I'm not sure that it really matters as long as they accepted his decisions. I mean, with the phone calls for seasonal awards to Corliss (amongst others, including Barry, Tashauyn, etc.) not bitching about their roles ~ be them on the bench or whatever, they players obviously came into each game prepared to play, play hard, and win...and that led to their being EC Champions this year. So if he alienated them personally, but each continued to give it all on the court and accept his roles and decisions even when detrimental to one's own stats, then people shouldn't give a [censored].

[Traceman]

I have linked an article written by the Detroit Free Press' Mitch Albom that explains a lot. I think this account of what happened makes as much sense as any. Whether you agree with the decision to fire Carlisle or not, I think this is probably pretty close to the reason he was fired.

MAYBE wins and losses are supposed to be the only things that matter to an NBA coach but they are not the only things that matter to a guy like Davidson. For your reading pleasure:

http://www.freep.com/sports/albom/mitch2_20030602.htm

[beav]

"This is how much he wanted to be rid of Carlisle. He had to hire a bigger-name coach to make it look like an improving move, but there was only one such coach available, Larry Brown, who had just quit the 76ers. So Davidson gave the nod.

And today, after a wham-bam negotiation, he will hand Larry Brown a five-year contract worth around $25 million. Carlisle was due to make about $2 million for next year.

In other words, the boss committed $23 million to get rid of somebody he didn't like.

Now that's rich."

Two things here. If he is so principled why did he have to hire a bigger name than Carlisle so that it looks like he is improving? Why not just let Carlisle go as soon as their season was over? Now that would have told me something. But immediately after Brown becomes available then you fire him because you can hire Brown? There is nothing noble about that IMO. There was a better coach out there and he went after him because he didn't like what he was hearing about his coach.

Also, what's the big deal about 25 mil over 5 years? They probably paid more than that for Cliff Robinson.

[TheDude]

wow, that article does make me hesitate on my rally to hire coach carlisle...maybe that's why his name isn't on alot of lists...

now i don't know what to think as far as our coaching situation goes...let's just get the owner situation settled and let him make the hard decision.