This deal blows

[Diesel]

That water is Murky...

No Chemistry.

Financial overload.

I must throw out this 21 ppg player....

I know we don't have a real PG...

I know we don't have any good ball handlers.

I must throw this 21 ppg player out with the Bathwater.

I know the coaching has been bad.

I know the chemistry wasn't there before Big Dog.

I must throw this former allstar out with the Bathwater.

This day, the Hawks have shown an unwillingness to really try to better themselves. Instead, they put Business ahead of winning and they put an undersized SG at the Point position because he's popular.

[KB21]

You've done nothing but show your bias against JT, a 17 ppg, 7.5 apg point guard (one of only 5 to do that) and your hardon for a player that scores 21 ppg because he steals shots from the people who should be shooting amd brings nothing else to the table.

What the Hawks have done is create enough room down the road to resign a budding star point guard as well as making a move to shore up the shooting guard position by giving DJ a contract that they wouldn't have been able to do had they kept Robinson.

[BullHawk]

sleeping with Big Dog or something? Other than the fact he is a 21 ppg scorer, what did he bring to this team? Tell us all, we want to know!!! Is it his defense? His rebounding? His hustle? His team concept? Please enlighten us all. Anyone who watch the games could see the Hawks played WAY better with him on the sidelines. So, what attributes does Big Dog possess that contributed to the Hawks sucess?

[Guest]

Some of you guys never learn your lession.I atleast

expected a pick or two.But this?SAD!

[jjjohns3]

Brandon is retiring,his & Big Hog's contracts come off the books this season. That gives us money for FAcy & Midseason trades.

~Peace

[Guest]

lol do you really think anyone is going to sign here?

Do you realize that we are now the worst team in

the league?

What midseason trades?We have nobody else to trade

besides THeo.

Trading Shareef for Sheed doesn't help us.

When you trade a 20PPG scorer and don't even get draft

picks in return it's a bad trade.

[Diesel]

First off....

Let's seperate truth from fiction.

The truth is that without a good PG this team will always look bad. So the next thing on the blame game is SAR.

However, what did Big Dog Bring.

Most importantly his scoring. With a good PG, Big Dog is a 20 ppg player who shots 46-48% from the field. That's fact. When you put that with Shareef who shoots [censored] near 50% from the field what you have is a good Low Post/MidRange Combo that should have been able to put up many points a night. Again... The failing is that you have to have a Good PG. Had we had Andre' Miller instead of who we had, we would have probably won 70-72% of our games. So number 1 is scoring.

Number 2 is rebounding. We are a notoriously weak rebounding. Team. Yes, Reef gets his 10 but after that... Theo is not a strong rebounder. JT and the Guards have not been Strong either. Big Dog pulled down 7 a night. Call it nonhustle, call it what you want, I know that without Big Dog, those nonhustle rebounds went to the other team. So when you're talking about rebounding, you're talking about Possessions.

The main problem BULL, and this is for You and whoever wishes to comment. We placed all the blame of our franchise on Big Dog and we have far more problems than Big Dog. Namely, if JT plays PG, we will still be a bad team and you can put the same blame on the Next SF. The big Picture makes you focus on Big Dog here and Big Dog in Milwaukee. When you take the time to do that you find that here, he had career lows in FG% and T.O. Don't you wonder why such a consistent player would have these problems???

Sadly... You based your theory on those homegames without Big Dog. Hey Bull, here's a big secret uncovered.... We are a good home team with or without big dog (in comparison to being on the road). However, I didn't see you mention anything about the blowouts that we took on the road during that same stretch. At the high point of that streak when they had nothing to play for, New Orleans beat us 92-77 without Big Dog.

Anyway.... This year, we will see the real flaw. I guess JT will still go unblamed.... Maybe we'll go through another coach or maybe we will trade Shareef away... However, I don't want you to go nowhere Bull, I want you right here Midseason when we're behind Cleveland and Chicago.

[dj_me]

In other words... DOWN the Road is the same endpoint as it was with Big Dog.

No, we don't come to the same endpoint because this makes us better. Sure Terrell Brandon is injured and has a good sized contract, but it is off the books in February, not two years from now.

Yeah, it would be nice to have a draft pick or maybe a couple role players along with him, but be happy that the Chemistry destroyer is going to be gone. I don't care what you say about GRob's worth, in my eyes he did not fit the role we gave him.

Another added bonus is that this opens up the SF position for Diaw or some other young, talented player (need I say, a quicker player). [censored] it, re-sign Glover and DJ with JT. I'd start the season like that.

JT/DD/Brandon(IR)

Glover/Hansen

Diaw/DJ/CC

SAR/Hendu

Theo/Nazr

Another bonus is that maybe this trade will make Theo happy and allow him to stay.

I see this all as a strictly business decision. McDavid is taking steps to make his pocket a little happier while making us better in the long-run. THIS WILL IMPROVE THE HAWKS.

[dj_me]

Big Dog pulled down 7 a night. Call it nonhustle...

I'll call it nonhustle just like you would call JT's assist average overstated.

...we will still be a bad team and you can put the same blame on the Next SF.

Not if we start Diaw or, well, pretty much any SF in the league considering they all can dribble better than GRob.

I didn't see you mention anything about the blowouts that we took on the road during that same stretch.

No, but then that's why we have you. To repeat the same nonsense over and over and over again. But wait, haven't there been playoff teams that have been blown out by the likes of the Clippers or the Grizzlies or whomever.

You continue to make the same arguements. Thing is, many of us don't care. We are not blinded by GRob's 20+ ppg and his false rebounding. We see his horrible dribbling and lack of presence on the defensive end. Mostly, we see how terrible he is for team chemistry. Chemistry, can you say that. Chem... i... stry.

You know, the more I read from you argueing for GRob, the more I like this trade the way it is.

[Lascar78]

I think when considering who we needed to ship more (GRob or JT) you have to take into account the fact that there aren't that many really talented tre PGs left, sadly enough. Yes it would be better if we could get a true PG for the future, but there are none to be gotten.There are alot of teams who need a true PG. On the other hand there are no teams willing to trade a good true PG unless they're getting one in return. On the other hand there are a ton of swingmen who can play the 3 at a pretty high level. That's why I think this was the right move. Also, as much as JT can not run an offense, he at least does not bring it to a screeching halt everytime he touches the ball, which Robinson did.

Also it's possible we will get another player other than Brandon

[TheDude]

The article on ajc states that by getting the cap releif from brandon's contract, it enables us to pursue other free agents such as lamar odom..

In my book that's a good trade. I'd make that trade any day of the week. Now i don't know about Stephen Jackson or even James Posey but Lamar Odom yes...

Then we've got:

JT/dickau

diaw/hansen/whoever/whoever else/maybe dj

odom/somebody else/maybe dj

reef/henderson

theo/nazr

chemistry's back and our turnovers are greatly reduced.

[BullHawk]

Somehow I knew it was going to be everyone else's fault. It's JT's fault!! It's the GM's fault. It's Harry the Hawk's fault. Big Dog is never to blame. NEVER.

[Playmaker0017]

Diesel,

I am sure everyone on this board knows, with unequivicable certainty, that JT has faults. He has tons of faults.

BUT, he doesn't have as big a fault as Big Dog.

You point out that JT needs a complimentary player like this is some sort of horrible thing. GASP! Well, every time you point out the strengths of his royal hogness you mention what he would od with a great PG. How many GREAT PGs are out there? How many are better than JT that we could immediately get our hands on?

JT can dribble, shoot and score. He's a decent passer, although he doesn't have the greatest courtvision. He's undersized, so his defense is suspect.

Big Load can shoot. According to you, he rebounds with the best of them. He can't pass, he's reluctant to give the ball up, he can't create a shot because he can't dribble. He's slow and lazy, so his defense is suspect.

Sure, Big Dog had points... but that doesn't equate to talent nor chemistry. He has neither. Look at Team USA, they had scorers a-plenty... but we couldn't win. Mostly because of chemistry. It is important. Heck, Big Loaf even had Theo wanting to leave Atlanta.

I am a HUGE fan of this trade. I said before the season that I would be happy if we traded Big Loaf for a cooler. So, I am pretty happy to just get him off the books. If we got more, I would have been happy... but, just losing him makes me smile.

He may turn out to have a phenominal season playing alongside Iverson... who causes the defence to collapse. We may kick ourselves and say how good he is... but, I think we did the right thing regardless.

We will stink to high heaven for a year, probably. But, maybe after that we will be in the position to really accumulate some players.

Play.

[Playmaker0017]

Dolfan,

You are right, we got the short end of the stick when you pull back to look at the whole scenario of trades.

But, current Hawk management can't do anything about the mistakes of their predecessors. Keeping Big Loaf just because trading him would mean that we got less than we gave would have been a far greater crime than admitting fault in the initial trade, in my opinion.

Heck, to me... this trade means we have more money, more chemistry and a brighter future. It means that Theo will maybe stick it out a little longer. It means that we can sign some players right away. It means Reef will be the focal point of our offense, which is the way it should be.

I like it. Sure, I would want more in return... but right now we are beggers... Big Dog's value is zilch... we were ignorant for giving a first round pick for him. Other GMs won't make that mistake.

Maybe it will come back to bite us, but I would make this move if I were the GM.

Play.

[Diesel]

You think Big Dog is never to blame in my book?

Big Dog has his failings as does Theo, Reef, and JT... They all have flaws... Theo is scrawny and doesn't rebound well. Reef doesn't ask for the ball enough and doesn't take over games. Big Dog is not a defensive player and NOT a ball handler.

However, when you know their weaknesses... There are ways to get around them.

JT's weakness is that he is NOT a PG. He doesn't have the mentality and I'm starting to believe he doesn't have the capacity. The question is which is worse... A Non defensive SF or a PG who can't run the offense?

You see Bull, you've fallen victim to the blame game. You have blamed somebody else for what is really a problem with the most important position on the floor. Is it a coincident that since we have had JT we haven't won more than 35 games? Our offense is predictable. And people have forgotten why we picked up Grob.

It will come back to our memory when SAR has 3 men on his back (no wonder he has back problems) and JT is playing streetball.

[Diesel]

Getting Odom is a PIPE DREAM..

That was something that Mike Lee came up with after a visit to D. Stoudamire's house when JR RIder, Robert Parrish, Odom, and Mookie were there....

IF we dared to give Odom an offer sheet for 4.5 million dollars...

First: His agent would [censored] on it and hand it back.

Second: Sterling would laugh so hard that he would have a heart attack matching it.

Third: Pat Riley would Put a hit out on Odom's agent.

Fourth: Barkley would be in the booth saying.... "Atlanta Sucks".

I know I repeated what Lee said but It's so much of a pipe dream that Snoop Dogg wouldn't smoke it.

[Playmaker0017]

Diesel,

I am sure most people would love to ditch JT for a real PG. But, the problem is that there aren't that many.

Most PG want to be PSG... whatever that is... they want to play point, but take shots like they are at the SG. They all want to be "like Mike"... and not one of them has the talent to do so.

The hope must lie in the fact that we will get a decent pick this year. The other hope must be that Boris Diaw can pass on this level. If he can pass and defend, he will open it up for Reef and JT, as he will run the "point" position on offense. This will allow JT to spot up and Reef to get post.

I am no JT fan, trust me. I fault him, BIG TIME. But, I really disliked Big Loaf. He wouldn't run. He wouldn't pass. He wouldn't NOT dribble.

Basically, Big Loaf has my size and skill... except he can shoot. That is what you get with Loaf.

Play.

[Playmaker0017]

Diesel,

We don't need Odom though.

We can sign a lot of second-tier players with this freed-up money.

We need people who want to gut it out. A bench.

Play.

[Diesel]

Well the comparison will go on all season....

Sadly, there are so many ifs in this deal that I wouldn't do it. I say we should have tried to do the deal with Good Coaching and a different person to run the offense. We should have tried to get D. Anderson or something like that.

However, there will be a whole lot of crow eaters on this board if Philly is good and we are terrible and DON'T BE SURPRISED when I call all of you out. In fact, I look forward to it.

Just Like Chillz and those weapons of mass destruction and N. Korea....

WHat did Diesel SAY?

[Guest]

How Dog does in Philly depends on how Iverson reacts

to another scorer and just what Randy will do as coach.

Dog has a higher chance of sucess in Philly...And seeing

what happens when we trade is something else.It always

blows up in or face.

Billy Knight is truely an idiot if he's behind this.What a

moron.