Brotha2ThaNite Posted February 19, 2013 Report Share Posted February 19, 2013 First let me say... I wouldn’t mind if Danny was able to pull off a trade that brought Jennings and Larry Sanders (Larry a must!) but… It’s not going to happen because Josh have said how he hates that city. Here is the reason why you don’t trade Josh. Look at the NBA History. You don’t win with young teams. Just about every NBA championship team is full with vets. Trading Josh just to get draft picks will only set this team back 5 years, maybe even 10 years. If you are not an instant super star coming out of college as a young players you will have to earn your way in this league before even the refs to start giving you the foul calls. This is the Hawks perfect cross road. It’s time to do what Boston did to get their ring… We are in the perfect spot. We have talent and money. You don’t go back if you’re at this point to get younger. You take away Josh… then try to add young talent??? That’s like if you’re at 50pts, take away 15pts just to try to add 20pts (i.e. maybe a good draft play/ high risk!) which will bring your total to 55pts. No! You keep that 50pts and add 15pts (i.e.Howard/vet) and another 15pts (i.e.Mayo/vet) Now you are at 80pts. Lol So, when you see Josh not traded after 3pm Thursday don’t get mad. Just look at it this way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post drzachary Posted February 19, 2013 Popular Post Report Share Posted February 19, 2013 Let's do what Boston did: kept their best player, their young PG and acquired the two best players from other teams, both perennial All-Stars and one a perennial MVP candidate. So all we need to do is keep Horford, Teague and acquire Paul and Howard. Co-signed! 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taz Posted February 19, 2013 Report Share Posted February 19, 2013 That's a since simple argument but there are more factors than how do you replace his point. You could argue Josh Smith hinders the growth and potential of Lou Teague and Al more than he helps 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruincoach Posted February 19, 2013 Report Share Posted February 19, 2013 You could also argue he isn't going to give Atlanta a discount. More than anything he will ask for more from us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brotha2ThaNite Posted February 19, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2013 I'm not trying to convince anyone to change their mind. If you want Josh to be traded I doubt if you're not going to want to trade him because of what I just put up. if you don't like him...I doubt that you're going to like him because of what I put up.I'm pretty sure for every bad point you dislike about josh's game there are members on here who could put up the same count or more bad points about Jeff and Al. Every message board of teams have fans who have their players they like and dislike. I'm just saying this is the reason behind he won't get traded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drzachary Posted February 19, 2013 Report Share Posted February 19, 2013 People could put up the same quantity of negative points about Horford or Teague, but that doesn't mean any of those points are valid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brotha2ThaNite Posted February 19, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2013 (edited) People could put up the same quantity of negative points about Horford or Teague, but that doesn't mean any of those points are valid.Lmbo! And I'm sure the ones about Josh would be, right?I'm one of the rare people here who wants Al, Josh, Jeff, Zaza, Ivan and Kyle to stay a Hawk! Edited February 19, 2013 by Brotha2ThaNite Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drzachary Posted February 19, 2013 Report Share Posted February 19, 2013 Lmbo! And I'm sure the ones about Josh would be, right?I'm one of the rare people here who wants Al, Josh, Jeff, Zaza, Ivan and Kyle to stay a Hawk! I'm not sure whether the hypothetical points made about Josh would be accurate :) My point is that counting the number of bullet points someone can list isn't a good way of showing a player to be good, bad, contract-worthy, whatever. I want them all to stay Hawks, but I doubt Josh would resign at a contract commensurate with what he actually brings to the table. Those others are pretty good values! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheNorthCydeRises Posted February 19, 2013 Report Share Posted February 19, 2013 (edited) First let me say... I wouldn’t mind if Danny was able to pull off a trade that brought Jennings and Larry Sanders (Larry a must!) but… It’s not going to happen because Josh have said how he hates that city. Here is the reason why you don’t trade Josh. Look at the NBA History. You don’t win with young teams. Just about every NBA championship team is full with vets. Trading Josh just to get draft picks will only set this team back 5 years, maybe even 10 years. If you are not an instant super star coming out of college as a young players you will have to earn your way in this league before even the refs to start giving you the foul calls. This is the Hawks perfect cross road. It’s time to do what Boston did to get their ring… We are in the perfect spot. We have talent and money. You don’t go back if you’re at this point to get younger. You take away Josh… then try to add young talent??? That’s like if you’re at 50pts, take away 15pts just to try to add 20pts (i.e. maybe a good draft play/ high risk!) which will bring your total to 55pts. No! You keep that 50pts and add 15pts (i.e.Howard/vet) and another 15pts (i.e.Mayo/vet) Now you are at 80pts. Lol So, when you see Josh not traded after 3pm Thursday don’t get mad. Just look at it this way. Marion + Mayo + 1st round pick for Josh + Jenkins - Marion effectively replaces Josh's rebounding- Mayo effectively replaces Josh's scoring- Give the minutes we're now giving Jenkins, back to Stevenson and Morrow Add additional playing time for Zaza and Ivan . . . and Josh is not missed at all, except for some of his highlight dunks and blocks Meanwhile, Jeff Teague would have almost total control of the offense, especially in transition, which would improve his value. And Al Horford will get a chance to really prove if he can be the leader of the Hawks. He'd be the undisputed leader of the team. With that trade, you just added a vet who can still play in Marion, and will be a more accepting role player than Josh. Mayo gives you a potential 1st option ( who is really a #2 option ) type scorer. Both have talent. Both were lottery picks. Both are solid starters who can start or be the 6th man on just about any team. And we'd still have enough room to make a run at a significant free agent. Maybe Al Jefferson 2013 - 14 Hawks PG - TeagueG - MayoF - MarionPF - HorfordC - Jefferson It may not be enough to get us to EC Finals level just yet, but it is a step in the right direction. The only way the Hawks could do like Boston did, would be to trade both Smith and Horford, and try to bring a significant star player in a bad situation to Atlanta. Both Garnett and Allen were in extremely bad team situations when they got traded. Don't be a fool Ferry. Call up Cuban and bring those two to ATL. Edited February 19, 2013 by northcyde Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Posted February 19, 2013 Report Share Posted February 19, 2013 I'm not sure whether the hypothetical points made about Josh would be accurate My point is that counting the number of bullet points someone can list isn't a good way of showing a player to be good, bad, contract-worthy, whatever. I want them all to stay Hawks, but I doubt Josh would resign at a contract commensurate with what he actually brings to the table. Those others are pretty good values! And THAT is what those of us who want to trade Josh have an issue with and why we are open to trading him. If he would sign for the 12 million flat that Horford is making I think that the majority of us here would welcome him back, but not for 3-6 million more per season when he refuses to stop doing the things that he shouldn't do. You can't say that about Al or Teague as they don't repeatedly do what everyone and their mama knows they shouldn't be doing. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Posted February 19, 2013 Report Share Posted February 19, 2013 Ugh I thought I hated that Mavs trade before, now you want us to give up our prized younger shooter too? What makes it even worse is that we could sign Mayo in the off-season if we want to. BTW Marion didn't look so good the other night against Atlanta like you said he would. I think he shot 3/10 or something and Josh ended up dominating that game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheNorthCydeRises Posted February 19, 2013 Report Share Posted February 19, 2013 (edited) Ugh I thought I hated that Mavs trade before, now you want us to give up our prized younger shooter too? What makes it even worse is that we could sign Mayo in the off-season if we want to. BTW Marion didn't look so good the other night against Atlanta like you said he would. I think he shot 3/10 or something and Josh ended up dominating that game. I'm thinking about now AND the future. Both of those guys would help us NOW. If both Mayo and Marion like it in Atlanta, they will stay. And while we could sign Mayo during the summer, it would give us an advantage if Mayo already knew how he felt about playing with the team, and competing in the playoffs again. Marion no doubt had a bad game last week vs the Hawks. Still doesn't take away from his body of work as a role playing starter who can defend and rebound. Both guys fit the "run and gun" style of play that some of you seem to like these days. Hate the deal if you want, but that would be a WINNING deal for the Hawks. And it also gives Zaza and Ivan more playing time. Guys who simply play their role and don't mind mixing it up with people. As for Jenkins, I like Jenkins. But he's no OJ Mayo. Not even close. OJ was the #3 pick in what can now be considered as a very good top heavy draft that included Rose, Westbrook, Brook Lopez, Love, Gallanari, Batum, Hibbert, Pekovic, Ibaka, McGee, and Deandre Jordan. Mayo can ball, and he'd make you forget about Jenkins the more you watched him. Edited February 19, 2013 by northcyde Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Posted February 19, 2013 Report Share Posted February 19, 2013 Sorry but you're in the overwhelming minority that thinks that's a winning trade or that Marion is still a good player. And sorry but I'm not losing Jenkins for the hope that Mayo would re-sign with us next year. If we really want him, we'll have as much chance as anyone to sign him next year as he could compete with Jenkins for the starting spot and we'd be able to give him a good contract above the MLE. BTW the Mavericks already owe the Rockets their 1st round pick this year, unless it's in the top 20 and if it's top 20 they won't be able to trade it away to anyone. At best we could get their 2016 (or 1st available in coming years) pick right now and that's way too far down the line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJlaysitup Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 Well if we do nothing can't Josh just tell his agent to make the best deal he can with L.A. and go out West and play with D12 next year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 Well if we do nothing can't Josh just tell his agent to make the best deal he can with L.A. and go out West and play with D12 next year? I think he'd be able to get the MLE and that's it. And that's assuming that teams over the luxury tax still get the MLE, which I'm not sure is even possible. And DJ you know you're dying to see him traded to Boston so that you could cheer on your favorite player playing on your favorite team! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJlaysitup Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 I think he'd be able to get the MLE and that's it. And that's assuming that teams over the luxury tax still get the MLE, which I'm not sure is even possible. And DJ you know you're dying to see him traded to Boston so that you could cheer on your favorite player playing on your favorite team! Haha! Naw..I lost interest in the Celtics a good while ago. I would be interested in seeing how much Smoove could impact a contending team though...like San Antonio. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFuzz Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 Sorry but you're in the overwhelming minority that thinks that's a winning trade or that Marion is still a good player. And sorry but I'm not losing Jenkins for the hope that Mayo would re-sign with us next year. If we really want him, we'll have as much chance as anyone to sign him next year as he could compete with Jenkins for the starting spot and we'd be able to give him a good contract above the MLE. BTW the Mavericks already owe the Rockets their 1st round pick this year, unless it's in the top 20 and if it's top 20 they won't be able to trade it away to anyone. At best we could get their 2016 (or 1st available in coming years) pick right now and that's way too far down the line. Are they not allowed to trade their pick this year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 Are they not allowed to trade their pick this year? Nope because the Rockets already own the Mavericks pick this year so they can't trade their 1st round pick until they've conveyed one to the Rockets first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruincoach Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 I only want josh traded because of his highly doubtful situation concerning resigning with the hawksI hate the jumpers and his roller coaster effort but can live with it because he can perform so well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 I could live with Josh at a flat 12 maybe 13 million but without him giving up the long jump shot that's as high as I'd go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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