My total speculative blueprint for how Bud can restock Hawks U.

[sturt]

Decided the topic should probably have its own space (... so if this sounds familiar, yeah, you read it in another thread but one where it was a tangent of another discussion).

Follow me on this, if you dare. Here's what had been said...

22 hours ago, sturt said:

...I also feel like... can't prove it... but feel like... we also are missing key ingredients on the coaching staff and it remains to be seen to what degree Hawks U is still Hawks U.

THAT to me, probably is more central than what we can possibly know for sure. If you're taking players that are drafted outside of those top 5 players draft after draft after draft, then it behooves you to enhance to whatever degree is imaginable that support staff. Being outside of the domain, who knows if they already have that support group in place, or if it's a work in progress, or even how you can have much of a feel for that if you're on the inside of the organization... dunno. But it's arguably merits the highest priority on the GM's list of several high priorities.

You've simply got to draft guys with high upsides and high motivation to improve, and then you have to develop them into the guys that everyone else covets as up-and-comers.

So, I'm turning my attention to see what I can learn about all those guys on the coaching staff who aren't named Budenholzer, and for that matter, who will be hired to staff the Bay Hawks.

 

 

 

====================================================

Can't help but wonder if there isn't some potential to identify some upgrades here, and to reassign some guys to work in Erie--which is, after all, going to need a head coach and (as I understand it is typical of D-league teams) two assistants.

 

 

 

===================================================

 

And so, having put Google's services to the test over the last hour or so, I am prepared now to submit to you the vision for the additions/upgrades--and as I will, as well, to Bud when he calls me for our customary advice session.

The first two of these are seemingly only available due to recent health difficulties that have interrupted their coaching careers.

 

Newman has had a right eye problem of some sort that has never been fully discussed publicly, and then Matta, has of course been in the news, given his dismissal from Ohio State related to the program's regression, which in turn, appear to have been related to his ability to get out and recruit due to significant back troubles in recent years.

Newman is routinely credited with being an architect in SAS' defense during his several years there, and was lured away by WAS to ostensibly fix-up an area where former coach Wittman was rumored to be weak. Fwiw, he was strongly considered to take over as head coach in DEN in 2015.

Matta has no discernible previous relationship in any way with the NBA, let alone with Bud who has spent virtually his entire career on an NBA bench, so who knows how well they would mesh together. But the appeal of Matta is that he came to Ohio State with a particular reputation for having developed talent at Xavier, and I just consider this an opportunity to take advantage of a fortuitous situation for some NBA team (since, ostensibly, Matta would be better to find a more flexible environment than what an NCAA gig can offer), and it might as well be us.  

 

Newble to this day remains a favorite of many of us who watched him during the Abdur-Rahim years. Turns out, on paper anyway, he would appear to be a very nice fit, given some previous association with us, but more importantly with the Spurs organization both as a player and a D-league assistant... and in his time in Austin, worked under our current assistant, Taylor Jenkins.

Oh, and by the way... Matta coached Newble in college at Miami U as an assistant there... just fwiw.

 

So the blueprint I'm going to recommend to Bud (*wink*) looks like this...

 

ATLANTA

Head Coach: Budenholzer

Assistants: Spahija, Ham, Newman, Matta, Jenkins

 

ERIE

Head Coach: Newble

Assistants: Lee, Sullivan

 

Let's do this. :D

 

 

 

 

 

[Bankingitbig]

I would like Schlenk to try and steal Ron Adams away from GSW. Think it might be good for Bud to have a more experienced assistant that he can go to for difficult decisions and one that he can rely on more. Don't want Bud continually developing these younger assistants that just leave in a year or two. I also think Adams can instill more of a culture due to his experience and respect that he should garner. He can focus on our defense philosophies, which should allow Bud to focus more on the offense. That said, I doubt Adams would want to leave Kerr and the GSW organization, especially given his age at 69.

[Guest]

Ron Adams would take us up a notch surely.  He's well-respeckted around the league.  But why would he leave, unless they're getting rid of him ... but why would they get rid of him .. and now I'm stuck in a loop ... get me off this crazy thiiiiingggg!!!!

@sturt Matta has some severe health concerns which basically are why he's no longer at OhioSt.  Let the man retire you savage.

That said, I've been begging for us to upgrade the assistants (I'm not accusing you of plagiarizing  .... yet) so I love this idea.  I gotta be honest, I have no idea what Ham gives us.  He's always seemed out of place IMHO.

I wonder if we could get that U'Ren guy who supposedly inspired the "death lineup".  He seems to be stuck in the same position there.

[sturt]

Hmmmm.... so, putting yourself in Bud's shoes, @Bankingitbig, would you be concerned at all for your new boss to tell you he'd like to hire away someone he trusted at GSW?

So, you understand, that's why I didn't even give any thought whatsoever to a Schlenk-led hire.... I want Bud to hire his own coaches. He's the one who has to work with them, and I think he's certainly earned the right to hold that much latitude.  He knows what he's doing. If, though, it's Bud's idea... maybe he says, "ya know, Travis, I've always thought highly of Adams over there at GSW... think you might be able to steal him away?".... then, I'm all for it.

[sturt]

3 minutes ago, kg01 said:

Let the man retire you savage.

hehe... he's 49 years old, and he was forced out.... and per the interview I read, at least, he has every intention to continue coaching somewhere somehow.

[Guest]

14 minutes ago, sturt said:

hehe... he's 49 years old, and he was forced out.... and per the interview I read, at least, he has every intention to continue coaching somewhere somehow.

Dang, he's only 49!?  Dude looks 49 going on 85.

[Bankingitbig]

45 minutes ago, sturt said:

Hmmmm.... so, putting yourself in Bud's shoes, @Bankingitbig, would you be concerned at all for your new boss to tell you he'd like to hire away someone he trusted at GSW?

So, you understand, that's why I didn't even give any thought whatsoever to a Schlenk-led hire.... I want Bud to hire his own coaches. He's the one who has to work with them, and I think he's certainly earned the right to hold that much latitude.  He knows what he's doing. If, though, it's Bud's idea... maybe he says, "ya know, Travis, I've always thought highly of Adams over there at GSW... think you might be able to steal him away?".... then, I'm all for it.

Lol yea I definitely agree. I mean I wouldn't be concerned if it was Ron Adams given that he has made it known he doesn't want to be a head coach and is a top notch assistant, so it would be somewhat understandable to try and gain him as an asset if Schlenk thinks he could. That said, I definitely think it should be Bud that is picking his assistants and that in the Ron Adams hypothetical Schlenk should be running that by Bud beforehand to make sure he is on board.

[sturt]

8 hours ago, Bankingitbig said:

Don't want Bud continually developing these younger assistants that just leave in a year or two.

Meant to say this when you posted it earlier, but left it out....

It's just damn ammmmmaaaaaaaaazinnnnng how many years Popovich was able to keep intact the same assistant staff for 7 or 8 years.

Don't know how that happens, really, but can't help but think it's been a relatively unheralded key in their success.

 

[hazer]

The poaching of Bud's staff is in direct correlation to Hawks decline in wins. I'm especially bummed about Snyder, who I'm not opposed to one day head-coaching if Bud takes the Spurs job. And get 3-zus in here in a suit as soon as possible. Long live Bud, but I'm the Prez of the Snyder/KK welcoming committee...

[sturt]

18 hours ago, kg01 said:

Dang, he's only 49!?  Dude looks 49 going on 85.

Here he is back at Xavier.... so, that's what just a few years in Columbus will do to a person. ;)

[Bankingitbig]

Looks like Malcolm isn't the biggest fan of our current assistant coaches either..

He later said "Neven is my guy. Thought you were talking about someone I played with in europe."

Edited June 16, 2017 by Bankingitbig

[sturt]

I want to see Malcolm do well. But c'mon, Foe23... there are some things best left kept behind closed doors.

Just saw this...

... and otoh, he appears to have some good vibes with Coach Lee.

 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, sturt said:

I want to see Malcolm do well. But c'mon, Foe23... there are some things best left kept behind closed doors.

Just saw this...

... and otoh, he appears to have some good vibes with Coach Lee.

 

Dude, I'm not watching that.  What'd he say?  In 1,325,858 words or less.

[sturt]

1 minute ago, kg01 said:

Dude, I'm not watching that.  What'd he say?  In 1,325,858 words or less.

Nah, you need to watch. There's an attitude that comes across that is oddly simultaneously encouraging and discouraging.... a me-first mentality, imo, coupled with a clear determination to get better.... and with that, some background on where he comes from that perhaps helps explain why he is how he is.

Last 4-5 minutes are just talk about hip-hop music and his obsession with shoe fashion, but up until he's asked to predict the NBA Finals (GSW in 5, notably), it's a worthwhile listen.

 

[sturt]

2 hours ago, Bankingitbig said:

Looks like Malcolm isn't the biggest fan of our current assistant coaches either..

He later said "Neven is my guy. Thought you were talking about someone I played with in europe."

I can imagine I too would tend to just come to know someone with that last name, instead, by his first name.... hehe.

[sturt]

13 hours ago, hazer said:

The poaching of Bud's staff is in direct correlation to Hawks decline in wins. I'm especially bummed about Snyder, who I'm not opposed to one day head-coaching if Bud takes the Spurs job. And get 3-zus in here in a suit as soon as possible. Long live Bud, but I'm the Prez of the Snyder/KK welcoming committee...

But I think the relevant point here, when you think about it , is that it might not have been Bud's own coaching per se that pushed us to the best EC record as much as it was Bud's smarts in recruiting and hiring a staff that featured two guys considered so good that very shortly they would be sought out for their own HC positions.

And the lesson seems to be.... you want good staff, of course... you just somehow want to keep anyone outside the organization from wanting them enough to pursue them with HC offers, right?

Or, better I suppose, you just want your HC to be so good at spotting other coaching talent, there's an endless spring of coaches coming up right behind the ones who leave.

Of Newman, Matta and Newble, Newman's probably at an age where he's plausibly going to have one more job before retiring, but Matta (assuming his health can improve) and Newble (assuming he's actually the good coach I can only conjecture that he is) probably couldn't be counted on to stick around any more so than any other NBA assistant. And truly, Matta is already a proven HC on his own merits, and with any NBA success on his resume', is logically going to get calls sooner than others necessarily would.

[sturt]

More fuel to the fire.... missed this when it was first published months ago, siap...

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/page/presents18986226/five-nba-coaching-prospects-watch

Darvin Ham, Atlanta Hawks assistant coach
There's an odd contradiction at work with former players who have head-coaching ambitions. On one hand, guys who played in the NBA frequently jump the line and score top jobs over career assistants who have broken down video, scouted opponents, designed top defenses and sat at the feet of coaching legends. Yet, at the same time, there's often a stigma that portrays them as lacking the work ethic of the schleps who have slept on a couch at the facility for 15 years.

Did you know the famed "hammer pass" is named for Ham? He enjoyed a nine-year career in the NBA, and colleagues say he has a coach's intuition. When Quin Snyder moved from the Lakers to Atlanta in 2012, he urged Ham, who also sat on Mike Brown's bench, to seize the opportunity to claim more responsibility in Atlanta. An assistant on Budenholzer's staff, which is quickly sprouting its own coaching tree, performs a full rotation of tasks, from cutting video to intensive individual work with players.

Ham plays an enormous role with the Hawks and does it without a lot of rah-rah battle cries. He understands the difference between pride and passion, ego and intelligence, and can tell a player -- be it a vet like Dwight Howard or a young guy like Dennis Schröder -- the truth even if it isn't what he wants to hear. He knows that you prepare a reliable vet if he's going to be the whipping boy in a film session, but that you probably don't do the same for a rookie, because you want to see how he's going to react.

Ham is the kind of guy -- not unlike his boss -- who could probably be happy for years as a top assistant. But one suspects that, like Budenholzer, he'd be cheating himself if he didn't throw his hat in the ring at some point for a head-coaching opportunity.

 

[Diesel]

16 hours ago, sturt said:

Meant to say this when you posted it earlier, but left it out....

It's just damn ammmmmaaaaaaaaazinnnnng how many years Popovich was able to keep intact the same assistant staff for 7 or 8 years.

Don't know how that happens, really, but can't help but think it's been a relatively unheralded key in their success.

 

I think Popp avoided poaching because people saw the way that they played and said...

1.  They got Duncan and Parker and Ginobili.

&

2.  That system won't work without those stars... so it's not use in getting those coaches. 

The San Antonio way without Duncan is still invalidated. But Bud gave some credence to it by winning here. 

 

[sturt]

5 hours ago, Diesel said:

I think Popp avoided poaching because people saw the way that they played and said...

1.  They got Duncan and Parker and Ginobili.

&

2.  That system won't work without those stars... so it's not use in getting those coaches. 

The San Antonio way without Duncan is still invalidated. But Bud gave some credence to it by winning here. 

 

I can buy that.

[sturt]

Was just made to remember that, to the contrary, Thad Matta does have an NBA connection. It's that head coach in BOS who, as he did, coached at Butler.

So, maybe we'd be at a disadvantage if Stevens wanted to create a space for him on his bench.... then again, who wants to live or work in cold Boston when you've got back troubles, right?