troubleman

Yi is intriguing to me, not because of race, but because of his upside. I see him as 4, who will allow us to keep the solid Zaza at center. Marvin and Smooth would battle it out for the three, with the loser, Shelden, and Josh Childress anchoring our bench. I'm not expecting Yi to come in and start immediately, but i'm looking 2 or 3 years down the road. If the Hawks take Mike Conley, great, but I also believe the Hawks need to get bigger at either the 4 or 5. Watching Conley play, he does not excite me like Paul and Williams did, so I would prefer the Hawks use the pick on Yi, if the pre-draft workouts go well.

I have heard so many excuses for the lack of support of the Atlanta pro sports teams and the bottomline is, winning is the cure in a town like this. This is not a great sports city, but they will support a consistent winner. People supported the Braves, even in the playoffs, until the fans realized ownership was not putting money into the product to make it championship caliber. The decline in attendance started when AOL took over for Ted Turner, and people realized the team was cutting costs. I don't care what kind of music, entertainment, or kid friendly events are on the table, fans in this town will only come out for a winning product. If ASG wants to fix the attendance problem, then start with fixing the basketball team (firing Billy Knight and Mike Woodson would be a start).

Quote: 1)Was the dismissal of Mora needed? Not really, but the coordinators had to go. Quote: 2)Was Petrino a good hire? The jury is still out on this one. I wasn't thrilled with the hire, but he is the coach now and he has my support. Quote: 3)How long will it take for Vick to be comfortable with the offense? I don't believe learning the offense has ever been an issue. When I watch the Falcons, I see a flawed offensive football team. They have had a bad offensive line, and bad to average receivers since 1999, but of course every flaw is the quarterbacks fault. Chris Chandler was a pure passing qb, but please look at his passing numbers from 1999,2000,and 2001. They look very similar to Michael Vicks numbers, but of course it's all Vick's fault. Quote: 4)What are your expectations (.500, playoffs ect... I expect this team to be average (7-9,8-8), unless they have a great draft and are somehow injury free. I told people in 2005, that going to the NFC Championship game was probably the worst thing that could have happened to the Falcons, because they were a flawed team, and fan expectation would go thru the roof. Unfortunately, I was right.

All I want is an impact player, regardless of what position he plays. The Falcons have too many holes to worry about positions. Take the best player available to fill one of those holes. Of course you don't pull a Billy Knight, and draft a QB at #8, because you have Vick. As much as I like CJ, I wouldn't trade the farm for him. This is a pretty deep draft, and if the Falcons draft wisely they can really upgrade their team.

Quote: Well, at some point it will sink in that Michael Vick isn't a quarterback. After 6 years in the league, he hasn't developed a bit as a passer. The San Diego Chargers raped the Falcons on that deal. They got LaDainian Tomlinson and Drew Brees out of that deal. There is no doubt that Drew Brees is eons better as a quarterback than Michael Vick will ever be. Brees can actually read defenses and throw the ball. The Chargers got LaDainian Tomlinson to boot. Amazing! Ok, others have proven that you are wrong about the trade. Since San Diego clearly won the trade according to your logic, how about telling me how many playoff games they have won since the trade? I mean the Chargers clearly raped the Falcons, right? LT is clearly a stud, but c'mon Reche Caldwell and Tim Dwight? Quote: The Falcons would be a much better team now if Ron Hill and Dan Reeves hadn't gotten stupid and traded the farm to get Michael Vick, the most overrated player I have ever seen in the NFL. Still haven't answered that question yet regarding the oline/wr combination, but I don't expect you to find an answer. The Falcons have failed Vick, just like they have failed nearly every qb they have acquired since the early 80's. Name another team that hasn't drafted an offensive lineman in the first round in the last 15 years? I defend Mike Vick, not only because he is talented, but because it has been the same story for 40 years with this pitiful franchise. Unfortunately in the city of Atlanta bad mgmt is par for the course, and unfortunately for Vick he will have wasted a promising career with the Atlanta Falcons.

Quote: It's not a great trade for the Falcons. They just dealt the only real quarterback on their roster. Now, the Falcons are stuck with the glorified running back named Michael Vick. Typical response. In Losersville it's always the QB's fault. How about naming me one team in the league that has a worse combination of receivers and oline than Mike Vick? Not worse receivers or worse oline, but the combination of the two. You can be successful without one or the other, but you cannot have any passing success without both.

Wow, whatever happened to rookies feeling their way thru the first NBA season. This is such a "now" society, we are unwilling to allow anything to develop. I didn't want Shelden, heck I haven't liked any of BK's drafts picks except Josh Smith, but I'm willing to allow these guys to develop. Shelden is not the reason for the holes in the lineup, BK's draft strategy is the reason. Hopefully, the Hawks will do the right thing in the offseason, and give BK and Mike Woodson their walking papers.

I might be wrong, but I thought the Hawks used their last timeout before the play. I'm not sure how Childress can be blamed for the play, when he did his job. He found an open man with 2.8 seconds left on the clock, which is plenty of time to catch and make a move. Unfortunately, Lue stumbled which screwed up the entire play.

Marvin seems more comfortable, but like most young players he is very inconsistent. Our terrible point guard play, and lack of any type of offensive identity doesn't help either. I believe Marvin scored 10 points in the 1st quarter, but didn't score again until the fourth? I'm quickly joining the fire Woodson bandwagon.

Quote: If Howard and Josh Smith ever do get to play together, I would say the odds are better that it is in Orlando than here. Agreed

That is funny, because Scoop and Jason Whitlock are having a feud. I anxiously await Jabba the Hut's response.

The ignorance is people buying into this article like it is the only "truth" about All-Star Weekend. The ignorance is the racist crap I've seen in this thread, like send the event to Africa. The ignorance is the people who associate the word thug with minorities, when even a "redneck" can fit the definition. The ignorance is saying "rednecks" work and pay taxes, when there are a large number of whites and even rednecks receiving government assistance. That is the ignorance I'm referring to in my post. Large events attract large amounts of people, good and bad, and the ignorance is focusing on only the bad. Just because Jason Whitlock, who is the Kansas City Star's version of Terrance Moore, did not have a good time does not mean thousands of other law abiding citizens did not enjoy the festivities.

Well, I'm a California kid (Menlo Park) who moved to Atlanta at the age of 15. I would love to move back to the Bay Area, but unfortunately the dotcom boom made the area (silicon valley) one of the most expensive places in the country. I haven't visited in over 20 years, but I do plan a trip this summer. Hopefully, I'll get a chance to enjoy a baseball game at the best park in the major leagues (ATT Park).

Wow, the ignorance in this thread is amazing.

Quote: Hmm. I wonder why that same owner doesn't hold his quarterback accountable then? Could it be that said owner doesn't want to admit that giving him a $100 million contract was a grave mistake? The coaching search for a replacement is already flawed, because the Falcons are going to ask the new coach to structure the offense around their extremely flawed quarterback. Extremely flawed? If Matt Schaub is completing passes at about the same rate as Vick (52.2% in his career), and has a career passer rating of 69.2, despite the fact that he is a "passing" qb, wouldn't that point to a bigger problem than Mike Vick? Quote: The Falcons might as well just hire someone like Pat Sullivan and install the option offense, seeing as how the option offense is the only offense Michael Vick can efficiently run. So the option offense is the only offense Michael Vick can efficiently run? Did Dan Reeves run the option offense? Is it also the only offense Matt Schaub can run, since he seems to have the same problems completing passes, and not turning the ball over as Vick? Quote: Jim Mora Jr. is not a bad football coach, and if he had a real quarterback, the west coast offense would work very well for the Falcons. I agree, Jim Mora Jr. is not a bad football coach, but his gimmicky style had to go. Did the Falcons run the option offense in 2004 on their way to the NFC Championship game? If you watch the Falcons offense, and I mean truly watch the offense, you will see a qb that is blitzed more than any other in the league, and you will see an offense designed to fail against the blitz. Where are the hot routes? Where are the passes across the middle? Why is there no audibling?(Garcia couldn't audible in SF either) Why not use the fullback (Griffith) in the redzone, instead of trying to pass? Jim Mora is a victim of his own inability to reign in his moronic offensive coordinator. I'm originally from the Bay Area, so I have several friends who are 49er fans, and when Gregg Knapp was hired as the Falcons offensive coordinator, they were happy as h*ll to see him gone. I really wonder do people in this city actually watch the games?

Mike Martz? The dude is horrible as a head coach. He basically ruined the Rams with his pass happy offense, despite the fact he had a future Hall of Famer in Marshall Faulk. Martz is great as a coordinator, because the head coach can overrule his pass oriented offense. Whoever is hired, I want the team to play "real" football. No more gimmicks. I remember in the preseason, Vick stated he was going to be dumping the ball off to his rb's, and hitting the slant passes. I saw it in the preseason, and next thing I know, they fell in love with the gimmicky option crap. The slant pass all but disappeared from the arsenal, and the rb's were required to block due to the amount of blitzes Vick faces and the long stupid routes designed by Greg Knapp to counter the blitz. Blank's mistake was firing Dan Reeves, who was unable to overcome the loss of his starting qb in 2003.

Quote: Secondly, to say he's sucked in any regular season game is just simply ignorant. Remember the game against New England. Yes, we lost but he had a very solid game for having never started in his life in the pros. So you're just flat out wrong on that one. I really wish people would stop saying that was his first freakin start. The guys started the year before against New Orleans and looked like a rookie. He has had plenty of playing time, and his overall completion percentage is on par with Vicks. This leads me to believe the problem is not Schaub or Vick, but other variables, namely the awful playcalling and the awful pass blocking. Quote: Furthermore, Vick may not have the best core of receivers in the league but let's just stop making escuses here. They aren't that bad. Part of why they look so bad is because of playcalling, or the gameplan, but it is also because Vick is not throwing catchable passes. So please spare me the it's all the receivers fault nonsense. There're plenty of blame to go around and Vick gets his share. I've had season tickets since 1996, and believe me this core group of receivers are that bad. There is a reason why Denver traded for Javon Walker, despite the fact he was coming off a torn ACL. Ashley Lelie is not a #1 or #2 receiver. Roddy White and Jenkins are both young, and both are poor route runners. I have sat and watched the receivers quite a bit this year, and the sad fact is they do not get seperation. They are jammed too easily, and they run poor routes. Quote: Without Vick they're fight for the #1 draft pick? You're once again showing your ingorance on Schaub. I believe that if you look at it objectively, we would have a much more efftive passing game with Schaub despite our coaches gameplan simply because he is a better passer than Vick Outside of the New England game, and the preseason game against the Colts in Tokyo, there is nothing there for you to say that Schaub is a better passer. I like the kid, but people really annoy me with this crap. Matt Schaub has thrown 149 passes in his career, and he is completing less than 50% of them. How does that make him a "much" better passer than Vick? Quote: The bottom line is that Vick is pretty much what most people outside of Atlanta, who look at the situation objectively, think he is. A great athlete who will always keep your team exciting and possibly really good. But will ultimately dissappoint. The sooner we realize this and move on, the better. The bottom line is most people outside of Atlanta do not watch the Atlanta Falcons. When is the last time the Falcons had a good offensive line? 98? When is the last time the Falcons had a great defense? If Vick is so bad, why haven't any of the receivers that played with him in the past, gone to other places and had success. Why are most of them out of the league? How many former offensive linemen are starting for other teams? The Falcons have talent, but unfortunately we have a former offensive lineman coaching the receivers, a defense that is soft, and we rely too much on gimmicks. How come the leagues leading rushing team for 3 years in a row, has such a hard time running in the red zone or picking up a yard on 3rd/4th and 1? Why did the coach say Vick's legs is the hot route on blitzes? How does a team run the same play 8 times on third down, without a qb, and get a 1st down 7 of them? How does a team pass the ball 7 times, but hold the ball for 40 minutes in a game? You see, the problem with the Falcons is bigger than Mike Vick, and trading him will not solve anything.

The biggest draft mistake was Diaw over Josh Howard.

Let's see, Adam Morrison starts off summer league action 3-14 but is able to bounce back. I don't know, maybe we should give Shelden at least one more game before we crucify him.

Quote: Hey all I am saying is Woodson got the most out of Diaw, and everyone knows that. Yeah I guess trying to fit him into 3 different positions was the wrong thing to do. Especially with many of the posters on this board thinking that Diaw was a point guard. I guess I'm just sick of the excuses for Diaw and why he didn't work out here.

Quote: Yea, he sure did handle the Boris situation real well. Let's not criticize him. Yeah, telling him to stop passing up open shots was the wrong thing to do.

Wade goes to the basket more than any of the Dallas players, which is why he receives more free throw attempts. He also excels at pump faking his man in the air, and jumping into them for the foul. Also the hack-a-shaq nonsense didn't help either. The foul at the end of the game seemed bogus.

I have never thought of Shelden as a center. I feel that he can come in and play next to Zaza and give the Hawks the interior defensive presence they lack. I wouldn't take him over Aldridge, but I will take him over guys like O'Bryant and Simmons.

Put me down as one who wouldn't mind seeing Shelden Williams in a Hawks uniform. I like the idea of playing him next to Zaza with Marvin Williams/Josh Smith at the 3.

Quote: Never once did I say it was Shareef's fault, but you can see with the way he carries himself on the floor why he never got the starting job back. He's just not that aggresive, and he is slow. The guy would rather take 20-footers than play inside. No, you didn't say it, but it seemed implied. Heck, I'm man enough to admit that I may have read it wrong. I've heard the same things about Dirk and KG, not that I'm implying Shareef is in their class. You play to your strengths, and Shareef at 6'9" is an undersized 4. He is not athletic like Kenyon Martin, or as bulky as other 4's, so his game should be on the outside. Where he does hurt a team is on the defensive end. He is not big enough to guard 4's, and he is not quick enough to guard 3's. Quote: I just won't forget the lackluster effort he gave while he was in Atlanta. Some people still like and defend him, but I was so happy to see him go. I am sure he is a great guy and all, but I got sick of watching him dog it. The Hawks did a poor job of covering up his weaknesses, which is why I've never doubted his effort. Big Dog was a poor fit, and Glover never developed into the type of starting caliber guard this team needed. The Hawks had an undersized frontline back then also, and there was no way that team was going to be successful on the defensive end. The ideal starting lineup for the Hawks would have been JT, (insert shooting guard who can handle the ball), Shareef, Theo, and Nazr. Theo never had a strong enough "base" to guard most centers in the league, and would have been better suited at the 4. Shareef would have had trouble stopping most 3's, but the shotblocking ability of Theo would have negated many drives to the basket. I believe Shareef gave good effort, but the team chemistry just wasn't there.