Trade Marvin now or...

[Diesel]

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If all you see are points when you watch a basketball game, then that's your problem!

Maybe you could explain to me how a 3 pt swing in 9 minutes is a rally. And while your at it you could explain why Childress should get credit for JJ and Smith scoring the last 30 points of a game.

When you're down by 10 points... IF the other team is able to score while you're scoring, you could score 100 points and it won't matter, you're not going to make up the difference. However, when you watched us play that game 4... (I know, you got no cable)... then you see that our defense (team defense) stepped up and made a comeback possible. You see Exodus, there is no comeback without stops. There is no stops without team defense. Go back and check the record.. We made up 10 points after Marvin was subbed for Chillz. From 74-79 to 97-92. We held them to 13 points over 7 minutes.. while we scored 23. You don't do that without getting stops!!!

And if you forgot...

It's a 3 point game... What seals the game for us:

0:55 Childress Rebound (Off:4 Def:5) That's one of those offensive boards that you think so little of!

[exodus]

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If all you see are points when you watch a basketball game, then that's your problem!

Maybe you could explain to me how a 3 pt swing in 9 minutes is a rally. And while your at it you could explain why Childress should get credit for JJ and Smith scoring the last 30 points of a game.

When you're down by 10 points... IF the other team is able to score while you're scoring, you could score 100 points and it won't matter, you're not going to make up the difference. However, when you watched us play that game 4... (I know, you got no cable)... then you see that our defense (team defense) stepped up and made a comeback possible. You see Exodus, there is no comeback without stops. There is no stops without team defense. Go back and check the record.. We made up 10 points after Marvin was subbed for Chillz. From 74-79 to 97-92. We held them to 13 points over 7 minutes.. while we scored 23. You don't do that without getting stops!!!

And if you forgot...

It's a 3 point game... What seals the game for us:

0:55 Childress Rebound (Off:4 Def:5) That's one of those offensive boards that you think so little of!

Childress scored 4 pts in game 4 going 2-6. Excuse me for not being impressed.

Meanwhile JJ and Smith combined for 61 pts. I have a feeling they might have had something to do with the rally. Smith got to the line 13 times (making 12). Childress didn't get to the line once.

[Supporter]

Diesal whats with all the marvin hate, did he kiss your girl or something

[exodus]

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Diesal whats with all the marvin hate, did he kiss your girl or something

It has been going on ever since Marvin was drafted. That draft is one of the rare things Diesel got right so he has to keep reminding everyone about it.

[Supporter]

wow, how lame is that...

[Zone034life]

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Diesal whats with all the marvin hate, did he kiss your girl or something

It has been going on ever since Marvin was drafted. That draft is one of the rare things Diesel got right so he has to keep reminding everyone about it.

Your affection for stats is getting old!!!!!!!

[thescout5]

The sad fact is Marvin and Chills can't get it done and the position needs upgraded. Marvin's points seem to be those quiet points in a game when they don't matter has much.He's got an outside shot thats his arsenal for an off game and it isn't always dialed in. Chills can't hit the open J is a bench player. The position needs more production and while I understand Marvin is young his skill level and desire or heart seems to be lacking.I don't see him getting much better get value when you can in a few yrs Marvin will be gone has a free agent.

I think the Hawk's while having a ton of high picks with their current roster will be a team similar to the Bull's not having the right pieces if they don't make at least one big change and it isn't just by adding Anderson. There were way to many times where they didn't look like a team passing the ball for the open shot, to many one on one players. Woody is part of the problem but I feel the team IQ is low and it won't change with the current roster. Smarter, talented players are needed the current roster doesn't have the ability to win championships.

[Diesel]

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Diesal whats with all the marvin hate, did he kiss your girl or something

What's with Marvin. Let me answer for myself because Exodus is nothing but a hater who never watches Hawks games.

Here's my thing against Marvin.

HE DOESN'T TRY.

I've been a Hawks fan since John Drew and fast Eddie Johnson. I have been through the good years of Nique and the muck and the mire of the Babcock years. I was here when the 4 year promise was made by Babcock. I was here when the playoff guarantee was made by Babcock. I've seen some good teams, I have seen some really bad teams. I have seen some good players and I have seen some really bad players.

What makes Marvin difficult to digest in some respects are things beyond his control.

When we gutted Theo, Shareef, and Big Dog... we were basically given a promise that we would rebuild around a superstar. We tanked, we traded guys like Wallace. We get to the draft and we get Chillz and Smoove and Donta. Not bad. In fact, I was kinda encouraged at the end of their rookie year. Smoove was blocking shots and winning dunk contests. Chillz was playing hard. We had Al Harrington on the bench, we tanked and let these young guys play. We even had Diaw the "rugged defender" playing where he could.

Go into the draft that year. We have 5 Sfs... We have gotten the highest draft pick in the history of the franchise. We target and pick Marvin Williams. I really hated this pick. Detested it. We had 5 Sfs three of them young and one of them was a vet. Then we got JJ.

Now... gave Marvin 2 years to get it together. Year three he's supposed to be good (at the least). I mean Marvin is the highest draft pick in the History of the Hawks. He's the guy we picked when we had 5 Sfs. We had tanked 3 years to get him. I said that we should have expectations of Marvin when we drafted him. Many Hawksquawkers pointed to Marvin being an allstar by year three.

Well, what do we have. First off, we have a guy who spent his summer writing term papers and working on his degree and needing Fizdale to call him up and suggest to him that maybe he should spend some part of his summer working out before he thought about trying to do anything basketball related???

This is our high pick. He's not even trying to get better at Basketball. He's at Chapel Hill chasing skirt. I recall Jordan. I love Jordan's maybe it's my fault commercial because I remember the reports of Jordan's workouts over the summer. He would be at Groves working out and playing hoops all day. He would fly in the best competition (pros) to help him get his game up. Even a guy like Brand would spend his summer at the Ruck playing ball with guys who are skilled. But what's Marvin the high pick doing? He's waiting for Fizdale to call him and give him some motivation. Even Smoove had the Smarts to get his agent to arrange workouts with Hakeem and Murphy.

Marvin sleep walks through another season and when you watch him. There's no fire. He oozes complacency.

And what makes it worse is that he has a loyal band of protectors (Exodus, Dolfan, and a few others) who watch him bumble and stumble around and instead of agreeing that Marv should come off the bench, they argue all the more that Marvin is going to be "something special". Well, the news is that something special pasted a long time ago. Marvin hasn't improved his game since he's come from UNC. IN fact, when you watch him, all he does is just wait for others to make plays for him or when he gets the ball, he starts his 7 foot fall head first towards a defender. There's no star player in Marvin and yet we're bending giving this guy all kind of playing time when he makes absolutely no impact on the game. In three years, I can only count one game where him being on the court mattered.

The biggest thing is that he doesn't try. I'm not talking about just how he looks on the court, I'm talking about how he plays. You can see effort in guys playing hard and trying. Marvin has a lot of God given gifts but it's all a waste because he doesn't try.

This offseason. Listen for the reports on what Marvin is doing. When you find that he's spending the summer touring Europe or something... then maybe you can develop the same dislike of Marvin that I have.

The main reason I dislike Marvin is because I'm a true Hawks fan.

Just because a guy wears a Hawks jersey doesn't automatically mean he's good for the team. At this point, being loyal to Marvin is like being loyal to JR Rider or Big Dog. Marvin needs to spend this summer figuring out how to drive and keep his balance and how not to trip up over the three point line.

[Cwell]

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wow, how lame is that...

um yeah how lame is at theat exodus acts the same about Childress.Childress brings alot more to this team than Marvin and it's not something that will be heavy in the stat book but that's all he uses.U can track my posts from the beginning of the year I laughed at Deisel everytime he propsed a trade because it included Marvin.I always defended him like I do all young players,but Marvin doesn't call to to be supported.He looks like nothing out there.I've made a complete 180 turn on him.He just isn't a natural basketball player.and whoever came up with the all-star potential thing on him was wayyyy off because he hasn't even shown flashes of it in 3 years.Guys who will never be all-stars even show greatness sometimes.Marvin doesn't even look like a starter.I've never seen a guy so clumsy,so uncoordinated that can't perform the basics of basketball and have so much hype.He didn't even start in college over guys like Jackie Manuel and Jawad Williams.Rashad McCants could have played that 2 slot because he's not a SF anyway.Marvin has been a dissapointment from the start but I still supported him but he's lost me.

[DrReality]

The only thing I will add is that Chills does more of the things that don't get seen on the stat sheet. He is better at getting the other guys intvolved. Hope that is something MW learns. I think this will be a critical offseason for Marvin.

[exodus]

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The only thing I will add is that Chills does more of the things that don't get seen on the stat sheet.

The problem is that we need things that DO show up on the stat sheet, like points and defensive rebounds.

He certainly doesn't bring defense. That has been his weakness from day 1.

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He is better at getting the other guys intvolved.

So why does he average only 1.5 assists per game?

[Kimsey]

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The sad fact is Marvin and Chills can't get it done and the position needs upgraded. Marvin's points seem to be those quiet points in a game when they don't matter has much.He's got an outside shot thats his arsenal for an off game and it isn't always dialed in.

Chills can't hit the open J is a bench player

. The position needs more production and while I understand Marvin is young his skill level and desire or heart seems to be lacking.I don't see him getting much better get value when you can in a few yrs Marvin will be gone has a free agent.

I think the Hawk's while having a ton of high picks with their current roster will be a team similar to the Bull's not having the right pieces if they don't make at least one big change and it isn't just by adding Anderson. There were way to many times where they didn't look like a team passing the ball for the open shot, to many one on one players. Woody is part of the problem but I feel the team IQ is low and it won't change with the current roster. Smarter, talented players are needed the current roster doesn't have the ability to win championships.

Chilly can actually hit an open shot but opts to drive the ball just like MW opts to shoot jumpers. Unless you have a mid range game like Rip Hamilton, you need to diversity your game more.

One plays the majority of the second half, the other plays cheerleader unless someone gets into foul trouble or terribly ineffective.

[Supporter]

Lmao get of of chillz nuts, i like him as a 6th man but he is not better than marvin. Marvin can actually shoot. You guys are always talking about how timid marvin is and if chillz shot more he could be better. Theres a reason he doesnt shoot it if he is gaurded. Marvin brings way more to the table than chillz. The only reason that he is not 20 ppg scorer like all of you wish he is is because he is playing behind joe, smith, bibby, and potentially al. The guy has all the skills, hes just in the wrong place at the wrong time. Even though he is fuuckin 21 and chillz is like 25 or something. And you always talk about how clumsy marvin is. Well smoove is just as clumsy and even more stupid.

[DrReality]

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The only thing I will add is that Chills does more of the things that don't get seen on the stat sheet.

The problem is that we need things that DO show up on the stat sheet, like points and defensive rebounds.

He certainly doesn't bring defense. That has been his weakness from day 1.

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He is better at getting the other guys intvolved.

So why does he average only 1.5 assists per game?

Because he's not afraid to drive to the basket and mix it up inside. MW's jumpers don't generate much further offense. Chills drives do.

[mrhonline]

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Because he's not afraid to drive to the basket and mix it up inside. MW's jumpers don't generate much further offense. Chills drives do.

LOL. Driving to the basket is the extent of Childress' offensive game. It's his only option.

[exodus]

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The only thing I will add is that Chills does more of the things that don't get seen on the stat sheet.

The problem is that we need things that DO show up on the stat sheet, like points and defensive rebounds.

He certainly doesn't bring defense. That has been his weakness from day 1.

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He is better at getting the other guys intvolved.

So why does he average only 1.5 assists per game?

Because he's not afraid to drive to the basket and mix it up inside. MW's jumpers don't generate much further offense. Chills drives do.

But i thought he was better at getting other guys involved? You sound a little confused.

Why did Marvin get to the foul line 3 times as often as Childress against Boston? Was he getting fouled taking midrange jumpers?

[Cwell]

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Lmao get of of chillz nuts, i like him as a 6th man but he is not better than marvin. Marvin can actually shoot. You guys are always talking about how timid marvin is and if chillz shot more he could be better. Theres a reason he doesnt shoot it if he is gaurded. Marvin brings way more to the table than chillz. The only reason that he is not 20 ppg scorer like all of you wish he is is because he is playing behind joe, smith, bibby, and potentially al. The guy has all the skills, hes just in the wrong place at the wrong time. Even though he is fuuckin 21 and chillz is like 25 or something. And you always talk about how clumsy marvin is. Well smoove is just as clumsy and even more stupid.

totally clueless post.Do u even know what clumsy means?

[Supporter]

Doesnt clumsy mean carelessness. Smith is just as careless as marvin. Smith passes terribly, he always has a risk factor. By the age of 30 he will still be like this. Clumsy means that you dont have a high basketball iq. Marvins is decent smith's is very low. Do you see marvin constantly going one on one with everyone no because he knows what it means to be on a team. Smith is way more of a danger because he has his good moments but it is nuetralized by his bad moments. Take smith out and marvin will flourish book it...

[Cwell]

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Doesnt clumsy mean carelessness. Smith is just as careless as marvin. Smith passes terribly, he always has a risk factor. By the age of 30 he will still be like this. Clumsy means that you dont have a high basketball iq. Marvins is decent smith's is very low. Do you see marvin constantly going one on one with everyone no because he knows what it means to be on a team. Smith is way more of a danger because he has his good moments but it is nuetralized by his bad moments. Take smith out and marvin will flourish book it...

lol no it doesn't.The clumsy guy is the guy always tripping over his feet,has no balance and is always falling and out of control.Smith is a graceful player,not clumsy.wow u just invented a new definition for a word that everyone should have learned in elementary school if even that late.Marvin doesn't go one on one because he's clumsy and can't win,he'll trip and fall trying to drive and he looks so retarded it LOOKS like he got fouled.The guy can't even run or walk normal.

[Supporter]

lol by no way is smith graceful, i dont even know why i call him smoove, he is not graceful. if you wanna know gracefull look at jj's game, he glides on the coart. I admit that i overestimated marvins gracefulness but smoove is defenately not graceful. The dude dribbles off his own foot and doesnt know how to run a fast break. Hes so dumb and never gives it to the point gaurd unlike al horford.