Lets look at what we have

[Diesel]

The only thing that has changed since dream team 1 is that the US have stopped sending the Best. I mean, Dream team 2 featured Derrick Coleman and Timmy Hardaway.

However, if we put:

Shaq/Duncan/KG/Kidd/Tmac/Kobe/Iverson/Payton/Francis/Webber/James & Mello

on a plane and sent them to Europe and had them play every European Team three times, do you think that they would lose any game?

[cyman3]

"He might start, but he probably won't be worthy"

- the only reason I see him starter worthy is b/c he played professional basketball (i agree with u in that EUROBALL isint the same level as NBA, but it has improved over the years... that explains the whole "lets draft foreign players" theory. If they're gettin better, NBA is the next step!). Another reason i see him as a starter is because of his defense/point-forward type game. A third reason is b/c the only other SF we have on our team is Chris Crawford and hes always hurt. A fourth reason is because he was MVP in his league, MVP of anything is very good. LeBron James was "MVP (i guess u can say)" in his high school league. Im not tryin to suggest that hes as good as JAMES...

im just saying that the guy is VERY YOUNG and u shouldnt give up on the kid without even watchin him. Its like judging a book by its cover... c'mon, the ONLY reason u dislike him is because

A)ur different- since most of us like him, u have be an outcast

B)u wanted Josh Howard

C)hes a EURO-PLAYER and u dont know much about him....

----------------------------------------------------------

"level of Play in Europe is somehow equal to that in the US, it's laughable"

- the concept of TEAM GAME is absolutely beautiful in europe. In the US, the whole ONE-ON-ONE/PURE ATHLETICISM is beautiful.

[cyman3]

first off... Dream Team 1 is the best team ever assembled in the history of BASKETBALL. nothing compares to DT1.

we lost in the World Championship Games... while we didnt send Shaq/Kobe/McGrady/Iverson/etc... but we did indeed send allstars. They werent the best players in each position we have in the NBA, but they were top 5 in each position... and were CLEARLY allstars (im defining allstar as a player that made the allstar team or very capable of making the allstar team in the NBA).

If the other team played better than us and beat us with our allstars, they (the ones that can play) should be able to come here and compete with the best...

[Playmaker0017]

Trace,

If you watched those games, you will know that hlaf of Daiw's turnovers came from the way he dribbled.

They allow more of a carry in the French League. It will develop, but it wasn't from Daiw throwing the ball into the second row.

Of course, this has little bearing on how he will compete on the NBA level, I just thought we ought to call apples - apples...

Play.

[Diesel]

If the US sent it's best to play against the world,

There is no team that could stay within 20 points. And that's the bottom line. Yes, there are some good players around the world. Yes, Dirk is good. Yes, Peja is good. But these are sprinkles compared to what the US have. The best thing that these guys overseas have going for them is that nodody really knows what their true level of competition is. I mean for example (hypothetically) if Pietrus averages 20/6/6 in France what exactly does that mean? And how does that compare to the NBA. Nobody really knows. I mean, I was shocked to find out that Reggie Geary and a few other scrubbs who couldn't make it in the NBA were Celebrated Stars overseas.... Even Darius Songalia. So what does that say.

That says that when I'm at Piedmont Park with Xray Hipp, Jame Forrest, Ace Custis, and Dejuan Wheat, our Piedmont Park team could probably go to France and be a dominant team.

Jason Kapono was right. He should have dropped out of UCLA, went to Europe, Grew a beard, played 2 years and changed his name to Vladimir Kaponivich and he would have been drafted 1st.

[Traceman]

If the move he made when he carried the ball against CLE would have been legal in the French League, Jordan, AI, Kobe, Etc would have averaged 50+ a game over there! Both Jaywalker and I cracked up when Diaw made that move because it was so obvious that he carried the ball.

In fairness to Diaw, it's not like he was surrounded by a lot of scorers on our summer league team who could benefit from his passing ability. Of course trading our leading scorer is not going to help him there either once the real season begins. He is going to have to be able to knock down open shots to be effective on this team. Time will tell if he will be able to do that any time soon.

[Playmaker0017]

Diesel,

Let's squash this theory that ANYONE is saying that the other leagues are just as good as the American leagues.

They aren't.

We devote our lives to sports. They do not.

We have twice the population and resources to allow people to play sports compared to some of those places that rpoduce players.

Heck, Canada has the population of northern California.

What we are saying is that they are competitive now. Quit turning a simple statement into a world ender. There is NO QUESTION that the level of competitive basketball and knowledge of fundementals in the United States has plummeted. While the converse statement about the rest of the world also holds true.

That doesn't mean that it has reached an equilibrium point, and it probably never will. Heck, no one in those leagues across the globe make what our star atheletes make nor do they typically have the celebrity status... thus not as many people aspire to this loafty goal.

But, the other leagues are gaining in respect and talent, while stateside we are losing.

Plain and simple.

If you don't believe it, then let's challenge you to create a dream team with current day rosters that would have competed with dream team one.

Play.

[Playmaker0017]

Trace,

I love how people label Big Dog as "our leading scorer". He was our leading scorer in points only, he didn't earn those points. He stole them. He hoisted up 20 shots a game to get that number, and he was never supposed to hoist it 20 times a game. He STOLE the shots.

Sure, he made a dumb move... heck, I've watched Jordan take four steps. I've watched Kidd forget to dribble. I've seen AI do his "legal" crossover...

We all make mistakes, especially when we try too hard. Especially when it is all new.

Give the kid a chance. Heck, he still is learning English. He's only 19. Give him time.

He may be a contributer... he may not. He was a late pick... anyone we could have picked could be a bust or the man.

Someone drafted later than Daiw will probably baffle us all... and Diesel will say "I told you. We could have picked that guy." But, hindsight is 20/20. And that late in the draft it is like flipping a coin.

Play.

[Diesel]

In reply to:

---

Things have changed since Dream Team 1. I hate to say it, but the American players don't have the understanding of the game. This is a direct result of the AAU environment and the playground environment. Coaches don't teach players the proper way. You rarely see a good set jump shot anymore. American players are too "one-on-one".

International players learn the fundamentals that current young American players lack.

Now that the athleticism is catching up to the fundamentals, they are simply producing a higher number of better players.

---

-KB21

What were you saying about ANYONE. Before you try to play superman and defend the defenseless, you need to look at what they are saying play. I find it very funny that KB would even suggest that European players are on the same level as US players. He goes so far to say they are BEtter??? MY gosh. Does he not know?

[Diesel]

Josh Howard.

Travis Outlaw.

Jason Kapono

Marquis Daniels

will all be better players than Diaw.

I feel it's a mistake to draft a player to compliment another player and pass up the best player.

It's like Passing up Micheal Jordan to take Sam Bowie.

What happens if we don't sign JT.... IS Diaw still the best player for the Hawks??

If you're honest, you will note that Josh Howard would have been the perfect pick for us. ACC player of the YEAR! That's the best player from the best Division.

[Playmaker0017]

Diesel,

First off, take off your little "signature" that is trying to point out you think another poster on this board is dumb. It isn't cool.

Second, Yes, they have produced players that are better than lots of American players.

Are they the elite of the elite of the elite? No, but only two or three current players match that name right now.

Also, I think you misunderstood the context of KB's sentence. I think he was using the word "higher" in reference to the past as well as the term "better" as compared to what the other leagues were producing in the past.

There was a time when we were the only country that could play ball. The notion of other leagues was stupid. This is slowly changing.

Just like the NHL. Canada used to be the sole contributer. Then it was North America. Now, the rest of the world holds the elite spots.

These countries don't place the same emphasis on sports that we do, but it doesn't mean that they don't have skill.

The sheer notion that in the 5 or 6 billion people on this planet that we hold the monopoly on athletics.

Play.

[Playmaker0017]

Diesel,

And everyone else should have taken Josh Howard too. I mean, he IS the BEST player from the BEST division, right?

Then why did so many teams not draft him?

I do not equate drafting Daiw instead of Howard as passing MJ. At least not at this point.

No one knows how these guys will play in the NBA. Some might not make teams a year from now.

You may turn out to be correct. But, the simple fact is... the guy got drafted for a reason. Hopefully, he can live up to that. You haven't even seen the kid play, and you trash him like he might as well not suit up for the games.

Play.

[cyman3]

I like PlayMakers attitude when it comes to these posts...

yo DIESEL, if u agree that DIRK/PEJA are allstars in this league (they're not the greatest players but they are allstars)... why cant u accept the fact that EUROPLAYERS are capable of comin in and contributin in a big way?

were u hopin that DIAW becomes a KOBE BRYANT/TRACY MCGRADY?

c'mon, he was a mid-late first rounder... wat u expect?

As for the guys u wanted on that list... just wait til the season starts b4 u make strong bold statements like that. who knows? they could turn out to be a bust.

All i know is that KNIGHT has seen the guy play and has seen the other guys play (other guys = guys that could potentially be available with our pick...)... after testing them out, he chose DIAW.

Im willing to let Knight evaluate talent b4 u diesel....

[Playmaker0017]

Diesel,

I wish you made the rules for Vegas... I really do.

I basically have intimated that every player at that point was a crap shoot. A flip of a coin.

So, you list 4 guys. So, if you flip a quarter four times... is there a chance you will get at least one head and one tail?

Chances are that one of those players will be better, based simply on the 25% rule.

But, throwing them all out there so you can come back and say... see I was right... Travis Outlaw IS better - while the others are not... heck... it is like playing blackjack with four hands and paying for one.

Play.