Al Horford has to play PF - exclusivly

[DJlaysitup]

If we are going to make this thing work - Al Horford has to ONLY play PF next year. We can argue all day long about who the SF will be - but A.H. needs to be a PF (only).

Games are about matchups and A.H. at PF is a matchup in our favor. Woody/ASG/BK/whoever have screwed up A.H. long enough. I would guess that A.H. can be a fairly dominant PF within 30 games of playing the position exclusively....but it may take longer and we have p!ssed away HIS potential waiting on others.

Personally I don't care if we have to start Zaza and back him up with Collins - A.H. has to play PF.

(of course I would prefer we get another/better C)

P.S. - "Exclusively" just got away from me in the title - my bad ....still not sure if I know how to spell it :biggrin:

Edited July 11, 2010 by DJlaysitup

[tbhawksfan]

Seems like trading Smoove is the solution to the problem.

[DJlaysitup]

Seems like trading Smoove is the solution to the problem.

Like I said tb....the SF situation and the C situation is what our managers and owners have to figure out. I'm not saying one thing or the other on this thread about that - only that Al Horford should be playing PF next year from the gitgo.

[tbhawksfan]

I'm with you on moving Horf to PF.

Zaza / MLE

Horf /

Smoove / MW / Mo

JJ / JC / JC

Teague / Bibby

...doesn't play better than horf and Smoove at C/PF. If you want Horford to play PF, we have to upgrade the C situation big time. Zaza and no one won't do it. Then, there's Smoove getting 16 or so minutes at SF.....

[gsuteke]

If some of the old hs guard show this could become a 12 page thread - easy

[Brokentree]

You can't take someone that CAN play Center in the NBA and just play him at PF. It is just too hard to find a good Center that doesn't foul out in 10 minutes. You could put Dwight Howard on the Hawks and I still think Al would have to play Center for 5-10 minutes a game. Having a flexible lineup and being able to play different positions is a strength.

That being said.. if..

Josh Smith is traded to N.O. along with Bibby (and draft picks?) for Chris Paul. (not likely especially considering they'd have to trade West or play Smith at sf there)

Josh Childress and Jamal Crawford are traded to Cleveland for AV and Shaq. (AV is one of their better players but if they want to make changes then getting an expiring contract for next year might be a plus. Jamal's scoring ability might be able to distract some of their fans from the Lebron saga as well)

PG- Paul 30m+, Teague 10m+

SG- JJ 30m+, Jordan Crawford 10m+

SF- Marvin 30m+, JJ 5m+

PF- Horford 30m+, AV 10m+

C-Shaq 20m+, AV 10m+, Zaza 10m+, Horford 10m+

Sprinkle in the rest of the bench as needed. Less overall flexibility but a stronger and more mentally tough starting lineup.

It's not likely that this scenario would play out, and I'm more 50/50 that I'd even want it to, but it's this type of scenario that would have to play out for Horford to play PF minutes.

[High5]

Horford is too good at center to move unless we can replace him with a legit defensive center. That's not Zaza.

[DJlaysitup]

Horford is too good at center to move unless we can replace him with a legit defensive center. That's not Zaza.

You would have Secretariat plowing a field with that logic.

[exodus]

First of all Horford just made the All-Star team at center. Secondly he isn't going to be a dominant player at the 4 because his back to the basket game is weak.

The problem right now is that Al is playing pretty exclusively at center. That doesnt hurt him in terms of scoring but it does hurt him on defense because he frequently has to fight for position against much bigger/stronger players and i think it wears him down over the course of the season.

Zaza is a garbage can. the Hawks need a true center to come in and play 20+ minutes a game at the center spot and be productive. I cant see any scenario where Horford isn't playing at least 15 minutes at center. But 20+ minutes at center is probably too much IMO.

[DrReality]

Depends on what offense they run. If they go up tempo Al is a great guy to have in there to get down the court. But I'm with you re a center.

[Jody23]

Al's back to the basket game is not great against centers, but against power forwards, it's a different story. When guarded by 4's in the post last season (David Lee for example), Horford usually got whatever position and shot he wanted and commanded a double team. He did the same thing to Lamarcus Aldridge when he got switched onto Horford. Power forwards are not strong enough to guard him on the block and Horford knows it where as it's another matter against centers. The numbers he put up against David Lee were not from facing up, they were on post ups.

[High5]

You would have Secretariat plowing a field with that logic.

Is Horford a better PF than a C? Sure. Is Horford so much better at PF than C? No. Is the gap worth the huge drop off at C when Zaza starts? Hell no.

My logic = a better team than your logic.

[exodus]

Al's back to the basket game is not great against centers, but against power forwards, it's a different story. When guarded by 4's in the post last season (David Lee for example), Horford usually got whatever position and shot he wanted and commanded a double team. He did the same thing to Lamarcus Aldridge when he got switched onto Horford. Power forwards are not strong enough to guard him on the block and Horford knows it where as it's another matter against centers. The numbers he put up against David Lee were not from facing up, they were on post ups.

David Lee = a chair on defense. When Smith has missed games Horford has started at the 4 and hasn't shown anything out of the ordinary. During the 08/09 season Smith missed a lot of games and Horford had plenty of time to play the 4. His production at the 4 was less than his production at the 5.

http://www.82games.com/0809/08ATL12.HTM#bypos

LOL @ bringing up Portland. Horfords best ever game against them was 15 points when Oden played big minutes. He hasn't done crap against Aldridge.

[High5]

David Lee = a chair on defense. When Smith has missed games Horford has started at the 4 and hasn't shown anything out of the ordinary. During the 08/09 season Smith missed a lot of games and Horford had plenty of time to play the 4. His production at the 4 was less than his production at the 5.

http://www.82games.com/0809/08ATL12.HTM#bypos

LOL @ bringing up Portland. Horfords best ever game against them was 15 points when Oden played big minutes. He hasn't done crap against Aldridge.

His production was lower because he was playing next to Zaza instead of Josh. Zaza doesn't scare anyone offensively. He's good for some put backs, but not much more. Still it would be worthwhile if Zaza could contain guys like Howard, but he can't do that either.

[Jody23]

David Lee = a chair on defense. When Smith has missed games Horford has started at the 4 and hasn't shown anything out of the ordinary. During the 08/09 season Smith missed a lot of games and Horford had plenty of time to play the 4. His production at the 4 was less than his production at the 5.

http://www.82games.com/0809/08ATL12.HTM#bypos

LOL @ bringing up Portland. Horfords best ever game against them was 15 points when Oden played big minutes. He hasn't done crap against Aldridge.

I wasn't talking about his numbers versus Portland, I was talking about a few possessions when Aldridge got switched onto Horford. Also, during the 08-09 season, when Smoove was out, Horford put up 27 and 17 against the Bulls at the 4 in only his second season. Outside of that period, Horford's never had a chance to play exclusively at the four. Also, Horford was getting very few touches on the block that year.

[DJlaysitup]

First of all Horford just made the All-Star team at center. Secondly he isn't going to be a dominant player at the 4 because his back to the basket game is weak....

Wow ex - you are just simply disregarding reality again. Why did Al Horford make the all-star team at center? I dunno - duh - because that's the only place we played him y'think?

And yes - his "back to the basket game" is weak - because he's 6 FOOT NINE and a natural PF. If we had a CENTER he wouldn't be backing down 7-footers.

How hard is this to understand?:angry22:

[DJlaysitup]

Anticipated ex response (since even he knows I'm right he can't admit it)

"A.H. has never played PF in the NBA and we don't know how he might do"

[Johnnybravo4]

We have no evidence whatsover that he is a better PF than center. He wouldn't be faster or stronger than most PF's and his offensive game is limited at best.

[High5]

He wouldn't be faster or stronger than most PF's

Yes he would.

[Joker]

First of all Horford just made the All-Star team at center. Secondly he isn't going to be a dominant player at the 4 because his back to the basket game is weak.

The problem right now is that Al is playing pretty exclusively at center. That doesnt hurt him in terms of scoring but it does hurt him on defense because he frequently has to fight for position against much bigger/stronger players and i think it wears him down over the course of the season.

Zaza is a garbage can. the Hawks need a true center to come in and play 20+ minutes a game at the center spot and be productive. I cant see any scenario where Horford isn't playing at least 15 minutes at center. But 20+ minutes at center is probably too much IMO.

So many PF's have amazing back to the basket game like Z. Randolph, Al Jefferson, and wait, who else? Great post, you did it again, you defy human logic with assurance.