PROPOSITION: Just as the ABA blessed the game w/ the 3 pt shot, NOW is the time for TBT to bless the game w/ the target score ("Elam") ending

[sturt]

[Gray Mule]

STURT

One simple change that I would like to see:  In a regular NBA game, when a player reaches 6 fouls, he has "Fouled out" and can't play any more.  I would change it this way:  In each overtime, each player dressed out shall receive one extra foul.  That player that had fouled out in regulation would have one foul added in each overtime period.  Also, all other players would gain one foul for each overtime period.

[sturt]

4 minutes ago, Gray Mule said:

STURT

One simple change that I would like to see:  In a regular NBA game, when a player reaches 6 fouls, he has "Fouled out" and can't play any more.  I would change it this way:  In each overtime, each player dressed out shall receive one extra foul.  That player that had fouled out in regulation would have one foul added in each overtime period.  Also, all other players would gain one foul for each overtime period.

 

 

Eliminate overtimes.

Elam ending.

It's a simple change of its own.

And all players eligible for the target score period... preferably under the parameters just suggested above, but even if you keep the 6-foul elimination, make that apply only until the target score period.

 

[shakes]

I love the Elam ending in the TBT tournament.  Lots of fun and every game ends on a made basket.

 

I would love to see the NBA bring it in for OT.  I'd also be totally cool with OT being reduced to 2 or 3 minutes. 5 minute OT sucks.

 

And teams should get ZERO timeouts in OT.

[swanlee]

I really hate adding arbitrary crap to OTs in sports. Just play until one team has more points within a given timeframe or do sudden death for sports like Soccer and Football.

College Football crazy rules, baseball just sticking a player on second base just because, the NFL going away from sudden death OT.

Makes no real sense, has no real continuity wIth the rules of the game, somebody just made up some crap and that's about it.

Wish we could just go back to simple OT.

Edited February 15, 2023 by swanlee

[sturt]

Baseball, we agree, is offending a fundamental principle of their game... runners must  earn their way on to base.

Football, we agree, is all over the place, and too indecisive about their OT. (They would do well to consider a version of Elam ending, imo, but that's another thread on another forum on another day.)

 

As for the rest, Elam ending is nothing more than combining two familiar ways of finishing a game: playing until the buzzer, or playing until one team or the other gets to some score both agreed to play until.

It's effectively saying (given my proposal above), "Let's play 45 minutes, 9 minutes at a time, then in order to win, whoever is winning after 45 minutes has to score 7 more points before the other team can beat them to whatever that total is."

It's growing in popularity, not shrinking, and that's for reasons, plural. It keeps games from getting drawn out with a barrage of last 3-minutes fouls, and it keeps games from going to overtime in the first place. It's not a fad. It's a rational solution to problems virtually all of us would prefer to eliminate.

 

More food for thought...

https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2022/12/poll-should-nba-adopt-elam-ending-for-overtime.html

 

https://www.insidehook.com/article/sports/why-best-players-love-all-star-game-elam-ending

 

[AHF]

I don't know that I'm up for the 5 nine minute periods where you can only play 4 of them and if you get two fouls in a period you can be disqualified from playing for the rest of it, etc. but I do like the Elam system for ending games.  I'd be frankly fine having it be the same four quarters but at the 3 minute mark left in the game the score is set for an Elam ending.

[sturt]

4 minutes ago, AHF said:

and if you get two fouls in a period you can be disqualified from playing for the rest of it,

 

On 2/14/2023 at 12:33 PM, sturt said:

the over-the-limit fouler benched for a minimum of one (if an "and-1" foul) or two offensive possessions immediately following the foul.

 

One of these things is not like the other.

 

[sturt]

Target score ending is about to get its annual post-ASG go-round in the national press... just be advised.

In the lead-up to that, enjoy...

 

 

 

[JTB]

Keep it the same. Changing too much will kill the game.

what’s in place works in my opinion. If people are so upset about End of game bad calls then maybe we should be discussing about the nba getting new and better refs.

[sturt]

5 hours ago, JTB said:

so upset about End of game bad calls

Huh? Not following. This wouldn't eliminate end of game bad calls.

 

 

(You might be spending too much time around shakes???... dunno.)

 

What I said was...

12 hours ago, sturt said:

It all really works together to elevate the quality of the game when you

(a) eliminate overtimes

(b) eliminate end-of-game foul-shot-fests (in the attempt for the losing team to come back)

(c) still retain the opportunity for stunning comebacks

(d) recalibrate the framework of the game such that coaches are compelled to incorporate more of the team, in this so-called "team" game

(e) add to the strategic element by granting the option to trade-off foul shots for sitting an opposing fouler down for a possession or two

and (f) eliminate eliminating players from participating from the rest of the game (ie, "fouling out"), generally ensuring that the best players are finishing games for their teams

And there's not a one of those things in that list that isn't a positive  for the game, right? Not one.

[JTB]

12 hours ago, sturt said:

Huh? Not following. This wouldn't eliminate end of game bad calls.

 

 

(You might be spending too much time around shakes???... dunno.)

 

What I said was...

And there's not a one of those things in that list that isn't a positive  for the game, right? Not one.

What exactly do you mean by “end of games foul shot fest in attempt for the losing team to come back” ?

are you referring to “hack a Shaq” strategies at the end of game’s opponents use to come back ? 

[sturt]

1 hour ago, JTB said:

What exactly do you mean by “end of games foul shot fest in attempt for the losing team to come back” ?

.... You sure you don't know very well what I mean? Now c'mon, JTB. It's me. You can be real with me.

 

 

Okay, okay. This. Just for example, but yeah, an especially vivid example..........................

 

 

(You're the second person in the last week who has asked me this, and I have to just say, it's surprising to have to explain... this is just conventionally understood how NBA (and NCAA) basketball is and has been forever to one degree or another. It has been notable, though, that in both cases the overall topic/context was target score ending.)

 

So, I'm naturally led to think it's just a temporary confusion attributable to not wanting to acknowledge that reason is solidly in the corner of this admittedly major change... and look, I'm that guy who so steadfastly refused to go along with the designated hitter in baseball that he abandoned his team of 40+ years when they moved to the American League... so/but that wasn't because I'm a traditionalist (though in some ways I certainly am) so much as it was that reason supported not imploding the strategic component of a game that, otherwise w/o pitchers batting, starves for strategy.

 

Change is fine if the advantages are, indeed, advantages and not just new for the sake of new... it has to actually address legitimate problems, and it has to do so without (as in the case of the designated hitter) having unintended consequences so substantial as to make it a net negative (eg, the almost complete elimination of the importance of managerial strategy in MLB)... and, it's so so much better to have had a trial run so that we've actually eyeballed what the outcomes look like, and it's not just a great decision in theory.

 

Target score ending meets all those criteria.

 

Now, it's time to talk about how it actually gets implemented, and my suggestion is that there are other ills of the game that we can resolve simultaneously with two other recalibrations that fold neatly into the overall package... think of it as a drug cocktail that almost miraculously cures heart blockages, but with a couple of other complementary chemicals, also makes your overall circulation better so that your blood pressure stabilizes, and at the same time, bolsters the immune system to be able to fight infections. The analogy holds, it really does.

 

(Certainly I don't mind a G-League trial run for the other two changes advocated here. Rather, I think that's wise.)

[sturt]

Aside... same guy, right?