2007-2008 issues with the Hawks by Diesel

[Diesel]

I think anybody who sees our team needs to recognize that there are some issues...

1. When do we trade. A trade is inevitable. Weather it's trading some of our ending contracts, trading either Smoove, Chillz, or Shelden for Contract reasons, trading for a defensive big, or just trading to clear up some of our logjammed space... a trade is a coming. My personal feeling is that we should not trade until closer to the deadline OR if a team has a player that is good however, they no longer want. In a perfect world, there's a trade somewhere for Yao Ming... but that world doesn't exist.. Well, what does exist is:

There's a bunch of guys who we can get right now...

1. Maggette... Thornton is making Maggette tradable.

2. Artest... IF we want to deal with Crazy, it's available.

3. Nazr... Speedy for Nazr is open all day.

4. Fesenko... I don't know if he's available, but I would like to know.

5. Swift.. Either Swift, Petro, or Sena is available. In fact, if we were to make an offer, we could probably get One of them and Ridnour.

6. Frye and McRoberts....

7. Name a Knick.

2. What do we do about Center?

I don't think Horf is a Center. I think he'd do better at PF. We will see. I think if Zaza's healthy, he should play.

3. How long do we give Woody?

There's no point in lying, Woody is going to have to keep a 94% winning percentage for 3 months to convince people that he's the right man for the job. We finally have the talent, the question is do we have the coaching?

[DJlaysitup]

Well I'm no trade guru...but I think our two spots of concern are PG and Center.

Hold it!...what year is this?

[Hawk88]

I think we need to make a coaching change and see what good coaching can get out of these guys.

I hate the idea of trading any of the players with Woody as the coach. I think Woody is going to cost us a lot of games, why not make the change now?

[swolehawk2]

We have had tons of players come through, good and bad...the one constant is that we have not had a proven coach since Lenny.

[Guest Walter]

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I think we need to make a coaching change and see what good coaching can get out of these guys.

I hate the idea of trading any of the players with Woody as the coach. I think Woody is going to cost us a lot of games, why not make the change now?

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If Woody does not win immediately we can him. We can't change now without giving him a chance, but the chance shouldn't take up so much of the season the players couldn't be judged well under a (temporary) replacement.

There is no doubt that Woody is BK's firewall. The longer he keeps him the less he has to answer for himself.

W

[Zone034life]

As for #5, I would trade Shelden,Salim(or Speedy if at all possible) Lowright for Petro/Swift/Sene and Luke ridnour. I would do this trade even if you couldn't get ridnour.Sene probaly fits the shot blocking best but Petro does as well. Swift is the most offensive of the group but that isn't more important than defense.

[jerrywest]

Sene has the body but he doesn't understand the game. Against Lakers last week (on TNT) he played like a person who doesn't belong in the NBA.

[AnakinJoe]

If it were up to me, I'd go with an offense/defense platoon (sorry for the baseball term) at center this season. Zaza and Player X. Too bad Kelvin Cato seemingly can't provide 18 minutes a game. He'd be ideal and cheap.

The longer term solution at center comes with the decision to trade Marvin or Smith. And I don't see either traded while still earning rookie dollars.

We'll probably stay pat until January with players. Woody would get about the same time before I'd replace him with Drew. Don't expect a brand name coach to come here until the ownership nonsense is resolved. Watch what happens with the Thrashers. And don't be surprised if Waddell ends up playing double-duty for the remainder of the season.

[Diesel]

I think there's a fairness to allowing Woody 2 more months. I think the thing is that he was given a bad situation and told to train. Well, he's done training (I suppose) and now it's time to see what he can do with a good situation. I don't think injuries will be a factor any longer as it pertains to a coaching change.

My Shortlist:

1. Paul Westhead.

2. Del Harris.

3. Terry Porter.

4. Alvin Gentry

5. Kenny Smith

[Traceman]

makes us better. We won't have to really make a decision about possible trades until we find out what it will take to resign Smoove and Chillz next year. I still think it is entirely possible we can resign that duo for a combined $16.5M ($10M for Smoove, $6.5M for Chillz) a season to start next year and if we can, we can have the core of this team back together again for the 08-09 season.

In 09-10, you have to make a decision on Marvin but worse case scenario, if you don't resign Zaza (or if you cut bait with Shelden), the additional money for Marvin is there.

People keep insisting that we have to make trades or that we won't be able to resign all of our core players but the way the salary cap is set up, I'm not so sure that is the case. A lot of players are finding it VERY difficult to get the money they thought they were going to get as restricted FAs and I have a feeling our guys will find that out as well.

In addition, one thing that BK has done EXTREMELY well is manage the salary cap. We are NOWHERE NEAR the luxury tax and we won't be anywhere near the luxury tax if we resign Smoove, Chillz and Marvin. At this point, as long as this group proves it can win, I wouldn't worry about any trades until it is time for Horford and Law to get their 2nd contracts.

[emeans]

Well Said and very good analysis Traceman.....We don't need to trade anyone right now Diesel!! Maybe trade the coach, but that is it.

We will be able to keep the nucleus of this team together especially if we win this year.

NO trades please!!!

[Diesel]

I think it would be foolish to go into this year with the idea of no trades. Realistically: Lo, Lue, AJ, and Salim have ending contracts. A couple fo them have real value. We have to strongly consider that trading these guys could be a vehicle for making this team better.

[Traceman]

The combined salaries of Lo, Lue, AJ and Salim is $10.38M. If that salary is not on the books next year, we can use that money to resign Smoove. Why trade those guys for someone like Magette, Artest or any of the other players you suggested rather than keeping it to give to Smoove?

So you are right, all 4 of our ending contracts have value - but their biggest value might be that they will allow us the flexibility to resign all of our key FAs without exceeding the salary cap.

[drzachary]

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I think there's a fairness to allowing Woody 2 more months. I think the thing is that he was given a bad situation and told to train. Well, he's done training (I suppose) and now it's time to see what he can do with a good situation. I don't think injuries will be a factor any longer as it pertains to a coaching change.

My Shortlist:

1. Paul Westhead.

2. Del Harris.

3. Terry Porter.

4. Alvin Gentry

5. Kenny Smith

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I gotta smile at your #1. You know, Jeff Fryer (my all-time favorite player on any level) has been coaching women's hoops. Maybe he could join the coaching staff on the WNBA franchise and it will be a LMU reunion?

[cowa]

I'm totally on board with Diesel on this one. If we don't trade one of our two expiring PG contracts as well as Lo, we would just be letting them walk for nothing (except cap space). The key is to look for teams that are over the luxury tax threshold, but have no chance at the playoffs. Since no team feels they are out it now (sans Minnesota), there won't be any trades of these guys until the trade deadline.

Do we really want to trade a PG with Acie having ice on his wrist and Lue just coming back, and Speedy no where in sight? I would trade Lo today, but I don't see any takers.

Sene is a stiff right now, and I'm sure Seattle would be willing to let him go, but not now. They want to see more of him this year, and they have a team option on him for next year. He only costs them $2.1M, so there's no rush. If I'm trading with Seattle, I want Swift, Petro or Wilcox, not Sene. Too much of a project.

The teams that will probably be looking to dump salary are Minnesota, Philly, Indy and maybe Denver.

[AHF]

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So you are right, all 4 of our ending contracts have value - but their biggest value might be that they will allow us the flexibility to resign all of our key FAs without exceeding the salary cap.

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Agreed. This would be easier to know if we knew the ASG budget for the next few years, but if it is a limited budget keeping Josh Smith ranks higher than adding players other teams are looking to unload.

[Diesel]

Being that he is our own FA, we can resign him anyway. Moreover, the question is not can we resign Smoove. The question is will he resign with us. The Answer to that question is "IF WE WIN".

You're proposing to holding on to "deadweight" on the court and turning down players who can help us to win just so that we can say.. we have a better shot at resigning.

IF Winning is our goal, we have to do what winning teams do. That means signing players who can help us win instead of keeping the norm.

[Peoriabird]

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the question is not can we resign Smoove. The question is will he resign with us.

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Am I missing something? Is the concept of RFA that difficult?

[Traceman]

PHO COULD have resigned JJ and CHI COULD have resigned Curry and Chandler. However, they chose not to resign those guys because they knew what the salary cap ramifications would be.

As for Smoove, he has no choice in the matter until after next season because we can match any offer he gets next year and we are much more likely to match a huge offer he gets if the salary cap ramifications are not that bad.

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You're proposing to holding on to "deadweight" on the court and turning down players who can help us to win just so that we can say.. we have a better shot at resigning.

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I don't see our ending contracts as "dead weight" but rather as insurance. Sign Smoove to a contract before the deadline and I am MUCH more willing to consider trades - though I still wouldn't trade just to be trading because we still have Chillz (and Marvin) to deal with in the relatively near future.

Finally, I am not so sure that the players you have proposed that we trade for will help us win. Artest is a cancer, particularly for a youn team, and he didn't help his team win jack last year. Maggette didn't help his team win last year despite them having tons of talent. Nazr couldn't get off the bench in DET. Swift, Petro and Sene have never played for a winner and none have proven to be the answer for their teams at Center - why would they be any better for us? Same goes for Frye and Roberts.

I'm glad that you are not our GM because you would have us looking like the NY Knicks - a team in salary cap hell with a bunch of overpaid players. The problem is that while Dolan can afford for the Knicks to lose tons of money every year, this ownership group can't afford a payroll like that.

[AHF]

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the question is not can we resign Smoove. The question is will he resign with us.

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Am I missing something? Is the concept of RFA that difficult?

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Look at the Phoenix Suns trade of 2 first round picks and Kurt Thomas for a second rounder to see what Traceman is talking about. If there is an unlimited budget this is not a concern at all - go ahead and add all the salary in the world. If there is a limited budget, then I would definitely take future costs into consideration before adding additional future salary.