Does Bud see a similar scouting report? (Kelly Oubre Jr.)

[JTB]

I'm not trying to overhype anything! But I'm sitting here at my desk looking through this draft class and I just could not help but to notice how all of these scouting reports on Kelly Oubre are EXTREMELY similar to Kawhi Leonard!

Seriously! Different sites all have extremely similar reports on strengths and weaknesses that Oubre and Leonard share....its damn near amazing in my opinion.

I knew of this kid like many others and never had anything against him but I can't lie....I'm more intrigued with him especially if he's available and Bud drafts him! Then I know what's up!

Anyways I'm not trying to create any buzz but just take the time and compare scouting reports for Oubre vs Leonard....maybe I'm late but I can swear it will seem like your reading a scouting report on the same damn player coming out of college except one is a lefty and the other is a righty.

[NBASupes]

Their not similar. It's hard to compare Oubre. He's clearly worse than Harrison Barnes and Ben McLemore around the draft. Like he's literally a year away from being productive on a NBA court. Just as raw as Dennis. But his tools are elite especially on defensive tools. Bill Self said it best, he's a junkyard dog type who needs to embrace who he is instead of wanting to be something he isn't. He isn't Smoove or J.R. Smith, he doesn't take bad shots but he's need to understand situations better.

 

I see him like I see Dennis. He has top 5 potential at SG/SF but for him, the system, team and coaching matters. He is likely going to be the worst player on your roster Day 1. But with him, he can be top 10 on your roster by the middle of the season and top 7 in his 2nd year. He could be the best player on your roster in year three are he could barely improve and be an obvious bust.

 

His needs are:

A system where he isn't forced to create his offense.

A vet team which can let him grow at a solid rate while knowing how to do things the right way.

A strong team setting.

Time and given the freedom to make some mistakes and learn from them.

 

He is very similar to Dennis. Typical boom or bust. More times than not, they bust but in the right situation which Atlanta is, they tend to shine.

Edited June 23, 2015 by NBASupes

[Afro]

He has arms as long as Thabo.

I think he has 3 and D potential, and at 15, that's more than you can ask for.

Edited June 23, 2015 by Afro

[ATLien_]

Oubre scares the hell out of me. Everyone seems to just assume he's going to develop into a star, I'm not convinced this guy does one thing at a NBA level today. That's a lot to have to improve.

His best attribute is his length and athleticism, but the athleticism doesn't translate on the court for me. He has a decent vertical but doesn't seem particularly explosive, and seems more fast than quick on film. He's kind of a long strider. His lack of ball handling contributes to his athleticism not translating; the ball really slows him down. Also he's long but his frame projects as a SG to me. His shoulders aren't broad and I question how much good weight he can really add. He would have to add 20 pounds of muscle just to get to 225. Lebron just tossed Demaree around like a rag doll and you guys think Oubre can compete at SF. If you project him as a SG his ball handling goes from below average to bottom quarter of the league. His shot mechanics aren't ideal either.

With all that being said Sup is right he's the classic boom or bust pick. Kawhi defended, rebounded, and had size at a NBA level from day one. I'm not a fan of taking guys without 1 or 2 NBA ready skills on a veteran team, because you have to earn playing time to get better. If he sits the bench for 3 years developing he'll be almost a free agent anyway before he can contribute.

With all that being said I'm fine if we take him. I focused on his negatives only because everyone is acting like it's a no brainer. I don't believe his upside is that much greater than a lot of the others being mentioned for us that have more discernable NBA talent and college production. If anyone can get the most out of him it's the Hawks staff. He kind reminds me of a rich mans Kent Bazemore; a more fluid coordinated version.

[Guest]

I'm starting to think Oubre's gonna fall in line with the typical Kansas wing busts.

 

I keep reading how low his bbiq is and how he can't shoot.  Sounds more like Julian Wright (who?) than Andrew Wiggins.

 

http://www.si.com/college-basketball/2015/06/22/2015-nba-draft-scouting-reports-jahlil-okafor-karl-towns-emmanuel-mudiay

 

This 'anonymous' scout take wasn't eggsactly glowing ...

 

Kelly Oubre Jr., 6’7” forward, Kansas: “Kelly’s a real enigma in this draft. He’ll probably go right outside the lottery, but he’s still a long ways away from being a contributor at the NBA level. I want to like him, but I don’t trust his shot at all. He can’t guard anybody. Drove Bill Self out of his mind. Very intriguing athlete, but he doesn’t have any game off the dribble. He had a fairly disappointing season at a place where freshmen usually succeed.”

 

[NBASupes]

Oubre scares the hell out of me. Everyone seems to just assume he's going to develop into a star, I'm not convinced this guy does one thing at a NBA level today. That's a lot to have to improve.

His best attribute is his length and athleticism, but the athleticism doesn't translate on the court for me. He has a decent vertical but doesn't seem particularly explosive, and seems more fast than quick on film. He's kind of a long strider. His lack of ball handling contributes to his athleticism not translating; the ball really slows him down. Also he's long but his frame projects as a SG to me. His shoulders aren't broad and I question how much good weight he can really add. He would have to add 20 pounds of muscle just to get to 225. Lebron just tossed Demaree around like a rag doll and you guys think Oubre can compete at SF. If you project him as a SG his ball handling goes from below average to bottom quarter of the league. His shot mechanics aren't ideal either.

With all that being said Sup is right he's the classic boom or bust pick. Kawhi defended, rebounded, and had size at a NBA level from day one. I'm not a fan of taking guys without 1 or 2 NBA ready skills on a veteran team, because you have to earn playing time to get better. If he sits the bench for 3 years developing he'll be almost a free agent anyway before he can contribute.

With all that being said I'm fine if we take him. I focused on his negatives only because everyone is acting like it's a no brainer. I don't believe his upside is that much greater than a lot of the others being mentioned for us that have more discernable NBA talent and college production. If anyone can get the most out of him it's the Hawks staff. He kind reminds me of a rich mans Kent Bazemore; a more fluid coordinated version.

If he wasn't a boom or bust prospect and was polished, he would be a top 3 pick in any draft. 

 

 

 

His best attribute is his length and athleticism, but the athleticism doesn't translate on the court for me. He has a decent vertical but doesn't seem particularly explosive, and seems more fast than quick on film. He's kind of a long strider. His lack of ball handling contributes to his athleticism not translating; the ball really slows him down. Also he's long but his frame projects as a SG to me. His shoulders aren't broad and I question how much good weight he can really add. He would have to add 20 pounds of muscle just to get to 225. Lebron just tossed Demaree around like a rag doll and you guys think Oubre can compete at SF. If you project him as a SG his ball handling goes from below average to bottom quarter of the league. His shot mechanics aren't ideal either.

He is more fast than quick on offense. On defense, he has great lateral mobility when he's just letting the game come to him, something he struggles with on defense. Awareness is an issue for him. While his BBIQ is good on both sides of the court, his awareness is low and at times very low. Agree, the ball does slow him down which is attributed to his ball handling. In all my years of playing and watching players with great speed, ball handling with speed really can't be taught. Once someone is at a certain level, it is what it is. He can improve his iso handles but his overall handles in motion won't be much different than it is right now. Explosiveness off the bounce doesn't matter as much as your first step and he has an elite first step for his type of player. No one is going to confuse him for Stuckey or D. Wade. He is a SG to me as well but his handles limits him to SF in most systems. The Hawks are one of the few where he can play SG and not miss a beat as SG/SF is pretty much the same in our system. His shooting stroke and release is fine but his mechanics need to be cleaned up. Not an issue, see what we did with Dennis and Bazemore who were in much worse shape than Oubre's out of the draft. 

 

 

 

With all that being said Sup is right he's the classic boom or bust pick. Kawhi defended, rebounded, and had size at a NBA level from day one. I'm not a fan of taking guys without 1 or 2 NBA ready skills on a veteran team, because you have to earn playing time to get better.

If he sits the bench for 3 years developing he'll be almost a free agent anyway before he can contribute.

Leonard had a lot to work on as a rookie in the NBA. But as you mentioned he could defend and rebound from day one in the NBA but he wouldn't be close to what he became if he played for the Bobcats or a team like that. MKG, was better than Leonard as wekk as younger and more talented and look at him in the NBA. Barely improving while having a ton of talent. Where you land is 90% of the answer for Oubre as it was for MKG, Green, Leonard and other talented players who either succeeded or failed.

 

I can't agree that he will sit on the bench for three years. With solid development, he should be a decent NBA player who can give you good starts like less polished Khris Middleton. With Hawks like Dennis development, he could be a star in his 3rd season. That will make him completely worth the investment. 

[NBASupes]

I'm starting to think Oubre's gonna fall in line with the typical Kansas wing busts.

 

I keep reading how low his bbiq is and how he can't shoot.  Sounds more like Julian Wright (who?) than Andrew Wiggins.

 

http://www.si.com/college-basketball/2015/06/22/2015-nba-draft-scouting-reports-jahlil-okafor-karl-towns-emmanuel-mudiay

 

This 'anonymous' scout take wasn't eggsactly glowing ...

Bill Self: 

 

 

 

“I think that’s the one thing with Kelly that I want to see consistency with because he’s a good shooter, but that’s not who he is,” Self said. “He’s a junkyard dog. He can do a lot of things, and when he’s worried about those things it just seems so much more natural for him to jump up and make shots.”

http://www2.kusports.com/news/2015/feb/14/column-kelly-oubre-jr-needs-even-more-junkyard-dog/

[JTB]

Oubre scares the hell out of me. Everyone seems to just assume he's going to develop into a star, I'm not convinced this guy does one thing at a NBA level today. That's a lot to have to improve.

His best attribute is his length and athleticism, but the athleticism doesn't translate on the court for me. He has a decent vertical but doesn't seem particularly explosive, and seems more fast than quick on film. He's kind of a long strider. His lack of ball handling contributes to his athleticism not translating; the ball really slows him down. Also he's long but his frame projects as a SG to me. His shoulders aren't broad and I question how much good weight he can really add. He would have to add 20 pounds of muscle just to get to 225. Lebron just tossed Demaree around like a rag doll and you guys think Oubre can compete at SF. If you project him as a SG his ball handling goes from below average to bottom quarter of the league. His shot mechanics aren't ideal either.

With all that being said Sup is right he's the classic boom or bust pick. Kawhi defended, rebounded, and had size at a NBA level from day one. I'm not a fan of taking guys without 1 or 2 NBA ready skills on a veteran team, because you have to earn playing time to get better. If he sits the bench for 3 years developing he'll be almost a free agent anyway before he can contribute.

With all that being said I'm fine if we take him. I focused on his negatives only because everyone is acting like it's a no brainer. I don't believe his upside is that much greater than a lot of the others being mentioned for us that have more discernable NBA talent and college production. If anyone can get the most out of him it's the Hawks staff. He kind reminds me of a rich mans Kent Bazemore; a more fluid coordinated version.

Can't disagree with any of this but if he's there and Bud drafts him Im going to trust bud way more than any scout...since bud would be the one responsible in developing him.

[NBASupes]

With all that being said I'm fine if we take him. I focused on his negatives only because everyone is acting like it's a no brainer. I don't believe his upside is that much greater than a lot of the others being mentioned for us that have more discernable NBA talent and college production. If anyone can get the most out of him it's the Hawks staff. He kind reminds me of a rich mans Kent Bazemore; a more fluid coordinated version.

This is where we disagree. No one outside of the top 10 has the potential for us that Oubre has. Looney is close but no one else. Not saying they can't be good but the difference is having a potential star to solid role player is a major gap. 

[Guest]

 

 

 He can improve his iso handles but his overall handles in motion won't be much different than it is right now.

 

I disagree - if DMC can improve his handles in mortion after 5 years and 28 years in the NBA I would think a 19 year old rookie can do the same.

[NBASupes]

I disagree - if DMC can improve his handles in mortion after 5 years and 28 years in the NBA I would think a 19 year old rookie can do the same.

True, I want to say Carroll and Bazemore are anomalies because they are in an offense where their not force to go in motion often. Usually the defense is offset due to our ball movement. In that case, Oubre would be fine but most teams don't play like us. In fact, most team if any play like us. 

[JTB]

If he wasn't a boom or bust prospect and was polished, he would be a top 3 pick in any draft.

He is more fast than quick on offense. On defense, he has great lateral mobility when he's just letting the game come to him, something he struggles with on defense. Awareness is an issue for him. While his BBIQ is good on both sides of the court, his awareness is low and at times very low. Agree, the ball does slow him down which is attributed to his ball handling. In all my years of playing and watching players with great speed, ball handling with speed really can't be taught. Once someone is at a certain level, it is what it is. He can improve his iso handles but his overall handles in motion won't be much different than it is right now. Explosiveness off the bounce doesn't matter as much as your first step and he has an elite first step for his type of player. No one is going to confuse him for Stuckey or D. Wade. He is a SG to me as well but his handles limits him to SF in most systems. The Hawks are one of the few where he can play SG and not miss a beat as SG/SF is pretty much the same in our system. His shooting stroke and release is fine but his mechanics need to be cleaned up. Not an issue, see what we did with Dennis and Bazemore who were in much worse shape than Oubre's out of the draft.

Leonard had a lot to work on as a rookie in the NBA. But as you mentioned he could defend and rebound from day one in the NBA but he wouldn't be close to what he became if he played for the Bobcats or a team like that. MKG, was better than Leonard as wekk as younger and more talented and look at him in the NBA. Barely improving while having a ton of talent. Where you land is 90% of the answer for Oubre as it was for MKG, Green, Leonard and other talented players who either succeeded or failed.

I can't agree that he will sit on the bench for three years. With solid development, he should be a decent NBA player who can give you good starts like less polished Khris Middleton. With Hawks like Dennis development, he could be a star in his 3rd season. That will make him completely worth the investment.

Yeah i can roll with Oubre if Bud see the same type of potential in him as he saw in Leonard or just plain great upside....I'm for it...if bud don't like what he see I'm for that too!

Honestly I'm just going to be ok with whoever the Hawks pick, I just thought reading through the scouting reports that there was a ton of similarities with Oubre and Leonard. Therefore it lead me to think hey maybe bud is noticing this too.

[JTB]

I disagree - if DMC can improve his handles in mortion after 5 years and 28 years in the NBA I would think a 19 year old rookie can do the same.

Good point! I forget about the fact that he actually improved his handles. Lol...

[JTB]

I'm starting to think Oubre's gonna fall in line with the typical Kansas wing busts.

I keep reading how low his bbiq is and how he can't shoot. Sounds more like Julian Wright (who?) than Andrew Wiggins.

http://www.si.com/college-basketball/2015/06/22/2015-nba-draft-scouting-reports-jahlil-okafor-karl-towns-emmanuel-mudiay

This 'anonymous' scout take wasn't eggsactly glowing ...

Got to admit this is the first report I read from a scout saying that he can't guard anybody when so many others are high on his defense ability.

I mean I've read stuff like he lose focus from time to time but this scout flat out says "he can't guard anybody"

He has to be hating on this 6'7 with 7'2 wingspan 19 year old right?

[Flight]

I agree with his shot bring streaky and his overall rawness hindering him from doing much year 1 but I believe we have the right team to capitalize on his potential. I feel like his 3 point shooting is better than Kansas made it seem (brad beal didn't shoot the 3 amazingly his lone season at UF). His size is what fits us best, his length will be what helps him get on the court faster. Especially learning from Thabo and DMC who would be great mentors as far as how to find your niche in the league.

I'd love if we took him because he seems to have the highest ceiling of the pool we're choosing from. He could be Paul George-Lite with our development skills with players.

[Guest]

Got to admit this is the first report I read from a scout saying that he can't guard anybody when so many others are high on his defense ability.

I mean I've read stuff like he lose focus from time to time but this scout flat out says "he can't guard anybody"

He has to be hating on this 6'7 with 7'2 wingspan 19 year old right?

 

True.  Could be a tomatos, to-mah-toes thing.  One guys says he loses focus, the other says he's bad defensively due to low bbiq.

 

Everybody says he's raw which isn't what we need right now.  Everybody says Oubre has star potential.  When's the last time a guy became a star being as far from his potential ceiling as Oubre would be on day 1?

 

Paul George was actually pretty good in college.  So was a guy like Danny Granger.  Even Leonard had production in addition to his potential.

 

Oubre is all potential but we're in a position of needing a guy to step in on day 1 and contribute.

[NBASupes]

 

 

Oubre is all potential but we're in a position of needing a guy to step in on day 1 and contribute.

No, we are not in that position. This year and next, whoever we draft will get limited mins including Kaminsky who is the most polished player in this draft. We have that flexibility. 

[Guest]

How would Oubre compare with a young Thabo?

[Guest]

No, we are not in that position. This year and next, whoever we draft will get limited mins including Kaminsky who is the most polished player in this draft. We have that flexibility. 

 

If we think we aren't then that's a problem IMHO.  Imagine if Payne had been the player we expected him to be.

 

Don't get me wrong, I certainly see what you're saying.  If we draft a wing he could play behind Thabo.  A big could be behind Horford/Sap or w/e.  However, we all saw that we needed more.

 

If either DMC or Sap leaves, would you still feel we can afford to redshirt this year's pick?

[Diesel]

I'm starting to think Oubre's gonna fall in line with the typical Kansas wing busts.

 

I keep reading how low his bbiq is and how he can't shoot.  Sounds more like Julian Wright (who?) than Andrew Wiggins.

 

http://www.si.com/college-basketball/2015/06/22/2015-nba-draft-scouting-reports-jahlil-okafor-karl-towns-emmanuel-mudiay

 

This 'anonymous' scout take wasn't eggsactly glowing ...

 

 

KG,

 

I kinda feel you.  Right now, my short list if filled with Guys who we don't know about:  Oubre, Hollins-Jefferson, Kaminski, Dekker, Hunter, and Portis.

Honestly, I really like Portis a lot but the need might not be there.  I love Hollins-J defense... but he can't shoot.  And I haven't heard anything bad about Kaminski or Dekker but just have an overwhelming feeling that they are soft.  However, I would bypass that feeling based on what Bud says.