Standing Pat...

[Diesel]

What is wrong with what we have.  I believe some of you propose making moves because FAcy is here.  As I look at this team... Here's what I see:

 

Horf/Splitter/Walter

Sap/Muscala(?)/Scott

Thabo/THJr/ Daye (?)/Patterson(?)

Korver/Baze

Teague/Dennis/Mack

 

Now if we stop right here... knowing that Thabo won't be with us to start the season, we should all feel alright.

 

I see the Sf position as being handled by Scott, Baze, and THJr to start the year... and that is matchup dependent.  Smaller matchups, we use Baze or THJr.  Larger Matchups we use Scott and some Sap.

 

I see the SG position as being capable of being handled by Dennis, Mack, THJr. in a pinch.

 

The unknowns are:

1. Will we lose Moose and/or  Daye to the Splitter trade?
2. How good will THJr be and how long will it take him to pick up the system?
3. Will Baze gain enough strength to play more SF?
4. Will Thabo and/or Korver miss more than the first month?
5. Will we call up Patterson?

If we stopped right here and didn't make another trade or pickup, I'm fine.  I really like our size in the frontcourt.   I really like our depth.  I really like our ability to control pace.

 

I think without DMC, we will be a little more passive on offense.  Less shots from behind the arc.  However, with THJr, we have the ability to have a guy who can put the ball on the floor better than DMC could.

 

If someone is traded, I would think it may be Thabo.  Simply due to his rust and nondurability.

 

IF we did make a trade, I would see if I could pry Ariza away from the Rockets.

He's a guy who can hit the outside shot and plays good defense.  Moreover, money to money, I don't think that the Rockets want him more than they need a playmaker.

[JETSET]

We have to improve defensively on the wings. That lineup won't cut it in the playoffs. We need another body or two.

[thescout5]

We have to improve defensively on the wings. That lineup won't cut it in the playoffs. We need another body or two.

Agreed. Who can get their own shot off out of this lineup?

[High5]

Thabo is the only legit SF on the roster, and he's an injured backup. We absolutely need to acquire another SF if we want to have any hope of improving on last season.

[Diesel]

We have to improve defensively on the wings. That lineup won't cut it in the playoffs. We need another body or two.

 

Why won't this lineup cut it?  First off, Thabo should be back in the playoffs.  He's a world class defensive player.  The names that have been floated... Wes Johnson, etc.. are not great defensive players either.   Like I said, I think we've gotten FA fever on this board.  Let's look at what we have soberly.  We have a good team.  Lebron would burn any wings. The key is not stopping Lebron, the key is containing him.

[Diesel]

Agreed. Who can get their own shot off out of this lineup?

 

That's different from Defense.  In terms of getting our shot off, everything happens based on the system..

If you took all of San Antonio's parts for the past 2 years, you don't have guys who are expert one on one players.  I mean, Duncan could be but at his age...  eh..  However, they are complimented by the ball movement.   The same is true of us.  Our best one on one players are Sap and Teague.  However, we don't need one on one play.  We need guys who can be healthy and play the system.

[Ruckus]

Standing pat doesn't cut it for championship teams. When opportunities present themselves you take advantage. Don't be frugal but don't be frivolous.

[thescout5]

I see the Cavs are interested in David West. Lets see they have TT,Love,Varajo and still want to add another power forward/center type going 4 deep. The Hawks lets see small forward Thabo ,maybe Korver then ???   The Cavs learned last year injuries are part of the game and still want to improve the Hawks well I hear their after the likes of Wes Johnson....championship.

Edited July 5, 2015 by thescout5

[Plainview1981]

Why won't this lineup cut it?  First off, Thabo should be back in the playoffs.  He's a world class defensive player.  The names that have been floated... Wes Johnson, etc.. are not great defensive players either.   Like I said, I think we've gotten FA fever on this board.  Let's look at what we have soberly.  We have a good team.  Lebron would burn any wings. The key is not stopping Lebron, the key is containing him.

 

Thabo is injury prone and better in limited minutes. That's one reason he was so effective last year because he knew he was on limited minutes and so he could go all out.

 

Sometimes people just don't listen... If this guy can't stay healthy at 19MPG... How is he going to stay healthy at 25-30MPG?

Edited July 5, 2015 by Hotlanta1981

[RandomFan]

If the roster stands as it is now, then we might be able to get through the season OK enough on the wings. I'd guess we will be a tad worse than last year though; and that's after my assumption that Bazemore is going to make a big jump in his game this offseason.

 

But hopefully that will be offset by being better in the frontcourt with the addition of Splitter and another year of maturation from Muscala. And if we get anything from Edy, that will be a bonus too, although unexpected. 

 

We have to keep in mind in Bud's system the SG and SF designations are irrelevant. There are only 3 positions: Guards (point guard), Wings, and Frontcourt. So it doesn't really matter who lines up in which position in the grand scheme of things. Optimally, for the two wing positions we want to match one offensive player with one defensive stopper. (In a perfect world you would have two players great at both, obviously.) But in the real world, that is hard to do. We want to at least have one great defensive player on the court at all times so we can put him on the other team's best wing scoring threat. And we want to have at least one good offensive player on the court at all times to keep their defense spread, which allows our PG's to penetrate and our frontcourt the space they need to operate.

 

What we don't want to have is one of those positions filled with someone terrible at offense or defense. It's for this reason I have to believe that Bud is confident that he can get Hardaway's defense at least up to an acceptable level. I highly doubt he'll ever be a great defender, but if Bud didn't think he could get his D up to where he woudn't hurt the team with it, Bud never would have traded for him. And speaking of which, if Bud is aware of Hardaway's defensive limitations, then that must mean Bud REALLY thinks the kid has a lot of untapped potential on the offensive end, right?

 

As things look right now, we'd have to say our more offensive minded wings are Korver and Hardaway; and our more defensive minded wings are Bazemore and Thabo. I'll attempt to push my disdain for Scott aside long enough to at least include him in the conversation and pretend he might still get minutes on this roster. If he's still here, he's always been a tweener. If the other team goes small, he can play in the frontcourt; if the other team goes big, he can play on the wing. He's not good on defense, which is why he's never gotten more than 10 minutes per game on average. But if his outside shot is falling, then he can be a bigtime scoring threat. The problem is his outside shot is streaky, at best. Anwway, for the wing discussion we can include him as a possibility versus certain teams or certain lineups. But his tweener size and skills, and lack of defense mean he shouldn't be in the regular wing rotation. He's also hurt by a better and deeper frontcourt rotation now, including the emergence of Muscala ahead of him. These are all reasons I find him highly expendable in favor of a true SF type of player with better size than Baze or Hardaway.

 

With the addition of Splitter, as I've posted elsewhere I do believe it opens up the possibility to have Millsap get some minutes on the wing this year. This actually lends itself nicely to one of our current problems with our current wing setup: namely Bazemore's lack of size versus certain players or lineups. Millsap is a great defensive player, who can handle the larger SF types that Baze wont be able to because of the size difference.There is only one Lebron, who Baze doesn't matchup well with at all, like most everyone else. But even after Lebron, there are a few larger SF's that will give Baze problems simply because he is only 6'5" and around 200lbs.

 

Thabo has the size to matchup with most any wing he'll face. But obviously he's older, turning injury prone, and would be better served under 20 minutes per game in a backup role. Bazemore is our only other wing player that shines on defense. So logically, if Thabo isn't on the floor, Bazemore should be. Which means our best option is to start Baze and Korver on the wings; and sub them out with Thabo and Hardaway.

 

This is where Millsap comes in. I don't know if Millsap will see regular minutes on the wing simply as a function of our improved frontcourt depth or not. But one option he gives us is being able to take on more wing minutes to help us defend the larger wing players we are going to face at times. So Millsap playing more wing minutes might vary from game to game. At least with Baze and Millsap we have some roster flexibility to try and cover up some potential weaknesses.

 

So for all the reasons I just listed, if we don't add another wing player that can defend the larger SF types, this is what I project our rotation will look like:

 

PG:

Teague, Schröder, with Mack as 3rd guy who should be a #2 on somebody's bench.

 

Frontcourt:

Horford/Millsap

Splitter/Muscala

Edy/Scott - who either might or might not play, barring injury to others

 

Wings: (2 scenarios)

1)

Korver/Bazemore

Thabo/Hardaway

Patterson/Mack - Patterson would probably be added for minimum, and Mack has helped out on wing before)

 

or 2)

Korver/Thabo

Hardaway/Bazemore

Patterson/Mack

Edited July 5, 2015 by RandomFan

[RandomFan]

Forgot to include that versus some of the larger wing players we face, Millsap could start on the wing in those games, which would mean Splitter needing to pick up some extra minutes at center, and Muscala some extra minutes at PF. And maybe even Scott getting some minutes at PF to keep from overloading everyone else. Obviously, this would reduce the minutes of one of Korver/Baze/Hardaway/Thabo for that game. Who knows, that might turn into a way for Bud to give players a game off here and there, like he likes to do.

[Diesel]

Thabo is injury prone and better in limited minutes. That's one reason he was so effective last year because he knew he was on limited minutes and so he could go all out.

 

Sometimes people just don't listen... If this guy can't stay healthy at 19MPG... How is he going to stay healthy at 25-30MPG?

 

I don't think Thabo has to play so much. Our SF could be a rotation.  However, if we do really do want a wing, let's go get Ariza who fits our system and is on the blocks.

[atlhawks1]

As they are, the Hawks STILL dont have the ability to beat Cleveland. Sign Wesley Johnson, and things change in the East. In fact, if Thabo comes back from injury, and plays BEHIND Johnson, i see the Hawks running away with their Division again and meeting Cleveland AGAIN in the Eastern Conference finals.

 

Coach Bud said the Hawks problem was more a problem of lack of scoring in the playoffs, vs lack of interior post play. What he is saying is in their SYSTEM, it purposely is slanted more toward out scoring your opponent, vs, interior defensive play. I see his point and agree.

 

When Kyle Korver stopped  producing, that was the end of the Hawks.......

 

Soooo.........Bud went out and got Hardaway. Johnson would be the icing on the cake.........

Edited July 5, 2015 by atlhawks1

[BraveSeminole]

What is wrong with what we have.  I believe some of you propose making moves because FAcy is here.  As I look at this team... Here's what I see:

 

Horf/Splitter/Walter

Sap/Muscala(?)/Scott

Thabo/THJr/ Daye (?)/Patterson(?)

Korver/Baze

Teague/Dennis/Mack

 

Now if we stop right here... knowing that Thabo won't be with us to start the season, we should all feel alright.

 

I see the Sf position as being handled by Scott, Baze, and THJr to start the year... and that is matchup dependent.  Smaller matchups, we use Baze or THJr.  Larger Matchups we use Scott and some Sap.

 

I see the SG position as being capable of being handled by Dennis, Mack, THJr. in a pinch.

 

The unknowns are:

1. Will we lose Moose and/or  Daye to the Splitter trade?
2. How good will THJr be and how long will it take him to pick up the system?
3. Will Baze gain enough strength to play more SF?
4. Will Thabo and/or Korver miss more than the first month?
5. Will we call up Patterson?

If we stopped right here and didn't make another trade or pickup, I'm fine.  I really like our size in the frontcourt.   I really like our depth.  I really like our ability to control pace.

 

I think without DMC, we will be a little more passive on offense.  Less shots from behind the arc.  However, with THJr, we have the ability to have a guy who can put the ball on the floor better than DMC could.

 

If someone is traded, I would think it may be Thabo.  Simply due to his rust and nondurability.

 

IF we did make a trade, I would see if I could pry Ariza away from the Rockets.

He's a guy who can hit the outside shot and plays good defense.  Moreover, money to money, I don't think that the Rockets want him more than they need a playmaker.

 

 I will say that I feel much better about the current Hawks roster than I did a few days ago!  And, I will not be upset if this is the roster that starts next season but I am greedy and am hoping the Hawks can sign (Or, obtain in a Trade) at least one more quality player (Preferably, a SF) before the season begins!

[Twinblade]

Our FA is done, what we have is what we got.... traded for some scrub from NY, traded for a back up C.... that's pretty much it.