Ok be honest, what do you think of this team?

[Joker]

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Our flaws as a team have a lot to do with youth. I know people get tired of hearing that, but it's the truth. Young teams just don't win in the NBA, because they do stupid things. The kids do a lot of great things. Then they'll do something that will completely drive you crazy. And when they make the mistake, they know that it's a bad one.

But as far as the Memphis discussion, consider this:

Vancouver/Memphis draft positions since 1995:

95: #6 - Big Country

96: #3 - Reef

97: #4 - Antonio Daniels

98: #2 - Mike Bibby

99: #2 - Steve Francis ( who pitched a hissy fit and got his trade wish )

00: #2 - Stromile Swift

01: #3 ( from us in the Reef trade ) - Gasol . . and #6: Battier

02: #4 Drew Gooden

( enter Jerry West as GM )

- Makes a move to bring in solid veteran players like James Posey and Bonzi Wells to the team, who immeadiately helps them offensively and most importantly defensively. Makes some nice trades to get underachieving players off the squad. Hires Hubie Brown to coach during the 02-03 season.

03: #14 Marcus Banks

04: no draft pick ( I think they traded it away, but I forgot to whom. I think Utah got it, seeing that they had three 1st round picks that year. )

05: #19 - Hakim Warrick

06: #24 - Kyle Lowry

A lot of you forget that Memphis won

49 games

last year, and had posted 3 consecutive seasons of over .500 basketball. But West wanted to remake the team to be a more athletic one, because they couldn't get out of the 1st round of the playoffs. The ONLY reason why they're in the situation that they're in now, is because of Gasol's injury situation.

And the same goes for us. But the majority of fans of the Hawks put the injury situation low on the totem pole. LOL . . tell Milwaukee that they're season wasn't ruined because of injury.

LOL . . just a mere 2 weeks ago, a lot of you were talking about how this team is playing so well without JJ, that he might be expendible. Now that we're losing with the kids, we're the worst team in the NBA . . LOL. This board is hilarious.

Without all of the injuries to this team, the Hawks are a middle of the pack team that was very capable of winning close to 40 games this season . . even with all of our flaws and deficiencies. But you can't go through the amount of injuries that we went through, and expect everything to still be OK.

And most importantly, you can't JUDGE this team on how good or bad they are, because of the injuries.

This board bases their opinions on what they see on a daily basis, and not from a long term or rational perspective:

- If Salim throws up 37 points in a game, he should be starting. He could even be our 2nd option. I guess it doesn't matter if he shoots 40% FG, he can still do it.

- If Chill has a lackluster 2nd half, he's not aggressive enough, even if he does have an overall game in which he scores 20 points and grabs more than 10 boards and shoot 50% FG.

- If Smoove commits 7 turnovers, he's a dumb player. Forget the fact that he may have 7 assists in that same game from the forward position. Conversely, he's our best player( even better than JJ ) despite that 5 of his 7 turnovers were passes or plays he had no business trying to make.

- If the team wins without JJ, we don't need him. Forget that the team has won

21 games when JJ scores 29 points or more,

we don't need him because our ball movement is so good without him.

- If Solomon Jones gets 2 blocks in 7 minutes, he can be the future at center, even though he's undersized and a hack machine.

- If Marvin doesn't look to put up 15 shots a game, or get his shot blocked trying to go to the hole, he has no heart and is a complete bust. He may be 4 - 8 FG in the game and playing team ball, but because he's not trying to be a superstar, he has no heart. Conversely, some say that Marvin still be a "superstar" in a few years, even if he has shown no indication of having a "superstar" mentality.

These are the type of knee-jerk opinions that we see on a daily basis on this board. It's hilarious to me.

These are the Hawks in a nutshell:

- If healthy next year, our veteran PGs are going to help this team tremendously, because they all bring different things to the table. And if push comes to shove, you could play the guy that is playing the best during crunch time. And for you Speedy critics, don't count on Speedy posting the worst numbers of his career two years in a row.

- JJ is the best player the Hawks have had since Dominique. This was his first year of being truly "the man". He'll be more than ready to handle the double and sometimes triple teams next season.

nbasuperstar40 opinion- he is not the man nor would he ever be the man, in a talent sense.

- Smoove is establishing himself as a viable 2nd option to this team. A true 5-tool player. He will also improve next year. A nice 2nd fiddle to compliment JJ.

nbasuperstar- yeah right, I already explain this guy, I'm not doing it again...

- Childress is a poor man's combo version of Shawn Marion and Tayshawn Prince, for all of the little things he does. He is the Hawks version of Jose Oquendo ( for you longtime baseball fans, especially of the Cardinals ).

nbasuperstar- no, he a solid role player on a bonafide team which the Hawks isn't...

- Marvin will be a solid #3 guy for us, sometimes even taking the #2 role when/if Smith has a bad game. Like Childress and Smith, he's a young player that is rapidly improving.

nbasuperstar- see Chillz....

If I were BK, I'm only looking to add two things to this team. One is obviously a big man who can play defense, and score somewhat efficiently. Not a guy that puts up big numbers, but just a guy who can come in and shoot over 50% FG and not let his man have a field day on the offensive end. We just need consistent efficiency from the 5 spot. ZaZa runs too hot and cold to be counted on as a starter.

The 2nd thing I'd look to add, would be a slasher. It could be from the PG position or from the SG position. But we could use a player that can get to the hole just about anytime he wanted to. Most of your good teams have this kind of player, even if he's not a star player.

Keep this team together. Don't make a move with the young forwards, unless you can bring an IMPACT player to the mix. Get a new coach if you feel that Woody has done all he can with this group. If Nique feels that he can make better personnel decisions than BK, consider letting him go too.

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quit saying JJ the best player since Nique, he is not better then Deke or Steve Smith, hell even Mookie Blaylock is better... in all seriousness JJ is about as good as JT when he was in Atlanta.

[Joker]

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The Hawks don't win 40 games healthy or not. PERIOD

-No post scoring

-No defense

-No PG

-No center

-No standout rebounders

-No desire

-No Depth

Your not winning 40 games with those kind of weaknesses. You can tell yourself otherwise to feel better, but your wrong. Every bad team blames everything on injuries because

they can't face the reality that their team sucks.

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you forgot

-no standout players

-no threats to another team

-no player with good poitenial that wasn't reach it

-little upside to this current roster

-no really good shooters outside of JJ

-no one knows their roles

-very undersized

-bad scouts

-bad choices on who should be the one taking all the shots.

-plays streetball, instead of a real offense, and if they played a real offense they would more then they already have

-thinks their good, when their awful....

-I have many thooths to pick with the Hawks, they brought it on their selfs.....

[BusBoyIsBack]

Worst team in basketball?

Clearly you're a moron.

We have had a winning record even without JJ although that may not be the case anymore it's at least around .500 without him.

Without being healthy all year we are a handful of games out of the playoffs.

Considering the youth on this team that is not characteristic of one of the worst situations in basketball but more of a young team with one of the more promising futures.

All you doubters will jump back on the bandwagon with the rest of the terrible fanbase of this city over the next two years as we make the step from fringe playoff team to playoff contender.

[Joker]

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Worst team in basketball?

Clearly you're a moron.

We have had a winning record even without JJ although that may not be the case anymore it's at least around .500 without him.

Without being healthy all year we are a handful of games out of the playoffs.

Considering the youth on this team that is not characteristic of one of the worst situations in basketball but more of a young team with one of the more promising futures.

All you doubters will jump back on the bandwagon with the rest of the terrible fanbase of this city over the next two years as we make the step from fringe playoff team to playoff contender.

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I'm a moron, hey buddy I'm a scout and after I'm done with my business degree I want to get the chance to be a GM in the future. Your crazy if you think this team is any good, they are far from good, if you think beating teams who coaches are on blast if they don't tank well enuff then your smoking that s$%# that you need to pass to me... the only thing you said I agree with is the word 'fringe'. Becuase this team is on the fringe of existence. That's about it, you say youth but age is irrealevent if your not any good, and the Hawks aren't... the Bulls are young and they go the playoff and play disapline basketball, while the Hawks fight in the cellar every year and is the laughing stock of the league... Name what good about this team man..... I wanna know.

[BusBoyIsBack]

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I'm a moron, hey buddy I'm a scout and after I'm done with my business degree I want to get the chance to be a GM in the future. Your crazy if you think this team is any good, they are far from good, if you think beating teams who coaches are on blast if they don't tank well enuff then your smoking that s$%# that you need to pass to me... the only thing you said I agree with is the word 'fringe'. Becuase this team is on the fringe of existence. That's about it, you say youth but age is irrealevent if your not any good, and the Hawks aren't... the Bulls are young and they go the playoff and play disapline basketball, while the Hawks fight in the cellar every year and is the laughing stock of the league... Name what good about this team man..... I wanna know.

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So you honestly think we are the worst team in basketball?

You think our players age is just that and that they can't/won't improve.

Yeah the Bulls are young but they are at least 3 years older than us and 3 years could be the difference between this games out of the playoffs and 5 games out of 1st in the eastern conference.

You act like we are a terrible franchise like the Memphis Grizzlies with no promising future at all.

Not even the case.

[Plainview1981]

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Not true Hotlanta. I'm not going to waste a lot of typing on this, because I've never seen you post ANYTHING positive about this team.

What injuries do, is disrupt the chemistry of a team. You've watched enough basketball to know this.

Here's a number range for you Hot. 60 - 65 games.

That represents the number of games that we've had

2 or more key players

on this team not be available for us in a particular game. Teams, for the most part, just don't overcome those odds. Especially not young teams.

-No posting scoring

-No defense

-No PG

-No center

-No standout rebounders

-No desire

-No Depth

You know, that sounds a lot like the Dallas Mavericks of 2 years ago, when JT first came to the team. They did have 2 things that we don't have now. An all-NBA player, the desire to win because they had been in a few playoff wars, and a lot of depth. All of those other things you listed weren't a factor in the success of their team. Their defense is much better now, but they still lack a center, post scoring.

The Hawks were way too competitive this year, even with the players out and all of our deficiencies, to make me believe that this team couldn't win 40 games this year.

No way we're 27 - 44 with a 80% healthy Hawks squad for the year. We definitely need a banger on the inside, no doubt on that. But our team has shown that they can be efficient enough offensively and sound enough defensively, to compete with even the best teams this year.

One more year of experience, and a few more moves, will continue to see this team improve. The glass is 5/8ths full for the Hawks . . not 5/8ths empty.

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What injuries do, is disrupt the chemistry of a team. You've watched enough basketball to know this.

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All teams have injuries. Even without the injuries this isn't close to a good team. The team chemistry wouldn't be much better with even being healthy because the team doesn't even have a PG to run the offense.

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You know, that sounds a lot like the Dallas Mavericks of 2 years ago, when JT first came to the team. They did have 2 things that we don't have now. An all-NBA player, the desire to win because they had been in a few playoff wars, and a lot of depth. All of those other things you listed weren't a factor in the success of their team. Their defense is much better now, but they still lack a center, post scoring.[/qhote]

One key thing. Dallas has always had lots of talent and the Hawks don't. Childress is either a role player or a 6th man. Marvin can only shoot. He's good at nothing else. ZaZa is extremely limited, Speedy is always injuried and can't shoot or run a team, Salim will likely not last in the NBA.

JT, Howard, Dirk, Stackhouse, Harris are all starters and JJ/Smoove are the only players the Hawks have that are starter worthy.

And having a top 5 player makes a difference. JJ and Smoove aren't likely to sniff the top 5 in their careers. Having a top 5 player can cure lots of weakness. Kobe has that p!ece of shyt Laker team winning.

When JJ or Smoove become top 5 worthy then there might be a case.

[Joker]

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I'm a moron, hey buddy I'm a scout and after I'm done with my business degree I want to get the chance to be a GM in the future. Your crazy if you think this team is any good, they are far from good, if you think beating teams who coaches are on blast if they don't tank well enuff then your smoking that s$%# that you need to pass to me... the only thing you said I agree with is the word 'fringe'. Becuase this team is on the fringe of existence. That's about it, you say youth but age is irrealevent if your not any good, and the Hawks aren't... the Bulls are young and they go the playoff and play disapline basketball, while the Hawks fight in the cellar every year and is the laughing stock of the league... Name what good about this team man..... I wanna know.

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So you honestly think we are the worst team in basketball?

You think our players age is just that and that they can't/won't improve.

Yeah the Bulls are young but they are at least 3 years older than us and 3 years could be the difference between this games out of the playoffs and 5 games out of 1st in the eastern conference.

You act like we are a terrible franchise like the Memphis Grizzlies with no promising future at all.

Not even the case.

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1. yep, no question

2. age has nothing to do with it, other then MW, the players have showed mininal improvment over the years....

3. But they to each player has improved alot each year. mainly Hinrich, and Noicioni the most...

4. no Memphis isn't terrible, we are...

[BusBoyIsBack]

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[

1. yep, no question

2. age has nothing to do with it, other then MW, the players have showed mininal improvment over the years....

3. But they to each player has improved alot each year. mainly Hinrich, and Noicioni the most...

4. no Memphis isn't terrible, we are...

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Memphis has the worst record in the NBA by a large margin.

You have to be kidding me.

As far as players not showing improvement, JOsh Smith hasn't shown any improvement????

You are unbelievably pessimistic and blind because of it.

[Plainview1981]

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I'm a moron, hey buddy I'm a scout and after I'm done with my business degree I want to get the chance to be a GM in the future. Your crazy if you think this team is any good, they are far from good, if you think beating teams who coaches are on blast if they don't tank well enuff then your smoking that s$%# that you need to pass to me... the only thing you said I agree with is the word 'fringe'. Becuase this team is on the fringe of existence. That's about it, you say youth but age is irrealevent if your not any good, and the Hawks aren't... the Bulls are young and they go the playoff and play disapline basketball, while the Hawks fight in the cellar every year and is the laughing stock of the league... Name what good about this team man..... I wanna know.

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So you honestly think we are the worst team in basketball?

You think our players age is just that and that they can't/won't improve.

Yeah the Bulls are young but they are at least 3 years older than us and 3 years could be the difference between this games out of the playoffs and 5 games out of 1st in the eastern conference.

You act like we are a terrible franchise like the Memphis Grizzlies with no promising future at all.

Not even the case.

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How can you have a bright fure when:

-You only have two starters

-Crappy ownership

-Poor Gm

-Poor coach

-No fan support

-No respect from anybody

[Joker]

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[

1. yep, no question

2. age has nothing to do with it, other then MW, the players have showed mininal improvment over the years....

3. But they to each player has improved alot each year. mainly Hinrich, and Noicioni the most...

4. no Memphis isn't terrible, we are...

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Memphis has the worst record in the NBA by a large margin.

You have to be kidding me.

As far as players not showing improvement, JOsh Smith hasn't shown any improvement????

You are unbelievably pessimistic and blind because of it.

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1. The team in turmoil, not to mention there best player was out for sometime and they are in the West.. They did win 49 games last season.

2. Josh Smith hasn't shown much improvement, he still sucks, he gotten bigger frame wise, and he alittle bit better at shooting.

3. lol, I'm pessimistic, I'm a scout, I have no reason to be pessimistic on a team at least... I say what I see and notice about a player....whatever man, believe what you believe...

[Joker]

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I'm a moron, hey buddy I'm a scout and after I'm done with my business degree I want to get the chance to be a GM in the future. Your crazy if you think this team is any good, they are far from good, if you think beating teams who coaches are on blast if they don't tank well enuff then your smoking that s$%# that you need to pass to me... the only thing you said I agree with is the word 'fringe'. Becuase this team is on the fringe of existence. That's about it, you say youth but age is irrealevent if your not any good, and the Hawks aren't... the Bulls are young and they go the playoff and play disapline basketball, while the Hawks fight in the cellar every year and is the laughing stock of the league... Name what good about this team man..... I wanna know.

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So you honestly think we are the worst team in basketball?

You think our players age is just that and that they can't/won't improve.

Yeah the Bulls are young but they are at least 3 years older than us and 3 years could be the difference between this games out of the playoffs and 5 games out of 1st in the eastern conference.

You act like we are a terrible franchise like the Memphis Grizzlies with no promising future at all.

Not even the case.

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How can you have a bright fure when:

-You only have two starters

-Crappy ownership

-Poor Gm

-Poor coach

-No fan support

-No respect from anybody

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I hope your talking about AJ and JJ becuase outside of that, I certain the other players wouldn't start elsewhere.

Crappy ownership- there avg. owners, they don't know nothing... no real biggie...

Poor GM- that's a understatement

Poor coach- accurate

No fan support- can you blame them.

No respect from anybody- for being the worst team in the NBA, damn you certain to get respect that way....

[hawk25]

it starts at the top from the owners to the coaches and those are the situations that we need to straighten out first

[PureGreatness]

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[

1. yep, no question

2. age has nothing to do with it, other then MW, the players have showed mininal improvment over the years....

3. But they to each player has improved alot each year. mainly Hinrich, and Noicioni the most...

4. no Memphis isn't terrible, we are...

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Memphis has the worst record in the NBA by a large margin.

You have to be kidding me.

As far as players not showing improvement, JOsh Smith hasn't shown any improvement????

You are unbelievably pessimistic and blind because of it.

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1. The team in turmoil, not to mention there best player was out for sometime and they are in the West.. They did win 49 games last season.

2. Josh Smith hasn't shown much improvement, he still sucks, he gotten bigger frame wise, and he alittle bit better at shooting.

3. lol, I'm pessimistic, I'm a scout, I have no reason to be pessimistic on a team at least... I say what I see and notice about a player....whatever man, believe what you believe...

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you know what let me staightin you out for a second because i think your talking out of your...lack of information i should say.

1. u say smoove sucks...how? hes shown much improvement, yes he needs to improve and cut down on the turnovers but he trying to do what our point guards cant do.

2. charls barkly said a while back that the best player on the team will commit the most turnover because he has the ball most of the time.

3. our coach sucks

4. ive spoke to plenty of scouts and they have said smoove is a good player. so your the only scout that thinks he sucks. i bet you if the hawks was above 500 you wouldnt say he sucks.

ive got alot more to say but i wont right now.

[Joker]

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[

1. yep, no question

2. age has nothing to do with it, other then MW, the players have showed mininal improvment over the years....

3. But they to each player has improved alot each year. mainly Hinrich, and Noicioni the most...

4. no Memphis isn't terrible, we are...

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Memphis has the worst record in the NBA by a large margin.

You have to be kidding me.

As far as players not showing improvement, JOsh Smith hasn't shown any improvement????

You are unbelievably pessimistic and blind because of it.

---

1. The team in turmoil, not to mention there best player was out for sometime and they are in the West.. They did win 49 games last season.

2. Josh Smith hasn't shown much improvement, he still sucks, he gotten bigger frame wise, and he alittle bit better at shooting.

3. lol, I'm pessimistic, I'm a scout, I have no reason to be pessimistic on a team at least... I say what I see and notice about a player....whatever man, believe what you believe...

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you know what let me staightin you out for a second because i think your talking out of your...lack of information i should say.

1. u say smoove sucks...how? hes shown much improvement, yes he needs to improve and cut down on the turnovers but he trying to do what our point guards cant do.

2. charls barkly said a while back that the best player on the team will commit the most turnover because he has the ball most of the time.

3. our coach sucks

4. ive spoke to plenty of scouts and they have said smoove is a good player. so your the only scout that thinks he sucks. i bet you if the hawks was above 500 you wouldnt say he sucks.

ive got alot more to say but i wont right now.

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1. he hasn't shown much improvement but statisticly and that is because Atlanta is trying to force his sucess.

2. lol, Charles Barkley says alot of things... I'm certain he was refering to D Wade.

3. he didn't have much to prove anything, but he knew what he was walking into.

4. if he plays the way he playing now, I would say it if the Hawks .700, but then he wouldn't be getting any burn on a team that was talented.... I doubt you talk to any scout who knows what he's talking about... most of the NBA scouts I know vastly agree with me. Why do you think he slid to the 17 pick, hell he is awful... he and Gerald Green are the worst players getting over 15 mins burn in the NBA.

[AtLaS]

nbasuperstar is not a scout. He has no punctuation, manner, can't spell anything, and puts words together like 10 year old. He's hotlanta part 2. Scouts don't just come to a Hawks board and start bashing players, especially ones that are clearly better than he's giving them credit for.

BEFORE the season, sportsline had JJ as the #22 best player in the NBA, that could have only increased after the season he's had this year.

Smith's season this year is an AK47 (prime) clone. With a good PG on this team, Smith will be even better, and his FG% will go up and turnovers down, because he will no longer have to create everything for himself. Scouts obviously recognize how valuable Smith is. Besides, Smith is already a legit all-defensive teamer.

For him to suggest that Smith isn't even starter quality, is complete absurdness and shouldn't even warrant a response.

[Plainview1981]

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He's hotlanta part 2.

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Smith is already a legit all-defensive teamer.

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Making claims like that we should all be happy there is only one of you.

[AtLaS]

It sucks that there are 2 of you.

[VarsitySlacker]

...ignoring what has been said in this thread...

I think this team has a lot of pieces that work. Talent-wise, I think we have a low-playoff-seed caliber team, say the 7th or 8th seed. (This is healthy)

I think Josh Smith is an incredible ballplayer who, for all his faults, is exciting to watch and infuses energy into both the team and the stadium. He's CERTAINLY not a number one option, and in all honesty not really a number 2, though he can play the role (and maybe be able to develop into it if he can develop a consistent jumper), but he has shown a lot of heart in his quest to single-handedly refuse to let this team tank (much to my chagrin)

I think Marvin Williams COULD develop into a second option for the team behind Joe, but I'd rather he didn't do it for us. I like the way he and Smoove play together, but I'd rather be able to develop a consistent inside-outside game, and when a team's top three scorers play on the perimeter, that's hard to develop.

I think Josh Childress is a positive for any team he's on, because even though it's been said over and over, he does the little things. He hits his jumpers, he rebounds well, and he plays hard and smart. On this team, fans are expecting him to be a major scoring threat, which shouldn't be expected from him (as a player, not in comparison to who he was drafted over).

Zaza is a servicable backup center in the sense that Drobjnak was. His offense is worlds over his defense, though his offense isn't very strong, and is exposed once everyone realizes to stop playing defense and let him fall over himself.

I think Speedy is capable of starting, though he hasn't proven it yet. He's not capable of being anything but a last resort on the floor for shooting, though, and he needs to realize it. AJ is a good backup, and I'd rather have him than Lue, who consistently draws interest from other teams for some god unknown reason.

My feelings on Salim are well-known. I don't hate him as a player, but as a player on this team. He doesn't fit. I admire his heart, but not his game.

I'm not going to judge Shelden yet, because I do think he's better than he's been the second half of the year. I do think that Esteban can do whatever he does, though, if he can give a chance.

[TexasPete]

Your a scout? Trust me, you aren't fit to scout a 11 and under AAU team. GM one day? No, GM's know how to spell and write at at least a 12th grade level. You aren't jack...you know it, and everybody on this board knows it.

Your just a big blowhard who wishes he knew something about anything. The Hawks are far from a good team but they aren't even in the bottom five.

Now, go back to sleep and dream up another fantasy. And maybe take an English class.

[Plainview1981]

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It sucks that there are 2 of you.

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Somebody should flush you down the crapper like the little shyt nugget that you are.