Crawford

[buckeye242424]

http://nba-facts-and-rumors.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/22748484/24896353

“I wasn’t close to not coming or anything but it was hard to get on that plane and come here,” Crawford told the media in Atlanta. “It really was. Because I’m in a weird space. I waited 10 years to get here, helping my team to one of the best home records in the league, snagging home court advantage and making the playoffs for the first time while helping the team to one of the best records in franchise history. It’s hard to be a part of all that and then feel like you are not a part of the future. But I’m a professional. And I need to make this clear, I want to be here, I want to be an Atlanta Hawk. If I’m not a part of the plan going forward, then that’s a conversation we need to have later.”

Sounds like the professional that he is...

[macdaddy]

I like Crawford a lot but I'm just not digging this approach. He put in ONE good year with the franchise. While we won a few more games than the year before the bottom line was the same as the year before. Horrible second round exit. I don't see where this one year makes him deserving of special consideration by the franchise.

He sould see that extending his contract (and i'm guessing he wants a lot) doesn't make any business sense for the organization. If he recognizes that then he's just causing a distraction at this point. We'll see what it looks like when the season is starting.

[ATLSmith]

Okay, I like Crawford and would love to see his contract extended but his comment really bothered me.

He didn't make the playoffs on any other team. He joins the Hawks, who were already a playoff team, makes the playoffs for the first time in his life, and now they owe him something?

Does he really want to get traded to some terrible team to sit out the playoffs for the rest of his career? I guess in the end it depends on how much he cares about money vs. winning.

[Crank]

LOL how are people MAD because a talented player says he wants to remain a hawk longterm and is sad because he thinks maybe they dont want him around ? ONLY in Atl .

[BudBall]

His *ss wants to much money.

[macdaddy]

LOL how are people MAD because a talented player says he wants to remain a hawk longterm and is sad because he thinks maybe they dont want him around ? ONLY in Atl .

LOL. He wants to remain a Hawk longterm ONLY if we extend him now rather than when his current contract runs out. Basically he wants the Hawks to assume all the risk that he currently carries by having a contract that ends next season when there is a potential labor dispute. This isn't about his deep desire to be a long term Hawk its about his desire not to get a crappy contract next year. If it was about being a Hawk then honoring his contract and getting a new contract next year would be a satisfactory option to him.

[spotatl]

I get it from his perspective. He came in and exceeded all expectations. He did everything he could have possibly been asked to do and more. I fully get why he is severely disappointed that the Hawks aren't even discussing an extension with him.

That said it would be really stupid for the Hawks to extend him. He is almost certainly not going to repeat his year from last year. THe Hawks will almost certainly be able to sign him for less next offseason than this one under the new CBA. IN face the Hawks are pretty likely to just let him walk away depending on how the new CBA deals with the luxury tax.

[Swatguy]

His *ss wants to much money.

How do you know how much money he wants?

[macdaddy]

How do you know how much money he wants?

No one really does but the rumor that he wanted an extension which obviously came from his agent included the info that he wanted an extension that would continue to pay him what he is making this season which i think is like 10 million.

[buckeye242424]

No one really does but the rumor that he wanted an extension which obviously came from his agent included the info that he wanted an extension that would continue to pay him what he is making this season which i think is like 10 million.

He must be getting some bad advice, if he wants 10 mill. Not calling you wrong, but if his posse is thinking - after investing the farm to JJ, and wanting to sign Horf (which has to be priority #1 after Johnson) they're getting big bucks, they're way off base...

Craws best move is to play this year similar to the effort he gave last year and see where we stand record wise come the new year. If we're struggling, but he produces, he'll get paid. If we're

in the mix" and a team wants to trade players to dump $$$, playing well, he'll get paid. The worst thing he could do, at his age, is sulk and not give effort and play the way he still can.

[Gray Mule]

I understand him wanting the security of a long term contract.

He will make $10 Million this season. Would he sign a new contract that would pay him

a lot less but for several years? Take a cut, but have a longer contract. Gosh no, his agent

would have a fit if someone suggested a contract of say, 5 years - $30 Million.

It's all about $$$ and ego. Everything else is Bull Feathers.

You are under contract to play. Honor what you signed.

:stirthepot: :stirthepot:

Edited September 29, 2010 by Gray Mule

[Popeye]

You are under contract to play. Honor what you signed.

:stirthepot: :stirthepot:

Exactly gray!!!

[Diesel]

I like Crawford a lot but I'm just not digging this approach. He put in ONE good year with the franchise. While we won a few more games than the year before the bottom line was the same as the year before. Horrible second round exit. I don't see where this one year makes him deserving of special consideration by the franchise.

He sould see that extending his contract (and i'm guessing he wants a lot) doesn't make any business sense for the organization. If he recognizes that then he's just causing a distraction at this point. We'll see what it looks like when the season is starting.

MD, you can't deny his output. Nobody in the league can deny his output. When other players were having off years, Craw stepped up and he was the difference. Even in the playoffs. The point is this, he steppe up!!! We have guys on our team who don't step up at all and are considered to be "Core" players while a guy that wants to be here and wants to win and works hard at helping us win is only trade bait??

Yeah, that puts me in a weird space too.

I understand him wanting the security of a long term contract.

He will make $10 Million this season. Would he sign a new contract that would pay him

a lot less but for several years? Take a cut, but have a longer contract. Gosh no, his agent

would have a fit if someone suggested a contract of say, 5 years - $30 Million.

It's all about $$$ and ego. Everything else is Bull Feathers.

You are under contract to play. Honor what you signed.

:stirthepot: :stirthepot:

Sorry Grey but Craw has honored his contract, he is not a holdout so why talk to him like he was one?

I think this proves a point. So many of us see Craw as an outsider simply because we didn't draft him. When did being drafted give a player ultimate immunity? When did not being drafted by a team mean that you will never be a core player?

[Swatguy]

No one really does but the rumor that he wanted an extension which obviously came from his agent included the info that he wanted an extension that would continue to pay him what he is making this season which i think is like 10 million.

That does not mean he wants 10 mil/per. It means he wants to continue with x/per. I believe he will take 4/32 . He needs at least the investment due to Marvin.

Jamal has proved his worth, has earned an extention. He had the best season of All the players on this team.

[macdaddy]

As someone else said you don't give an extension based on past performance. Your contract should be based on future expectation. Here are the other points that many have made in other threads

- You can't deny his output on OFFENSE.

- Are we going to invest half the salary cap in 2 shooting guards?

- He worked hard at helping us win that's great. That's also what we paid him $10 million to do. We were a better team sure. But its not like he put us over the top. He has to realize that. We won six more games and exited the playoffs in embarrasing fashion.

- Correct. He is not a holdout but will he be? I hope not. But why go public with this at all? It creates a distraction. and don't claim that its not his camp putting out there that he wants an extension or a trade because that's bs. To me saying you want an extension or a trade is not honoring your contract

I love Jamal and would love to have him as a Hawk but he needs to understand that the Hawks are running a business and there is a lot working against him as far as getting a new contract.

[Diesel]

As someone else said you don't give an extension based on past performance. Your contract should be based on future expectation. Here are the other points that many have made in other threads

- You can't deny his output on OFFENSE.

- Are we going to invest half the salary cap in 2 shooting guards?

That's irrelevant. I can call Joe a Sf. In fact, Joe is closer to being a Sf than a SG.. If we were talking about bringing in Melo, what's that.... More than have the Salary Cap on a couple of 3s... If we were to bring in Kobe Bryant... would how much we spend matter?

- He worked hard at helping us win that's great. That's also what we paid him $10 million to do. We were a better team sure. But its not like he put us over the top. He has to realize that. We won six more games and exited the playoffs in embarrasing fashion.

Actually, it seems like we paid him 10 Million dollars to watch his contract end this year... in time to resign Horf. Be honest, that's the gameplan and has been the gameplan. Weather he played well and weather or not he proved to be a fit didn't matter. In fact, more than half of the board said that he was just an expensive replacement for Flip... and that he was a deal we couldn't pass up on because we got him for nothing.

Secondly, We won six more games in a season where our players from the previous seasons had worse outputs. Moreover, we had better team stats than the previous season. As you start to win more games, the number of wins you can gain year by year will start to become less and less. We are not set to win +20... But +6 from 47 wins is good. Not great. Not earth moving but good. You inspired me to look at all the 50 win teams in 2010 and compare their records with 2009... Here's what I found.

Atl = +6.

SA = -4

Dal = +5

Pho - +8

LAL = -8

Utah = +5

Nuggets = -1

PTL = -4

OKC = +27

Orl = 0

Cle = -5

Bos = -12

So there it is... Where does our +6 take us? Among 50 game winners, we are 3rd to Phoenix and OKC. Phoenix had a new coach take over.

-

[Sothron]

Michael Gearon Jr would be insane to give an extension to Crawford. His value is his expiring contract.

[Diesel]

Michael Gearon Jr would be insane to give an extension to Crawford. His value is his expiring contract.

When did 6th man of the year start meaning best expiring contract?

This is the difference between us and teams that continue to win. Teams that continue a winning tradition don't look at good players as trade bait. How many times have you seen the Lakers talking about Derek Fisher as a good expiring contract? Last year, Fish was an expiring worth 5 Million dollars. Do you think that they looked at one trade?

How about the Celtics and Ray Allen?

Allen was making 19.8 Million dollars and not playing like 19.8 Million dollars.. Do you think that they look at one trade?

However, when it comes to us, we're quick to push an expiring out the door for nothing.

[MaceCase]

I had always thought that Jamal was picked up for 3 reasons

1) Provide bench scoring for the 2009 team

2) Serve as either a replacement or a stopgap for Joe on the 2010 team

3) If Joe stayed, have his expiring accommodate for Al's new 2011 contract.

I don't know how anybody can disagree that was Sund's thinking all along and then go so far as to attribute all of our success to Jamal when, despite his career year, he still ranked 4th best outside of our actual core of Al, Smoove and Joe.

It is what it is, he is worried about being paid a lot and it's the why that is escaping some people. If he comes out and performs they way he did he is going to get paid regardless of CBA. You've seen a guy like Melo publicly saying he's not worried about it after sitting in on the initial CBA hearings and turn down a 20mil per year extension because he thinks the money will still be out there when his contract expires. So with that there's really no worry for Jamal of only being able to net a 1 million dollar contract after the next CBA unless, of course, he is unable to live up to the production he put up last season. That is the #1 factor that will effect how much he gets next year and with a new system that, in theory, will underemphasizes his strengths as a player there's no real secret as to why he wants a lucrative deal now rather than later.

[Diesel]

I had always thought that Jamal was picked up for 3 reasons

1) Provide bench scoring for the 2009 team

2) Serve as either a replacement or a stopgap for Joe on the 2010 team

3) If Joe stayed, have his expiring accommodate for Al's new 2011 contract.

I don't know how anybody can disagree that was Sund's thinking all along and then go so far as to attribute all of our success to Jamal when, despite his career year, he still ranked 4th best outside of our actual core of Al, Smoove and Joe.

It is what it is, he is worried about being paid a lot and it's the why that is escaping some people. If he comes out and performs they way he did he is going to get paid regardless of CBA. You've seen a guy like Melo publicly saying he's not worried about it after sitting in on the initial CBA hearings and turn down a 20mil per year extension because he thinks the money will still be out there when his contract expires. So with that there's really no worry for Jamal of only being able to net a 1 million dollar contract after the next CBA unless, of course, he is unable to live up to the production he put up last season. That is the #1 factor that will effect how much he gets next year and with a new system that, in theory, will underemphasizes his strengths as a player there's no real secret as to why he wants a lucrative deal now rather than later.

I agree with your three reasons why Sund picked him up.

However, I think at some point, we do need to recognize that he did bring something to the team and point 3 should be revisited and maybe revised.

Bottom line, I would rather move any combo of Marvin, Bibby, Zaza... in order to keep Jamal.

HE was our 4th best player and this was off the bench and like it or not, his contribution to the team is big. The money argument is a meaningless argument. What I mean by that is that it should not be used to determine if a player has value to our team.... It's a scarecrow.. a strawman. For instance, the same people who say that we don't have the money to resign Jamal are the same people who would give up 2 times as much to bring in Melo. When it comes to Melo, we say.. We'll do whatever it takes to get it done. My point is that we should have a similar attitude about Craw. The number 1 reason is because we know what kind of chemistry he would have with our team. Number 2 is because this guy genuinely wants to be here.