Dolf what's going on with your team?

[Admin]

Holy crap this had me laughing my ass off!

[Guest]

Thought I heard somewhere he took it to the GM and he told him to fight him?

Guess he's not a fighter.

Hmm...I do recall hearing something about that but I thought it was that the Coaches told Richie to "toughen up" Martin. I'm not sure I recall Martin going to a Coach about this, but I haven't stayed 100% on top of this story. So maybe Martin did make a good faith effort? I had the impression, for some reason, that he did not bring this to anyone's attention.

[Admin]

Hmm...I do recall hearing something about that but I thought it was that the Coaches told Richie to "toughen up" Martin. I'm not sure I recall Martin going to a Coach about this, but I haven't stayed 100% on top of this story. So maybe Martin did make a good faith effort? I had the impression, for some reason, that he did not bring this to anyone's attention.

That's a different rumor and we still don't know which coaches told him that. But even then unless they told Richie to harrass Martin and threaten him they aren't liable in my eyes for just telling him to toughen him up.

Until the facts come out on the case none of us will know whether Martin attempted to resolve this or not.

[Guest]

Until the facts come out on the case none of us will know whether Martin attempted to resolve this or not.

Now you're really starting to sound like me!

[Admin]

I know you guys hate Miko Grimes and I get that after some of the stuff she said, but right now she's supporting the Dolphins and her hubby is my favorite player on the D. Anyway these tweets are awesome and I have a feeling she's simply representing what the guys in the locker room feel.

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Now you're really starting to sound like me!

Them's fightin' words right there!

[EazyRoc]

Aren't you supposed to make a good faith effort to bring the harassment to a supervisor's attention before you go to litigation? This case sounds like Martin did not do this.

Yes you are and I agree it doesn't appear that he did. It could have happened and he could've been subjected to the "toughening up" as retaliation. However, the information out there states he didn't.

[EazyRoc]

Funny but Mike Singletary and Lawrence Taylor couldn't disagree with you more strongly and those are guys I'd consider as the types I'd want setting up my lockerroom environment. And I'd also say that football in fact is as strong of a brotherhood as military and college ball so yeah loyalty and brotherhood go hand in hand.

But yeah he looked like he was really suffering there laughing his fat lazy off Saturday during the Stanford - USC game. Nice to see the fans there enjoying how much of a baby he is.

Pro ball isn't like college ball or the military. USAF isn't going to trade you to UK during your deployment. He could have been traded the next day and would have dealt with the locker room BS. It makes me think it was more than normal because he played all the way up until now and had no issues with college teammates or he could be made about being demoted. However, he has no obligation to deal with whatever he dealt with for the sake of brotherhood because the NFL is a business first not an organization.

[Guest]

Yes you are and I agree it doesn't appear that he did. It could have happened and he could've been subjected to the "toughening up" as retaliation. However, the information out there states he didn't.

Yup pretty hard to say anything right now.

[Admin]

Barkley comments on this...

The Jonathan Martin thing is one of the more fascinating things Ive seen in my entire life, to be honest with you, Barkley said on Dan Patricks radio show. I dont understand if incognito was treating this kid bad why he texted him 1,500 times. I dont understand everybody on the team said theyre friends. I dont believe the general manager told one player to punch another player.I dont believe in the NBA wed let a guy get mistreated in the locker room. Did we give a guy a hard time? Of course we did. But I think if someone went over the line wed say something. So I dont know whats true now and whats not true.Barkley also said, I hear all these clowns talk on television about locker-room culture. First of all, We are rude, crude, sexist, racist, homophobic in a locker room. The stuff we have said (in a locker room) we cant say on your show. We cant say it in mixed company. We cant say at a dinner table. I miss that, giving each other a hard time. I do. I miss that.

[Guest]

Barkley tells it just like I've been thinking, although he is a little stronger on claims than I would be. He doesn't believe the GM told Martin to punch Richie, but I certainly think it's possible. Still hard to dismiss anything at this point.This does have the potential of really changing labor relations in sports, so no way this just disappears. The outcome is way more interesting to me than the actual details or who is at fault for what with this story.

[Admin]

I've heard some people say that the players associations won't allow drastic changes be made to locker room cultures no matter the outcome of this case. I don't know if I believe that, but the PAs in sports are pretty strong so who knows.

[AHF]

Aren't you supposed to make a good faith effort to bring the harassment to a supervisor's attention before you go to litigation? This case sounds like Martin did not do this.

Yes - you can have a claim against a company essentially blocked for failing to bring it to the Company's attention. His argument here would be that officials with the Dolfins were well aware this was going on and that a complaint would have fallen on deaf ears since they were essentially endorsing the behavior. That may be a viable argument based on the reports to date.

[Admin]

Yes - you can have a claim against a company essentially blocked for failing to bring it to the Company's attention. His argument here would be that officials with the Dolfins were well aware this was going on and that a complaint would have fallen on deaf ears since they were essentially endorsing the behavior. That may be a viable argument based on the reports to date.

The question is whom did he bring it up to, if he did at all. And did he go up the chain of command or even start at the bottom where he should have? Our head coach is one of the classiest men in football and I have no doubt that if he knew about this he would have done something about it. So if Martin simply told his OL coach and it died there, did he do what he needed to do in order to bring it to the company's attention?

And Dolfins? :ahf:

[AHF]

I've heard some people say that the players associations won't allow drastic changes be made to locker room cultures no matter the outcome of this case. I don't know if I believe that, but the PAs in sports are pretty strong so who knows.

They won't have any way of legally blocking change if that is what comes - they may be able to limit the discipline for people behaving this way but let's be real - the worst punishment is having this stuff go public. If this was Calvin Johnson, he would have already lost millions in endorsements even if he would have ended up with no punishment from the NFL.

With Barkley, I have no doubt he is shooting straight but also think he is overstating things (as is his tendency). The idea that no one ever gets bullied or ostracized in a locker room in light of what goes on there is just silly. Of course that happens in most areas where people are acting juvenile or immature - it definitely happens more frequently with a less educated and more "testosterone" driven work environment like construction sites,

Like you guys, I am particularly fascinated to see where this goes on a forward-looking basis - I could see this changing locker room culture going forward (not making it like a church or anything but incremental along the lines of Kobe getting fined for the gay slur and now Kobe recently knocking people on Twitter for using that same type of language). It could redraw the lines as far as what is out of bounds and sanitize things...in fact, I will be surprised if we don't see some of that at this point if for no other reason than people now will be aware that this stuff could end up going public.

[AHF]

The question is whom did he bring it up to, if he did at all. And did he go up the chain of command or even start at the bottom where he should have? Our head coach is one of the classiest men in football and I have no doubt that if he knew about this he would have done something about it. So if Martin simply told his OL coach and it died there, did he do what he needed to do in order to bring it to the company's attention?

And Dolfins?

Blame the phone for the typo - too much Dolfan!

If he told his OL coach, then he that probably satisfies what he needed to do to expose the company to liability unless the company is somehow going to try to argue that one of the coaches isn't a member of management. Once management is aware, then they are on notice and need to address it.

I think this case is stronger since you have reports of Incognito harassing others in and outside the organization. Seems like he was pretty public about it where it would not be hard to come up with examples around other Dolphin coaches or executives.

This case is just reminding me strongly of the New Orleans situation. You can bet people are a hell of a lot more careful after the Saints blow up about bounties, etc. and that seems like the sort of new awareness that is going to follow this blow up.

[Admin]

Blame the phone for the typo - too much Dolfan!

If he told his OL coach, then he that probably satisfies what he needed to do to expose the company to liability unless the company is somehow going to try to argue that one of the coaches isn't a member of management. Once management is aware, then they are on notice and need to address it.

I think this case is stronger since you have reports of Incognito harassing others in and outside the organization. Seems like he was pretty public about it where it would not be hard to come up with examples around other Dolphin coaches or executives.

This case is just reminding me strongly of the New Orleans situation. You can bet people are a hell of a lot more careful after the Saints blow up about bounties, etc. and that seems like the sort of new awareness that is going to follow this blow up.

I don't like comparing this to the New Orleans situation as that had coaches instructing players to injure other players. This appears to be an isolated thing between the offensive lineman and just 1 of them took offense to it. I know the media wants to make this a big deal and they try and spin the tiniest bits of rumors into a big thing and I imagine they will try and make sweeping changes around the league as to what's acceptable in a lockerroom but I have a hard time believing anything will really change. Not only that but I'd bet 99% of players around the league wouldn't want the change either, whereas the bounty thing was frowned upon league wide.

[AHF]

I don't like comparing this to the New Orleans situation as that had coaches instructing players to injure other players. This appears to be an isolated thing between the offensive lineman and just 1 of them took offense to it. I know the media wants to make this a big deal and they try and spin the tiniest bits of rumors into a big thing and I imagine they will try and make sweeping changes around the league as to what's acceptable in a lockerroom but I have a hard time believing anything will really change. Not only that but I'd bet 99% of players around the league wouldn't want the change either, whereas the bounty thing was frowned upon league wide.

I am comparing not because of the particular facts (which really aren't in at this point). I am comparing it in that there is an ugly situation which is usually kept quiet within a team that has come to light in a very public way. Now behavior which shocks the public but which is common to a significant number of teams is being dragged out into the public consciousness but being done so in a way that makes it look like this was an isolated issue unique to Miami/NO.

I actually do think there will be some change coming from this -- especially if Incognito finds he is out of work at the end of the day. Players may very well cut out some of the most outrageous behavior with awareness of the potential of being exposed if they are sending (to use Barkley's words) racist, homophobic, and sexist things to eachother in an easily traceable form. I don't expect it will turn lockerrooms into board rooms but you might find a bit of a filter being put on like the rest of us do (although not to the extent we do) when we go from certain social situations where that is a part of the culture to a work environment where that wouldn't be tolerated.

Edited December 2, 2013 by AHF

[HawkItus]

http://deadspin.com/investigation-finds-pattern-of-harassment-in-miami-1522833437

This doesn't look good @Dolfan .....might be some more suspensions coming down the pike.

Edited February 14, 2014 by sultanofatl

[AHF]

I think the assistant coach, Turner, might look worse than Incognito given his higher level of responsibility.

[Ruckus]

I bet Dolphins pick Michael Sam in the upcoming draft. What do ya say?